The BMW UUC Digest Volume 2 : Issue 664 : "text" Format Messages in this Issue: Re: BMW's Machine to Convert Loyalty to Disillusionment Re: e90 - new oil program Re: e90 - new oil program Re: e90 - new oil program Re: e90 - new oil program Re: e90 - new oil program Re: BMW's Machine to Convert Loyalty to Disillusionment Re: BMW's Machine to Convert Loyalty to Disillusionment Re: How to retain brake heat Re: How to retain brake heat Re: How to retain brake heat E34 Closet Cleaning Sale Re: e90 - new oil program <FS> 2002 M5 F1 Canada Tickets
---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 19 May 2005 10:49:18 -0400 From: "Rob Levinson * UUC Motorwerks" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com> Subject: Re: BMW's Machine to Convert Loyalty to Disillusionment Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To be completely fair, the iDrive system is designed to be used the same way - set everything up ahead of time and control it via voice commands. I'm not defending it, just pointing out that it's a fundamental paradigm shift in user interface whose intent was to make things simpler, but perhaps part of the failure is the dealership's lack of customer training. That, of course, begs the point that a car's interfaces should be nearly universal, that getting into any new car should not pose "problems" compared to one within 10 years old. What irks me about the E90's iDrive is that it is integrated with the nav system - if you want nav, you must get iDrive. That smells suspiciously like Microsoft's integrated browser silliness. - Rob ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis Wynne" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > get it? The BMW interface engineers should each be given one of the new > Acura RLs to drive for a while. What a > nice system and fully integrated and within minutes it is simple to use. To > bad it is in a $50k v-6 with a small back > seat. BTW, if nothing else in the RL you can say "FM 100 point 1" and get > the station without taking your hands off > the wheel. > > Dennis > 01 M5 silver/black (for sale) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 May 2005 10:56:06 -0400 From: "Dennis Liu" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com>, "'Norm Reini'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: e90 - new oil program Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Gary wrote: >Its a combination of oil technology and engine technology. I know many people who never check their dipsticks. The oil lever indicator works pretty well, until it fails. ________________ FWIW, Porsche introduced a digital oil level gauge with the 996. After decades of notoriously inaccurate readings with the old mechanical gauge (it was accurate only when warm, level, and at idle; responsible for thousands of panicked calls to dealers and messages to Rennlist from new owners), Porsche now wants owners to rely almost entirely on the digital gauge. It's pretty damn accurate, certainly easier to use and read, compared to trying to check fresh synthetic on a yellow dipstick. On the 996 twin turbo, there isn't even a dipstick - you're told to rely on the gauge. The system is pretty nifty; it has a built in timer, and will tell you when it's accurate and properly measuring. I check the gauge against the dipstick, and it's been dead-on every time. Oh, another FWIW - the 355 has a very nice metal dipstick, easy to use and read. The only problem is that, for style reasons, Ferrari attached the dipstick to a gorgeous aluminum cap, complete with an etched Prancing Horse on it. Of course, being a dry-sump engine, you have to check the oil level with the motor hot (and immediately after shutting it off). See the problem? I wonder how many owners have a reverse prancing horse etched into the palm of their hand, a la the Nazi in "Raiders of the Lost Ark". vty, --Dennis / ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 May 2005 13:02:58 -0400 From: "Bill Matthews" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com> Subject: Re: e90 - new oil program Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis Liu" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com>; "'Norm Reini'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Thursday, May 19, 2005 10:56 AM Subject: Re: [UUC] e90 - new oil program > Gary wrote: > >>Its a combination of oil technology and engine technology. I know many > people who never check their dipsticks. The oil lever indicator works > pretty well, until it fails. > > ________________ > > FWIW, Porsche introduced a digital oil level gauge with the 996. After > decades of notoriously inaccurate readings with the old mechanical gauge > (it > was accurate only when warm, level, and at idle; responsible for thousands > of panicked calls to dealers and messages to Rennlist from new owners), > Porsche now wants owners to rely almost entirely on the digital gauge. > It's > pretty damn accurate, certainly easier to use and read, compared to trying > to check fresh synthetic on a yellow dipstick. On the 996 twin turbo, > there > isn't even a dipstick - you're told to rely on the gauge. The system is > pretty nifty; it has a built in timer, and will tell you when it's > accurate > and properly measuring. I check the gauge against the dipstick, and it's > been dead-on every time. > Wife's W209 chassis CLK320 has no dipstick, just a procedure you are suppose to go through on the info screen about two menus down that gives you a OK/Not OK on oil level. The procedure is ridiculous because you have to be able to find it on the menu and you have to wait 60 seconds after shutting off the car before it will give you a reading. It drives me crazy and basically have decided that when it's low on oil it will either warn me or the engine will break and I'm not going to worry which it is. The MB forum I'm on had a hack that would let you get continuous oil level readings in Liters on the output screen (in the center of the speedometer). An interesting exercise (once) to do that and then drive around watching the reading vary as you cornered stopped etc. Bill Matthews ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 May 2005 13:14:03 -0400 From: "Dennis Liu" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com> Subject: Re: e90 - new oil program Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Bill wrote: >Wife's W209 chassis CLK320 has no dipstick, just a procedure you are suppose to go through on the info screen about two menus down that gives you a OK/Not OK on oil level. The procedure is ridiculous because you have to be able to find it on the menu and you have to wait 60 seconds after shutting off the car before it will give you a reading. It drives me crazy and basically have decided that when it's low on oil it will either warn me or the engine will break and I'm not going to worry which it is. ______________ Well, chalk one up for Porsche. Every time you turn the ignition to "on", the oil level display comes up with a little 5 second count-down timer (presumably the level check needs five seconds to calibrate itself or somesuch?). If the level is fine, it disappears after you start the engine, and becomes the clock. If the level is irregular, then it stays on the display to remind you to do something about it.... vty, --Dennis . ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 May 2005 13:16:48 -0400 (EDT) From: "Steve.Goldstein" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com Subject: Re: e90 - new oil program Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Gary Derian wrote (among other things): >Engine sensors also can sense the actual oil condition these days. Way true! I saw a presentation just a couple of weeks ago about a system that uses an in-oil sensor along with some fancy electronics to directly measure some oil parameters. This allows the computer to determine when the oil actually needs changing because of contaminants, breakdown, etc. Sorry, but I can't say which company is developing this. Of course, the point still remains that auto manufacturers are in the business of selling cars. It's definitely in their interest to have the motor outlast the warranty period, and probably in their interest to have that life extend well past the end of warranty, but 300k miles? I doubt it. Even with this technology available I'll change my oil more frequently than the computer says. steve ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 May 2005 13:33:18 -0400 From: "Rob Levinson * UUC Motorwerks" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com> Subject: Re: e90 - new oil program Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve.Goldstein" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Of course, the point still remains that auto manufacturers are in > the business of selling cars. It's definitely in their interest to > have the motor outlast the warranty period, and probably in their > interest to have that life extend well past the end of warranty, > but 300k miles? I doubt it. I still think that's the most foolish mistake that many car makers are making right now; most first-time new-car shoppers are stepping out of older cars, some hand-me-downs or just purchased on a budget. If I had a Brand X car that I bought used because it was all I could afford and it was unreliable, then Brand X would be the last company I would consider when I left school/got a job/won the lottery/inherited the Trump fortune and was looking at new cars. The Japanese built their reputation in the USA on reliability long past warranty. In fact, it wasn't more than 10 years ago that Toyota used to advertise about "Toyota families" that passed their older models down the line to the kids while the parents bought new Toyotas. The "get 'em now, forget tomorrow" design and marketing strategy is short-sighted and has just about destroyed the concept of "brand loyalty". - Rob ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 May 2005 08:08:32 -0700 From: donna seeley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com> Subject: Re: BMW's Machine to Convert Loyalty to Disillusionment Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> You can do that in the 7 also - the voice command button is on the steering wheel. iDrive isn't normally used while driving. Like Rob said, it's for setting your preferences. I didn't find some of the menus intuitive but it only took me an hour with the owner's manual to get comfortable with all the cabin controls - much less than I expected. That said, it shouldn't take 15 minutes to tell a friend how to drive your new car; that's too much like lending an old car with "quirks." A customer came in to test drive a Z4 and asked what it would be like compared to his 320i. I told him, "It will handle like a BMW, and the gas filler cap is in the same place. Everything else is different." :) Donna former sales/service slime On 5/19/05 6:00 AM, "Dennis Wynne" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: <snip> The BMW interface engineers should each be given one of the new > Acura RLs to drive for a while. What a > nice system and fully integrated and within minutes it is simple to use. To > bad it is in a $50k v-6 with a small back > seat. BTW, if nothing else in the RL you can say "FM 100 point 1" and get > the station without taking your hands off > the wheel. > > Dennis > 01 M5 silver/black (for sale) > > At 09:06 PM 05/18/2005 -0400, you wrote: >> Neil Maller wrote: >>> Here's an interesting little article about user interface >>> design I stumbled over that discusses the 7's iDrive: >>> http://www.useit.com/alertbox/20040315.html >> >> Interesting. As technology improves and becomes more of a commodity, >> usability will become more of a discriminator between products. Ability to >> design an intuitive user interface will become a lucrative skill. BMW iDrive >> may serve as a good example of how NOT to introduce a new product. >> >> Dave Meyer >> 99 M coupe (traditional user interface) >> Stafford VA >> >> Search the ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 May 2005 11:12:07 -0400 From: "Rob Levinson * UUC Motorwerks" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com> Subject: Re: BMW's Machine to Convert Loyalty to Disillusionment Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Well, that problem is SMG. - Rob ----- Original Message ----- From: "donna seeley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > That said, it shouldn't take 15 minutes to tell a friend how to drive your > new car; that's too much like lending an old car with "quirks." ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 May 2005 08:18:38 -0700 (PDT) From: P Kroon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: UUC Digest <bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com> Subject: Re: How to retain brake heat Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> While on the topic of caliper heat dispersion, any thoughts on the heat retention of painted calipers? I assume that it isn't much since many of the hi-end calipers are painted. -Paul 96 328i 03 G35 98 Panoz AIV --- Eric Benjamin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Next thing you know they'll provide hot air intakes > and pre-greased tires! > > Eric-->getting used to my new V8 rice/toaster/car, > but it doesn't have > caliper covers...yet;-) > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Marco Romani" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: <bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com> > Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 11:42 PM > Subject: [UUC] How to retain brake heat > > > > For all those times your calipers just don't warm > up enough > > > > http://tuner01.com/products.htm > > > > <sigh> > > > > Marco > > Search the > ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com > > > > > > > __________________________________________________________________________ > > In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, > founder of the BMW CCA. > > > > UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and > home of the Ultimate > > Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! > > 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com > > > > > Search the > ARCHIVES:http://www.mail-archive.com/bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com > > > __________________________________________________________________________ > In memory of Michel Potheau - friend, enthusiast, > founder of the BMW CCA. > > UUC Motorwerks - BMW Performance Fine-tuning and > home of the Ultimate > Short Shifter - accept no substitutes! > 908-874-9092 . http://www.uucmotorwerks.com > Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and more. Check it out! http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 May 2005 10:19:16 -0500 From: Neil Maller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com" <bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com> Subject: Re: How to retain brake heat Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> on 5/19/05 9:01 AM, "Marco Romani" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > For all those times your calipers just don't warm up enough > http://tuner01.com/products.htm > <sigh> Way too low tech. I'm holding out for the electrically heated version. Neil Fort Wayne, IN 96 M3 - Bastard child 03 525iT - Sterling Grey Metallic 77 MGB - Original owner, need to sell 05 Mini - Cooper S with LSD! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 May 2005 11:36:59 -0400 From: "Gerry Low" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Neil Maller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com> Subject: Re: How to retain brake heat Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Neil, You will need a very long extension cord. Gerry -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Neil Maller Sent: Thursday, May 19, 2005 11:19 AM To: bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com Subject: Re: [UUC] How to retain brake heat Way too low tech. I'm holding out for the electrically heated version. Neil -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 266.11.12 - Release Date: 5/17/2005 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 May 2005 12:01:05 -0400 From: "Eric Nghiem" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com> Subject: E34 Closet Cleaning Sale Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I was rummaging though the garage and closet and found a few parts that are taking up room. I'm also parting out a 1990 525I if anyone is looking for stuff... Check out the link here for more information: http://cgi3.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewUserPage&userid=dynamic_e I have ellipsoids, cluster, shift stuff and more. Thanks for the WOB! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 May 2005 10:31:31 -0500 From: Neil Maller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com" <bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com> Subject: Re: e90 - new oil program Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> on 5/19/05 9:01 AM, "Gary Derian" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Its a combination of oil technology and engine technology. I know many > people who never check their dipsticks. The oil lever indicator works > pretty well, until it fails. Many tests have shown that 15,000 mile oil > change intervals are just fine, although I don't push my oil that far. 7500 > to 10,000 seems a good interval for synthetic. It's an interesting question though, now that factory paid/recommended oil service intervals have been extended out to 15K. For instance my Mini Cooper S only hold 4 qts of oil and there's no possible way that it'll go 15K miles without topping up, several times. (Not that I'll be going that long before changing the oil.) In the "old days" with shorter change intervals and engines that may have held more oil, even a negligent owner would almost certainly make it through to the next interval without the oil level getting low enough to cause a major problem. There was a thread on one of the Mini forums yesterday about an owner lunching his engine when it ran very low on oil. Not surprisingly Mini refused to cover it, even though the car was still under warranty. For most of us checking the dipstick is probably second nature - Right? Right?? - but for non-tech owners that may not be so. It seems to me that manufacturers would now be well advised to install oil level warning lights even on low priced cars in order to face up to the issues posed by 15K service intervals. Neil Fort Wayne, IN 96 M3 - Bastard child 03 525iT - Sterling Grey Metallic 77 MGB - Original owner, need to sell 05 Mini - Cooper S with LSD! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 May 2005 10:44:33 -0500 From: "Alex Cagann" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "BMW List" <bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com> Subject: <FS> 2002 M5 Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Greetings all. I have an M5 for sale. It's an 02 with 54k miles. Black on black, has the nappa lux interior (not the two tone), new tires and OE mats. Has park distance, nav, split rear seats, premium sound, etc. No accident history, very good condition, especially the interior (looks brand new everywhere). First $43,000 takes it. Alex ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 May 2005 14:50:52 -0400 From: "Alan Polo" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: bmwuucdigest@uucdigest.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: F1 Canada Tickets Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sorry if this has alredy been covered. Does anyone know a contact at BMW Canada that I can buy F1 ticket packages from? Any info would be great. Thanks -Alan ------------------------------ End of [bmwuucdigest] digest(15 messages) **********
