On Mar 23, 2007, at 4:12 AM, Baiju M wrote:

Christian Theune wrote:

Hi,

we (Jim, Nathan, Michael and me) did some planning on how we're going to release Zope 3.4 and the future Zope 3 releases that are based on eggs.

I tried to catch up and did my writing here:
http://wiki.zope.org/zope3/DefiningZope34Release

There is also a project in the repository in Zope3.buildout that tries
to implement the proposal and is a work in progress that doesn't work
right now.


I think we need not to mimic the zpkg based release for 3.4, rather we should use zpkg for this release also.

Minor note:

No one is talking about "mimicking" a zpkg release. The plan was to switch from using zpkg to eggs to create releases. Unfortunately, I don't think we have time to do this now, although I think we are getting close. :(

Because,
- there is no particular advantage for mimicking zpkg based release using zc.buildout

If the purpose of the release is purely political, then I agree.

 - we are gradually moving towards an egg based releases
 - applications are better to build using zc.buildout
- our 3.4 alpha 1 release date is approaching, we follow time- based release !

Is there a roadmap somewhere?

It seems that something should be recorded at:

  http://wiki.zope.org/zope3/Downloads

Who is in charge of the 3.4 release?

(And our policy is to drop a feature, if it's not ready at time, is it?)

Yup.

In addition to this zpkg based release, we can release all eggs (as mentioned in the proposal) and make it
available for download from a location.

I think these 2 activities should not be linked. Perhaps this should be a goal of 3.5 release.

I want to get to the point where the packages have their own release cycles independent of Zope 3 releases. For example, I want to stop giving eggs 3.x releases numbers just because the package
was included in a 3.x release.

Assuming that someone decides to move forward with 3.4 release sans eggification, then I'd like to decouple the 3.4 release from the eggification efforts.

I think we are going to stop current way of releasing Zope 3 sooner or later, so we should advocate the use of
eggs and zc.buildout for building and deploying Zope 3 applications.

Yup, but I don't think we're there yet. What we have now, thanks to your effort and efforts of others, is a proof of concept. There are lots of issues that need to be addressed before we can move this effort off of the bleeding edge, including:

- We need more mature eggs that we have now. Many of our eggs aren't ready for independent release. Dependencies are a mess and I think it's going to take a good bit of work to clean the dependencies up.

- We need to figure out what the distribution mechanism will be.

- PyPI in it's current form is less than ideal, in at least a couple of ways:

      - It is too slow.

- It's default policy of hiding old distributions makes it impractical to specify specific distributions in buildouts for repeatability.

Both of these problems can be fixed, but it will take a bit of effort. I have necessary access, but not sufficient time. I'm most worried about support for old versions and I think this can be addressed through a planned setuptools change.

   - I worry that download.zope.com/distribution is too uncontrolled.

Jim

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