Cesar, Driving R from Pharo - interesting!! But I digress.
I am indeed looking at internal/external debates as a statement on priorities, and I believe FFI/Alien/os-threads/callbacks[*] should be given a very high priority. Stef clearly wants the core to be simple, and I have no desire to hobble him in that effort. A compromise there would be to have FFI and friends in Pharo, not necessarily in the core. Bill [*] From what I am reading, Alien is not so good at making calls to functions. FFI has little/no sense of callbacks, and I'm not sure that either will do anything like Dolphin's overlapped calls, which allows functions to be called from separate OS threads. The latter is critical to making things that can defend themselves against code that hangs. Don't tell me that shouldn't happen :) A hang can be as simple as something that does not return as quickly as a user had hoped; it can be as functional as using OS threads to allow OpenSSL to attempt a blocking connect w/o taking down the entire image, etc. -----Original Message----- From: pharo-project-boun...@lists.gforge.inria.fr [mailto:pharo-project-boun...@lists.gforge.inria.fr] On Behalf Of csra...@bol.com.br Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2010 2:56 PM To: Pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] FFI in 1.1 <blatant warning> Due the way I envisage using Pharo I have stakes in these matter¹. Please read with a grain of salt. </blatant warning> I think the 'interpretation' of Stef's question is being different from person to person. The issue Wilhelm brings it seems to me more of "what priority we give to have FFI working". Putting it as part of core IMHO has more chances of having it prioritized as we think in the release of 1.1 that if we leave it as a package, because it may be still broken and 1.1 may be called ready for shipping. I also do agree that FFI is infrastructure and as such has to be seen as core, and since the ability to have Pharo more useful depends on the possibility to use a lot of code we are not able (in some case even not willing to) to rewrite in Pharo Smalltalk, I vote to have it as default and strive to have it working as soon as possible. my 0.01999... -- Cesar Rabak [1] If you're curious, I'm interested in seeing R http://www.r-project.org/ working with Pharo (at least as Martin Rubi's smallRApi for Dolphin) Em 20/04/2010 10:15, Mariano Martinez Peck < marianop...@gmail.com > escreveu: 2010/4/20 Schwab,Wilhelm K <bsch...@anest.ufl.edu> Mariano, FFI, use of OS threads and callbacks are *very* basic needs that we should support. IMHO, we should be focused on making them work, not on classifying what is internal or external. But is has nothing to do with what Stef asked: "Do we add FFI by default in 1.1?" In my opinion, it shouldn't be by default. However, this doesn't mean that we don't support FFI. And I am not saying to focus in internal or external. I just answer Stef question with my opinion. Cheers Mariano Bill From: pharo-project-boun...@lists.gforge.inria.fr [mailto:pharo-project-boun...@lists.gforge.inria.fr] On Behalf Of Mariano Martinez Peck Sent: Monday, April 19, 2010 9:49 PM To: Pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr Subject: Re: [Pharo-project] FFI in 1.1 On Thu, Apr 15, 2010 at 9:31 PM, Stéphane Ducasse <stephane.duca...@inria.fr> wrote: Hi all Do we add FFI by default in 1.1? Noooooooooo!!! I wouldn't include neither FFI or Alien FFI in neither PharoCore or PharoDev image. FFI is an EXTERNAL package, NOT core, neither a dev tool. That's only my opinion. Cheers Mariano This was the plan so. Stef _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list Pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list Pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list Pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list Pharo-project@lists.gforge.inria.fr http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
