True, June,
It was God's plan to begin with...
I merely added
that the APOSTLES never blamed Rome for the incident,
but always looked to the Pharisees as the culprits, as so do I agree.
I said nothing more and meant nothing less.
Some people always choose to make a mountain out of a molehill...
rather than looking into the simplicity of an event or situation.
So is the case here. The focus here on this list,
was taken off the subject and placed
where people wanted it to be placed, on the Romans...
it is SIMPLY not the way I see it.
TRUTH: The Pharisees wanted absolutely NO connection to the death of
Jesus, looking much farther down the line of history than most give them
credit. They were concerned with their ''image'' to the people. Stoning
Jesus, which as you sited, could have been done and Rome would have done
nothing... however, the people would have ended up stoning them. The
fact of the matter is had the Pharisees stoned Jesus, this eventually this
would have drug them into the fate of Jesus at one time or another
historically. The ROMANS had to be their ALIBI, and so it is. The
Talmudic Jews ALWAYS have an alibi for everything they do... even to this
day, because of WHO they are...
Jesus pointed this out many, many times, and is why he called them liars,
vipers, and hypocrits to name a few choice descriptions.
eagle 1
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ynr Chyldz Wyld" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Sunday, June 25, 2000 8:06 AM
Subject: Re: [CTRL] Talmud Exposed
> From: "Eagle 1" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > May I add...
> > Jesus was rejected by the Pharisees' temple cult of darkness.
>
> True. But that then does not translate into:
>
>
> > Regardless
> > of how many may try, no one will ever be able to apply this
> identification
> > of the overspreading of the abomination desolation over the Temple
> and
> > Jerusalem to anyone else. Jesus was crucified by these same ones who
> took
> > Him. (Luke 22:52-54)
>
> Regardless of how you try to put the sole blame for Jesus' crucifixion
> on the Pharisees, it doesn't change the FACT that crucifixion could
> only be done by the Roman state. The Pharisees themselves would have
> been crucified for trying to crucify someone, because that would have
> been seen as a treasonable usurption of Rome's authority.
>
> If it was just a matter of wishing to be rid of Jesus, the Pharisees
> could have easily had Him stoned to death. Rome would have not
> interfered.
>
>
> > The Romans were trapped into this murder by
> > the Sanhedrin and coercing Pilate with threats of reporting him to
> Rome for
> > allowing another man in the Roman Empire to be called a King.
>
> It would have taken more than that. There had previously been dozens
> of Jewish prophets who claimed to be 'The Messiah' (and had hundreds of
> followers who believed them), and had never caused Rome any worry.
>
> You have to ask yourself WHY, if the Pharisees could have easily had
> Jesus stoned to death without Rome ever blinking an eye, they needed to
> 'coerce' (to use your own terminology) Rome into condemning Jesus to a
> manner of death solely reserved for those found guilty of high crimes
> and misdemeanors against ROME.
>
> You have to ask yourself WHY the Pharisees were suddenly able to
> 'coerce' Rome in this matter, when normally they had little say or sway
> with or over Rome...
>
>
> > The Romans
> > were never blamed by the Apostles for the death of Jesus.
>
> We have no idea what the apostles actually said in this matter, since
> we have no direct writings from any of them, only what was written
> decades later, after most of them were dead. Add to that the FACT that
> the western Christian church later became entrenched in Rome, and
> styled itself on the old pagan Roman empire, complete with a 'senate'
> (council of bishops) and a 'caesar' (the pope), and it isn't surprising
> that its cronies who later sat and decided what should and shouldn't be
> included in the Bible had a vested interest in removing as many
> negative references to Rome as possible...and had a vested interest to
> assign 'blame' solely to the Jews, and remove all blame from Rome...
>
> But no one's yet answered my question: what does it matter WHO is
> responsible? The whole reason for Jesus' existence was to be betrayed
> and to die a horrible death as a sacrifice to atone for our collective
> sins; in other words, He wasn't destined to live to a ripe old age and
> die of natural causes, because such a life and death would have
> rendered His existence meaningless.
>
> Whomever is to be 'blamed' for condemning Jesus, they were just
> enacting the plan already laid out by God.
>
> So Judas, the Pharisees, and Rome itself were all integral actors in
> God's grand theatrical event.
>
> If you seek to assign 'blame' for Jesus' death, look to God Himself,
> since it was His plan to begin with.
>
>
> June
>
.
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