Andreas Jung wrote:
> Zope 2.8 ships/shipped with Five 1.0 which is very old and no longer 
> actively maintained. Most ppl doing currently development with Zope 
> 2.8 are using Five 1.2. Should we upgrade the Five version in Zope 
> 2.8 to Five 1.2 to make their lives a bit easier? There is possibly a
> compatiblity problem involved and it is against the general rule for
> major upgrades of a package or product for a minor Zope release..I 
> have no opinion on this issue...I just had this thought....

I would be in favour of such a move, because as a Five developer I'm
biased (so my vote doesn't really count, either). Either way, this would
let us officially drop support for Five 1.0.x which we've neglected
anyhow when it came to bugfixes, because it's just so unmaintainable.
Plus, as Andreas mentions, most people are using Five 1.2 anyways
because it provides the same featureset as the Five version shipping
with Zope 2.9; that way people can make products that both on Zope 2.8
and 2.9.

However, there are implications of this change. To give people an idea
of what they're bargaining for, here are the changelog entries for the
two most important changes between Five 1.0 and 1.2:

* Zope 3-style i18n support has been provided.  Apart from being able
  to register translations through ZCML, Five now lets Zope 2 ZPTs
  automatically use Zope 3 translation domains.  Fallback to an
  old-style translation service (e.g. Localizer or PTS) is supported.
  This also includes the detection of preferred languages.  See
  ``doc/i18n.txt`` for more information.

* Event support: When ``<five:containerEvents/>`` is specified, Five
  makes the standard Zope 2 containers send events instead of using
  manage_afterAdd, manage_beforeDelete and manage_afterClone. These
  methods are still called for a class declared
  ``<five:deprecatedManageAddDelete class=.../>``, and are called in
  compatibility mode with a deprecation warning for classes that don't
  use this directive.

These are two *features* that Five would introduce to the Zope 2 core
(it did so for Zope 2.9 in fact because Five 1.3 is part of that).
People should be aware of that and consider this in their vote.

If we indeed decide to include Five 1.2 in Zope 2.8, we will have to fix
it up a little so that it fits in nicely into the Zope 2 tree. I'll be
happy to do that work.

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