Re: [abcusers] ps viewer on windows?
you can d/l eventually only GhostScript, GhostView is not really needed, but it's much more conveniant to use in addition to GS. advertisement If you need only a really minimal package (only 3.2 Mb) you can try this : http://anamnese.online.fr/abc/abcghost.html (and curse MSDOS commands for its stupid beaviour and limitations in comparison to Unix commands) /advertisement ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] ABC as Tablature
More significantly, tab needs a sound previewer even more than ABC does. A PostScript generator alone is just going to lead to lots of beautifully typeset nonsense. no, similar in a way to abc2midi and yaps, tab can generate both midi and postscript. tab filename generate a ps file, while tab -midi filename generate a midi file. moreover, tab2abc can convert from tab to abc format : http://www.lautengesellschaft.de/cdmm/ ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] ABC as Tablature (2)
I forget to say also, TablEdit http://www.tabledit.com/, can use ABC, and Wayne Cripps' tab, and is available for mswindows and macOs X ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] ABC as Tablature
Hello, I agree the site (http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute/AboutTab.html) is not really user friendly because you can only get the sources, and maybe (but I'm not sure) the binaries from the ftp site, in a folder that has disappeared now. I think the MSwindows binaries were available, and since the author assumed a very old version runs on Macintosh Power PC platforms. It's probably possible to get this binary file. Even if you do try, the source code of a program can rarely be compiled on a new platform without some tweaking. as far as Abcm2ps is concerned, it needs no tweaking at all to compile for mswindows or linux, you just have to type make But it's true for some other applications it can be much more tricky I wouldn't say an application is available for the average user unless there is a ready-made and *tested* version of it for the OS he/she is using. It's true most programmers consider it's a piece of cake to compile, and even if it's not really difficult when you have the makefile, it's often long and annoying for normal user to get a compiler, especially for MSwindows users (average C compiler need to download at least 50 Mb of packages). I don't understand why they can't provide at least some old binaries to make their prg more accessible, and update them from time to time (not necesssary with each release). I managed to get a compiler for myself and look how to compile because of this especially. org message : I see your point Eric, but it seems to me you're making a mistake that seems to be a bit too common here: You assume that the average computer user is able to take a C script, run it through a compiler and get a working program right away. This list is heavily dominated by computer programmers, and I suppose for them this kind of things are all in a day's work. The very concept of compiling a program is alien to the vast majority of computer users. Unless you already have some experience in this, you would need quite some self-confidence and a rather desperat need for *that* particular application before you even starts considering going through it all. Even if you do try, the source code of a program can rarely be compiled on a new platform without some tweaking. So sorry, Eric. Although I suppose many of the programmers here will disagree, I wouldn't say an application is available for the average user unless there is a ready-made and *tested* version of it for the OS he/she is using. Frank Nordberg http://www.musicaviva.com ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] ABC as Tablature
I've noticed it, but since it's not cross-platform compatible, it's pretty useless as a *standard* format. Nice idea, though. ? not cross platform compatible ??? The sources are provided, so you just have to get a C++ compiler and compile them on your machine. So I guess even on Atari it can be compiled and used. The output is in PS, so everyone can view them... It's even written how to use it for : tab on linux and unix tab on Mac OSX tab on Windows tab by mail ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] Re: abcm2ps and 'extras'
Hello, I've tried your code with the latest ghostscript / gv, but
it seems it doesn't work. Do you have a postscript / pdf output of
what it should display ?
about %%postscript, if I'm not mistaken, it's adding pure ps
command to your output, while %%deco will interact the abc file
with those ps commands
Anyway, if anyone is interested, here's what I came up with:
%%postscript /roll1{ % usage: x y roll1
%%postscript M 3 6 RM 10 4 RL 0 -2 RL -10 -4 RL fill}!
%%postscript /roll2{% usage: x y roll2
Please, feel free to comment, and/or improve on my code or
macros!
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Re: [abcusers] Floating voices
Sorry to disagree here but if you wish to add long barlines
between group of staves, I'd suggest to use a different symbol
than | .
In the way how abcm2ps presently works, I didn't find a pb using |
to separate staves, but now it seems a bit strange to use | which
means separation (separation of notes in bar also) when this
barline between staves means the staves are in group, so it's
rather an union.
So if you don't like using a bar and prefer to change this logical
notation anyway, why not using instead of %%staves {1 2 | 3 4} for
a separation, %%staves {1 2 - 3 4} ?
Given Bernard's statement, and that we are proposing
incompatibilities anyway, I would propose that you
only use a line if you _DO_ want barlines between
staves. In other words, the default is not to join
staves, but you can put a line between if you want
barlines.
Seems like a sensible idea. Do others agree?
Seems obvious.
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[abcusers] package for abcm2ps, abc2midi ghostscript and pdf conversion for partitions
I've created a package for making the use of abcm2ps and abc2midi easier for MSwindows users. You can find this here : http://anamnese.online.fr/abc/abcghost.html (it's freeware of course) The size for this installer is 3.2 Mb, and it contains Abc2midi, Abcm2ps, an old version of GhostScript for displaying the ps files resulting from abcm2ps, and a very easy to use laucher. It's rather small in comparison to what a normal download of GhostScript / GhostView would require. Moreover, it doesn't require further configuration because it is meant to be for computer beginners. When installed, after two menu selections you'll be able to create from an abc source a nice pdf file of the partition. It can be used with JedAbc for edition of the sources. I hope it may help many abc users to discover those great free softwares, if they believed before it was a pain to configure / install all those applications. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] abcghost bug
I apologize if someone has already tried this abcghost package I talked about this morning, I changed a last thing before releasing it and a bug occured that prevent to display and convert to pdf. I've uploaded a correct version and a patch at : http://anamnese.online.fr/abc/abcghost.html http://anamnese.online.fr/abc/AbcGhost_update.exe ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] Re: About the choice of '!'
Changing abcm2ps to use *...* instead of !...! (it accepts ! for a linebreak already) would be a matter of minutes work for Jef. Changing ABC2Win is not possible. no, we don't ask people to change their way of notation or Abc2Win to be improved or conform to anything : !-for-line-break addicts could still use it, and !...!-for-decoration addicts could do the same, with in addition the use of *-for-line-break for the use of the laters, so they . It's just a matter of tastes and every sect wants to keep its '!', and personnaly if it's not really a problem for using for ex. +...+ for decoration I don't find *...* for deco readable, and like most of the !...! sect I find !...! still more readable for this purpose, so I don't wish it to be changed. So this way, by allowing !, !...! and *=!, everyone would be happy, and I don't know the reason why this thread lasts so long. Maybe some fear in Abc 5.0 this !-for-line-break may disappear ? ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] About the choice of '!'
Let's see; if I read this correctly, then in the line: ...|!dead!trill!beef|... the !dead! would be the decoration, and the staff break would come in the middle of the bar. Right? Good point, but generally people who are using one system (who belong to the abc2win sect for ex., or in the opposite to the abcm2ps sect) won't use the other one. A couple of other people have given examples like this /.../ But if we include both in the standard, we can assume that people and programs will soon start using both, I thought with the new standard the ! as line break was supposed to be still supported for backward compatibility, and only tolerated, with advice to avoid to use both, or to use with care. I think in the abc files I made we can find both, but not in this kind of use : ...|!dead!trill!beef|... ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] RE : Help - getting ABC files on BarFly
Do you use HFVExplorer ? I think it can convert automatically files between mac and pc. I had no problem for opening my abc files with BarFly then http://www.nic.fi/~lpesonen/HFVExplorer/ ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Subject: Re: [abcusers] About the choice of '!'
I said it could be adviced to use it with care. If someone is using this kind of notation ...|!dead!trill!beef|... then one has made a mistake because it could be misunderstood. It's also the reason why I think in the 2.0 standard * should be used for forced line break instead. And why a mistake ? because if one would have written ...|! dead !trill!beef |... then some parsers may have avoid the error. And if one had thought to another way of putting this trill, either with U: or ~ or with a new line ...| dead !trill!beef|... etc. It's like the question of using a %%version 2.0 in tunes, the general answer is ppl will never enter this number if they don't feel the use to it, it's the same with all other information, some pple will never enter X: fields, some may input unreadable abc... well if people are not parcimonious, it's their problem... Including the version used would be a good idea for those who would need it. Now that ! staffbreak is available in abcm2ps, it's a reasonable /.../ !decorations!. In which case the 2 different ! constructions will be mixed together in the same line wherever they have to be. I thought with the new standard the ! as line break was supposed to be still supported for backward compatibility, and only tolerated, with advice to avoid to use both, or to use with care. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] Version 2.0.0 voice overlay and lyrics
The operator may be used to temporarily overlay several voices within one measure. The operator I can understand this when it comes to (temporary) voices, with several melodies. But sometimes it concerns only chords, for ex. a chord with two wholes and one with a half, it seems less logic to use this kind of notation (would A B c d e f g a x6 A2 allowed then ?), so my question is will the notation with for ex. A B c d e f [A2g] a still be possible, in addition to the possibility (this [A2g] was implemented in abcm2ps, andI think Abacus can handle this too) ? It seems so obvious and logical it's strange it wasn't from the beginning of Abc, and for chords it's more readable than this command (again this example of A B c d e f [A2g] a, we can see at once what note is with the other) About pure voice overlay, I think also the option by Richard is even better than , I find it more readable [v:1] A B c d e f g a [v:2] A A A A A A A A [v:3] A G F E D C B, A,|] ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] Abacus
There are good improvements in this new version, and it seems also it crash less, unlike the previous version. The midi rendering is good also. I think you already know for lyrics and multivoice :) (it lacks cruelly) but will there be a midi export as well ? A few suggestions : You made a full abc view (without display), it could have been maybe better to have a full abc view + display. I guess some pple prefer to have full abc as default edition (AbcMus can do this well, switching from a mode to an other) Your package is still quite heavy to download. I noticed my MSwindows had already several or your big files used in the system folder (for VB basic I guess), so maybe you could propose a the normal package, and a light one for people who know they have already those special files ? You could include a file with some abc samples ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] ABC sects
I don't like %%midi transpose, because transposition is nothing to do with midi, I forget to talk about that, an advantage of BarFly is, if I understood well, it can transpose either the notation, or the sound, or both. The %%midi transpose is limited because it make transpose both (of course it was designed 1st to fit abc2midi's needs). For guitar notation for ex., the notation is written one 8ve higher than the real pitch. I think with abcm2ps for my guitar partitions I wrote K:C treble for keeping that correct (I can't really remember how I made it display correcly). Maybe it could be possible to have in addition a %%transpose with several way of transposition : midi only, midi + display, display only. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] Abcpp
it seems I forgot to send this post... I apologize to post it again if I already did so Any programmers here that feel the call to create a nice little conversion program/script for the benefit of the world at large? /.../ Note that with such a program, there is no need to cleanup old ABC files -- any time you want to use an old ABC file with your new program, you simply run it through the converter. Abcpp can do that. (http://abcplus.sourceforge.net/#abcpp) I'm using Abcpp now for some tunes now, it's great. Not related to what was said about the abc2.0, I just wanted to know if escape sequences were supported, for ex. the possibility to write new line feed, for ex. some application use \n for new line (we won't talk about '!'...), or \t for tabulation etc. It could be usefull in some case, unless ppl prefer to edit the source with a text processor. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] RE : Abacus
crash less but still some? yes, while I tried it and was writing this review, I wrote it doesn't crash for nothing, but I got a crash at this very moment... I tried later and it generally crashes after I copy and paste in the box (after removing the notes, but I guess the previous headers [since it's not full edition] can do some interference). I've just made it crash now, I did this, and all was fine until I hit F7 for full edition. I get Error 9, indice outside the range (translated from french) Before that I played a bit with the clef option, I don't know if it's linked. You can try too, you'll see. Well, AbcMus doesn't display the score on the screen at the same time so it's got more room as you prefer. It's just for ex. if you have in the header a C: field, you can't see it at all, unless you go to full edition. In the case you have the full abc, even if you can't display it in the whole window, at least you can scroll to adjust it. I find it more rational than lacking some fields in the pre-made header viewer. I don't say it for me, Abacus is nice but so far I'm used to abcm2ps + abc2midi... but I'll recommend it to other pple. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] ABC sects
convert my tunes to make them display when each V: label occurs only once (on big score it's less readable, but not on smaller BarFly has a built-in command to do that - Format Tune under the Utilities menu will rearrange the abc into the format that the program likes (or the other way, if you set the number of bars per line and notes per line high enough). oh yes, I noticed and used BarFly to convert this, but I wanted to have my arrangement back :) Why can't it do it the two ways ? I can understand ppl editing a very long score prefer to have the voices line by line, but sometimes some other pple could prefer to have the V: only once if you want to quickly mute some voices by deleting them in a temp file. It is supported, but you don't use %%midi. For a single voice tune put transpose -24 (or just t=-24) in the K: field. It could be good to find a way to unify this in the new standard. The drawback of your convention is that old program / other program that don't recognise it may crash or display warnings (Abc2win warns 4 times before displaying the tune), while the %% notation won't cause problem : they're simply ignored if not recognized. You can see what it looks like in Gregorian notation at the above URL. and it looks very good :) (on the website) Placing a comment symbol (%) before the clef specifier will cause it to be displayed in modern notation yes, it's a good idea, it's conveniant and fast to switch this http://www.mcn.net/~relbooks/gf_salve.gif btw this link doesn't work anymore ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] line-break again !!!! :)
masochistic altruist who will go back and remove all the line-break !s from all the tune files created with abc2win over the last eight years or so which might annoy I guess it's quite easy, sitting confortable behind my computer without knowing how to program, to find a solution for a programming problem. Sorry if it's not easy to code, I don't know at all about this issue, but it seems it could be possible to consider only one ! between two | | = line break while going by pair ! ! between two | | = !...! decoration. I doubt someone would use | inside !...! notation. If so, one could only blame oneself if it doesn't display correctly. And I doubt also someone would use both convention in the same notation. We could consider it's not allowed in the 2.0 standard to use both. What I'm almost 100% sure is all the Abc2win abc files that cause this problem don't use the !...! notation at all. barline (optional : blablabla) only-one-! blablabla barline = line break barline !...! blablabla (optional : !...!) blablabla = !...! decoration language more clearly in abc format : | abcd ! abcd | = line break (it's obvious one shouldn't use 2 line breaks in the same mesure) | abcd !whatever! abcd = !...! decoration On the other hand, we do have to maintain some compatibility with abc2win's files, because they are priceless. What we must avoid is adding something to the language which prevents new programs which conform to the newest standard from being capable of dealing with abc2win's files. it may be also possible to make as default mode the !...! notation and to put as option (in windows application) or flag (in dos parser) the ! line break so people could choose what mode is suitable for them. As far as I'm concerned I don't have any use of the ! line break, I prefer to keep my tunes as compact as possible when I print them or use P: parts instead to note different parts, but I can undestand some ppl may like this feature. Again, abcd | abcd | abcd | abcd | is supposed to have a line break after the second mesure ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] ABC sects
I use this abc for obtaining, sending, transcribing and printing tunes - I use emacs/xemacs as editor with abc-mode and then to produce top quality printed music I use jcabc2ps - what is *wrong* with the abc2ps's ?? I think jcabc2ps was not targeted in the list of the bad applications, of course jcabc2ps is a good clone, and it's the reason there is a question for merging jcabc2ps and abcm2ps (if I understood well). The problem raised is that on the abc main page http://www.gre.ac.uk/~c.walshaw/abc/ we get the impression that abc2ps is the best fully tested released version / the latest version with new and experimental features from Germany while others are vile clones : John Chambers' clone of abc2ps / Jean-François Moine's clone of abc2ps, and they are presented after the outdated Abc2ps. And even if Abc was developped originally for TeX, those old TeX packages should be presented only at the end of the list, for nostalgics. I really wish I understood this hate campaign against abc2win. On his website, Jim Vint credits a great many people who gave him support some of whom are still active on this list) so he didn't work in isolation. I don't hate abc2win. On my website I still recomment it, but I state that it's only for beginners who wish to type simple folk tunes only because it's so limited. And now I tend to favorise Abacus, even if the 1st release still crash from time to time. On http://www.abc2win.com/ infos have been updated, but not the prg. For ex. it still plays music throught the buzzer of the PC, when it could have been maybe not so hard to have the option to send the tune to abc2midi istead. I don't say it's compulsory the author does that, of course, but abc2win couldn't expect in return we consider it the most important and best abc application. I discovered Abc with Abc2win, and learn to type abc with it, I'm gratefull it existed at that time and I still consider it was a good application at the moment (also for selection of tunes in a book), but now it's a bit outdated for some other uses. For ex. it can't directly print a whole book of tunes on several pages. The problem was raised recently. I used my Atari with pleasure, but I'm glad better computers arrived on the market, and programmer didn't released later software still compatible with Atari. Even Abc2win couln't run on the DOS emulator I had on it :) using abcpp I've fixed lots of legacy ABC files. It would be nice if there were a web-based translation service based on abcpp. I have no experience on writing web applets; any hints? Although the list seems to be dominated by the Windows and Linux users, don't forget in designing standards that there are a fair number of Macintosh users who use abc too. Solutions that aren't compatible with our computers don't do us much good! Therefore the idea of a web-based translation service sounds particularly good to me. About Macintosh, so far I couldn't check how Barfly behaves. I've made it work on an emulator recently, and I liked it, but I had to convert my tunes to make them display when each V: label occurs only once (on big score it's less readable, but not on smaller ones), and the %midi transpose commands weren't supported. I find more conveniant to use such a command for transposing -24 and to type something like G2 GG A2-AB instead of G,,2 G,,G,, A,,2-A,,B,, About a translation service, for converting whole set of tunes to pdf it could be a good idea. JC's Tune finder can do this for single tunes, but not for user's tunebook I think. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] RE : %%ABC 2.0 identifier
I don't know if whatI'm about to suggest has been suggested before,/.../ it's fairly clear to me that the real key to writing any new specification is adding some identifier that says that the tune conforms to the new specification. For example, maybe something like: %%ABC3.0 ...anywhere in a tune's header will indicate that the tune's encoding conforms *strictly* to the ABC version 3.0 (just an example version...) specification yes, it has already been requested before. As an ABC user, I totally agree with the idea, and I would include such a comment in all my tunes (that conform to it) if it enters in the standard. But the general answer about such an identifier is that no one would bother adding it, you can implement it but only 5 % users would use it etc. I don't see were is the problem. If some pple don't mind their tune won't be well played / displayed in most advanced application, and if they don't wish to add the level of abc used 1.6, 1.7 or 2.0, it'd be only their own fault. If it's present, though, you can parse it strictly to the 3.0 specification -- no deviations allowed. it will allow to give responsibilities to pple who wish it this way, so I find it positive and more logical. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] abcm2ps?
this is what the archive abcm2ps-3.6.4.zip contains: 165376 07-08-03 13:10 abcm2ps-3.6.4/abcm2ps.exe I guess he d/l the archive from JF Moine's website, and not your, otherwise he would have got this binary ;) Otherwise for more help with abcm2ps (automatic laucher), this page may be usefull for a beginner : http://abcmr.sourceforge.net/download.html ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] Looking for help on printing
Is there a way to do this with any of the ABC programs? I currently use ABC2Win, and can't figure out a way to do it. I hate the idea of printing each individually. I thought it was possible to print several pages with abc2win... otherwise as someone said, abc#2ps can do this. If it's only for this time and you don't want to bother installing the whole process (ghostview etc.), you can still send me your abc file(s) and I'll send you back a pdf file with all the tunes (no matter how many tunes there are) so it'll be easier to print. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] Stars and Bangs
When printing music I would expect the music to look like === with only the last line maybe not being right-justified. Me too ! Does non-right justify mean the score could be = === == It's not impossible the 1st musictex packages were doing this by default, so the * was necessary (I don't know). Since now it's obsolete, I don't find strange to expect to use * for line break (justified by default). I think in some case some pple would expect to have the last line justified, no matter how many notes / words there can be on the line, even 3 or 4. The visual aspect is not really nice, but some pple may prefer it this way == === === = === === == === === == === == === instead of == === === = === === == === === == === == === (msword can do this when converting some line break from other word processors) Since we could use * for line break, with justification, and people would unlikely use a * for the last line, the bad looking notation would unlikely occur, except if ppl really want it this way. So this way we could still use the !...! notation and prefer * instead of ! (except if pple really want no justification for the bars). Anyway, *...* is less readable than !...!. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
RE : [abcusers] abc2midi and other MIDI-supporting software
It isn't being actively supported any more, though. We discussed its bug with broken-rhythms constructs what, two years ago? getting the nearest I've ever seen us get to total consensus, and even though fixing it was a matter of altering one numeric constant in the source, it hasn't been done. no, it's not a bug, but a thing done on purpose. Personnaly I don't think it was a good idea to make it a standard. I've written a message here some years ago about this issue, it's easy to recompile old sources of abc2midi using in the file store.c : ratio_a = 2; ratio_b = 6; (6 instead of 4, which made the Hornpipe rythm) so broken rythm is now correct for all sort of music, and I can use it by default instead of typing in each tune %%MIDI ratio 3 1. I say the old sources, because I think with the new maintainer of the sources, it as been made as default. Btw talking about abc2midi and abcm2ps : Its sound output wasn't that good last I heard, and I haven't got a computer that can run it. Nor is it much good at transposing tunes, cataloguing tune files or importing MIDI. I don't think abc2midi can catalogue tunes, but so far it can transpose tunes and import midi :) And with some perl script it's possible to renumber tunes and probably list them as well. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] bloody ! again
This is the wrong way to look at it. abc2win is barely being maintained, but tunes created with its aid are the largest single corpus on the web. It's the tunes you need to care about, not the software. ok, I guess that *almost* all of those tunes are from folk tradition. Do you honestly think we can live with or without those line breaks ? Since this fashion was introduced by abc2win (I started learning and discovering abc with it and I'm grateful to this software) and abc2win doesn't support multivoice and advanced features, I strongly doubt it will be very annoying if the future softwares miss this feature. So far I haven't found that many tunes with ! for line break (yes, I collect them all). Btw the first one I found is this one (it's just an example, and contrary to what I said it's not folk music) : X: 3 T:Foots Minuet. BC.03 M:3/4 L:1/4 R:Minuet O:England A:x N:There was a Samuel Foote,1720-1777, wit,playwright,and actor,just like N:in Blackadder! Z:vmp.John Bagnall K:D a f a | g2 f | e d e | f/e/f/g/f/g/ | a f a | trg2 f | e d e | f3 :|!: f f f |e/d/e/f/ e | g g g | f/e/f/g/ f | a/g/f/g/a/b/ | trg2 f | d/e/ f e | d3 |] (from village music...) I processed it in abc2win (yes I still have it :) ) to see the difference with it and without it. I don't think it's showing too much disrespect for the transcriver to forget this line break : probably 90% of line break are for showing a new part (can be done with P: instead). In case of classical / baroque etc. partition, it can be usefull, it's less the case in trad. folk music. It's not vital. Can someone find a counter example ? There are very few existing files using the abcm2ps !...! construct compared with the number that use ! as a terminator. From the demonstration we got recently, the !code! and ! will always be incompatible. I don't find !code! so great to enter, but it can be usefull, much more usefull than this kind of line break. I think the tunes using !...! notation provide more informations in themself with those !...! than the line break to emphasize a new part. If some programmers can be smart enought to include in their software an option (checkbox to emulate the old abc2win option :) )to support this ! line break, why not. But it shouldn't be the only option to write it. I remember the * symbol was ought to mean justification. I found few applications that support it. Why not consider this one as a new line break notation ? I don't think it's used somewhere else. !br! could also be used :) Better to let abcm2ps have for whatever it wants to do with a new character, since source readability doesn't seem to be an issue for people who use it. hmm, that's your opinion... I personally do type all my abc by hand... but I can say on the other hand I don't mind rediscuss the !...! to an other kind of notation. +...+ wouldn't annoy me for example, or even a complete way to symbolise this. Why not the macros the way Barfly implement them ?, if it's possible to use them for such notation, and if it doesn't give a unreadable result as the U: does (I still prefer a !...! notation than some I J etc. mixing with notes written with letters). I've managed to install a mac emulator and I tried BarFly yesterday. I'll try that macro thing, to see how it can be used. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: RE : [abcusers] abc2midi and other MIDI-supporting
hehe, I didn't say that, only quoted it... On Fri, 4 Jul 2003, [iso-8859-1] Forgeot Eric wrote: It isn't being actively supported any more, though. It has now a new maintainer, Seymour Shlien. We discussed its bug with broken-rhythms constructs what, two years ago? ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] re : My point of view on the abc standard
At least partly because the prospect of setting it up, installing ghostscript to view graphics. etc. it just too daunting for them. What these users (probably the majority of PC users) want is something that is easy to use and works on thier system it's true I often recommended Abc to several musicians I know, but found it difficult to tell them it's not that user-friendly to set up. I always recomment AbcMus (it's obvious because it's easy to install, compact (less than 1 Mb), efficient, powerfull...), but for displaying music it's the tricky part. I generally recomment Abacus because it's easy to use and the result is good, even if it's not as complete as Abcm2ps. Does someone know if it's possible to hack a ghostscript version to have only the PDF export, and create a program that could directly convert abc to pdf using abcm2ps, in a minimal package ? (Ghostscript is quite huge to d/l for ppl who may don't have the necessary motivation for it at first) It's a pity Adobe don't include in their acrobat reader a PS viewer. With time acrobat reader grow for each new version, but there are few real useful improvements. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] Re: bw ps output
Is it possible to instruct (or modify) abcm2ps to
create pure black and white PS output (without gray
values) and to draw the staff lines as thin as
possible? This way the output would look much clearer
on the web.
as far as I know, abcm2ps creates pure bw output, but probably
your default GhostView output is set to Graphic Alpha 2 or 4, turn
it to 1 and you won't get any shading.
In order to draw the lines as thin as possible, recompile it with
this option in buffer.c :
%%BeginSetup
/bdef {bind def} bind def
/T {translate} bdef
/M {moveto} bdef
/dlw {0.8 setlinewidth} bdef
put a lower value to 0.8 (if it's not changed already... I tend to
turn it up when I have to print with a laser printer)
If you want to change this for one tune only, edit the ps output
directly according to this.
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Re: [abcusers] the abc standard
responsibility over the standard. Personally, I would propose Jef Moine and Guido Gonzato: Jef because he's I think it's a good idea, if they agree of course ;) I think also of John Chamber. Just one comment: having a software developer in charge of standards is a conflict of interests. S/he can drive the standard in the direction of his/her own software. Since Jeff has included so usefull features in Abcm2ps, and developped some unofficial (but yet accepted) notations (such as the multiple voices) because the 1.6 standard hadn't evolved at all, it wouldn't be a problem if the new standard would include parts of what he did in Abcm2ps. I don't think I would have been interested to retranscribe so many ancient music tunes if Jeff hadn't extended more possibilities to the abc format. We recently had a brief discussion of some notation for traditional Persian music. Though I don't play that myself, I do have a number of recordings, and I found the discussion interesting. I think for this kind of music, or the special less used features (quartertone, microtone), they should remain included in some %% command so it wouldn't confuse old applications, or softwares whose developpers don't wish to include those features in them. I know also some applications crash when they recognize something they don't understand. With %% command, they just ignore this. Yeah, and I'd like to add that we also shouldn't have a musician in charge of the standard, since s/he can drive the standard in the direction of his/her own favorite musical styles. I propose myself for this, and since Metal is one of my favorite (folk-metal etc.), I'll add nice and usefull feature in the standard : With new fields and commands such as : Q:4/4=very very fast R:Broken triple kick drum K:disharmonical K:detuned W:[screamed]: D:best of %%ultraoverdrive %%distortion %%MIDI control 7 9500 I haven't included them yet in my metal conversions :), but more seriously it's still possible to render in abc some tunes created by metal musicians : http://anamnese.online.fr/abc/metal.abc (some tunes are not finished to transcribe yet) ps : about what Phil Taylor as added recently, I think he's not wrong, even if I didn't notice than this list was dominated by the Abcm2ps corporation :) I don't think such a person exists. It's a job for a committee. It's what was proposed. If you think you could fit also in this committee, I believe you could do this job well. I read what you wrote about multivoice, and used it when I begun to learn about it. But the committee shouldn't involve too many pple, otherwise they will never agree and things will never take a step further. About looking for full range notation for such a little format, it'd be difficult to let it be able to notate all. Coming again on abcm2ps, I find it suits all my need (when I use it with Abc2midi), it's still very powerfull in its present form. I've never be able to enter efficiently notes with a mouse, so I like to type them instead. I use it also to write folk tune when I don't have any computer at hand. If I'd feel the need to use a all in one software with many specific notations and effect I think I'll look toward software that handle xml for ex. The output format is impossible to read by human, but it's not restricted. A format such as abc, even if it's wonderfull and I don't wish to use another one, will always be limited in comparison to MusicXML. In fact in my opinion NO program should break backward compatibility! It's also a reason why I advocate for the use of %% for new features. and .abc files written to the old 1.6 standard, the question is what the old apps do when they meet one of the new files. AFAIK there I think it'd be difficult to avoid notation such as the x for the invisible rests... I don't think it would be used in folk tune for ex. so only tunes with heavy needs would need this, that mean they would include also V: and other unsupported features in old app. It is a very good idea to add an ABC version field to the header, to distinguish old ABC from new ABC. I think it's a good idea too, and I'm willing to do it for abc following the Abcplus extentions, or not in the 1.6 standard (or at least try to do my best to find them all) ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] RE : abc and microtonality
I've read with great attention and interest the last thread about
microtone. Although I'm not an expert in this field, I'm
interested in writing notation for persian music, and playing it
as well.
I regret I haven't worked much on this project (including
transcribing music) recently, but I had a page about what I've
done so far : http://anamnese.online.fr/iran/persian_music.html
I haven't looked for a complicated to set solution, and this way
it's not practical to use. I couldn't program myself a new program
so I've just redefined some %%deco for Abcm2ps and I've recompiled
Abc2midi to play it roughtly.
I've used at that moment the same idea proposed here :
I think the best solution would be to use the !...!
symbol notation to add extra symbols to the abc
language. Something like !sharp1!, !sharp2!, !sharp3!
etc.
The only advantage is it's backward compatible with old notations.
But it's a pain to write and not really readable (see example
below)
So I've used !koron! and !sori! (koron is for between flat and
full note, while sori is between sharp and full note) for this.
After the note I've put !=! it is for telling Abc2midi that it has
to come back to the normal pitch bend (in order to close a note
with this otherwise the rest will be detuned). As I said it's not
fine to use.
I've also set another kind of symbols, for western music (in fact
it's the general symbols for 1/4 tone), it's just !b! and !#! ,
with also the use of !=! for abc2midi. Not better :)
You can have a look at the display here :
X:1
T:Daramad of Shur
L:1/8
Q:1/4=135
M:no
K:C
%%MIDI program 111
d !koron!e !=! g f !koron!e !=! d c _B A G A d2 {c}_B2 {A}G2 |
G A c _B A G F !koron! E !=! D !koron! E !=! F G A c {_B} A2 {G}
F4 |
FFF A2 G2 {F}!koron! EEE !=!G2 F2 {!koron! E !=!} DDDF2 !koron! E2
!=! |
http://anamnese.online.fr/iran/daramad_shur.png
The output from my customed abc2midi, but since it's pitch bend,
it's not nice to hear (there is also a pb of rythm, but it's
because original has some free rythms) :
http://anamnese.online.fr/iran/daramad_shur.mid
and the original :
http://anamnese.online.fr/iran/daramad.mp3
For western music, the other notation I used is here :
http://anamnese.online.fr/iran/ton_plinn_melanie.png
http://anamnese.online.fr/iran/test_breton.pdf
and the outputs :
http://anamnese.online.fr/iran/tonPlinn.mid
http://anamnese.online.fr/iran/tonPlinnMelanie1.mid
http://anamnese.online.fr/iran/tonPlinnMelanie2.mid
I haven't managed to put some of those 1/4 tones in the key
signature.
Some comments on the previous posts :
To make it short, I think too Buddha Buck's notation is the
easiest
Actually, I could suggest another notation: _#C, where # is a
single
digit, means flatting C by that many eighth-tones. For finer
control,
_##C, where ## is a pair of digits, means flattening C by that
many
cents, or 100ths of a semitone. ^#C and ^##C have analogous
defintions, but sharpening instead.
The note halfway between E and F could be represented as ^2E,
^50E,
_2F,
or _50F. F itself could be ^E, ^4E, ^0F, ^00F, F _8G, or __G
(or, if
you really wanted, ^^^D).
I only suggest something else in addition. It can be somehow
misleading (it could be the same as %%MIDI ratio n m ), but I
know some oriental music (persian music for ex.) can have variants
in 1/4 tone, it's not a fixed 1/4 tone. It can be for ex. 45% or
35% of a half-tone, that depends of some scales and various
parameters I don't really know (I've just find something about it
http://users.rcn.com/christopherchapman/persianintervals.html). If
it appears also in some other trad. music, it could be interesting
to allow to define this ratio in the header, and then use a
general 1/4 tone definition for the notation in a tune, ex ^2G
it'd be quicker to write than ^35G if we can define earlier that
the ratio is 35th of a semitone.
This definition could be for ex :
%%quartertone [note] [ratio for flat] [ration for sharp]
(I suggest this %% notation since there are not that many letters
left, and %% notation is more readable)
So the previous example could be :
X:1
T:Daramad of Shur
L:1/8
Q:1/4=135
M:no
K:C
%%quartertone B 35 50
%%quartertone E 42 55
d _2e g f _2e d c _B A G A d2 {c}_B2 {A}G2 |
G A c _B A G F _2E D _2 E F G A c {_B} A2 {G} F4 |
FFF A2 G2 {F}_2EEE G2 F2 {_2 E } DDDF2 _2E2 |
it'd mean _2B = _35B and ^2B = ^50B (real 1/4 tone) while _2E =
_42E and ^2E (and ^2e as well etc.) = ^55E while default for
example _2A would remain the same (50/50)
This way it's more intelligible to understand how the scale is
constructed (we can see the particular notes in the header)
Or, to be consistent with the rest of abc, we could just put a
length
after an accidental. So _2/3A would be an A that is flatted 2/3
of a
semitone. Similarly ^1/2A, ^/2A and ^/A would be a note
halfway
between A and ^A.
is also a good idea. Since I'm not a software developper, I
wouldn't mind if all of those ideas would be included in the abc
standard
[abcusers] abcm2ps
Nevertheless, everyone's ideas are welcome last time I was using abc for creating some midi file with several voices with the same notes (to get a bigger sound) When I used abcm2ps for viewing the note, I realized there isn't in the standard, nor in abcm2ps (it seems) an option to avoit printing / displaying a part. I think it would be relevant with the %%staves option ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] ps2gif?
Can someone please tell me how to convert a .ps to a .gif? I have GS on mswindows and I don't use linux much. I think it's the same there, you can use one of the tool they provide to convert .ps to .png. Then use a graphic editor to convert the png to gif, but btw png should be enough and better... I don't think it's possible to get it directly to gif, but I see some other applications might do this : http://www.google.fr/search?q=ps2gifie=UTF-8oe=UTF-8hl=frmeta= i.e. : http://www.museum.state.il.us/research/faunmap/query/ps2gif.html ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] Bb and Eb instruments (Linux)
Thank you, I don't think I'll use this one for this kind of work, but I may need to study how this kind of script works for a similar purpose, so it'll be very usefull. If anyone can use these scripts for anything I am happy to share them wit= h=20 you. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: Re: [abcusers] Renaissance notes, anyone?
Hello These look great. If you publish the postscript code I will include the fonts (the noteheads and clefs, anyway) in iabc. as said on the website, the postscript fonts are published : http://anamnese.online.fr/abc/renaiss_music_font.zip ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] Renaissance notes, anyone?
I've already converted them to postscript, thanks PfaEdit. I tried to replace the fonts used in the source code of Abcm2ps, for getting 2 different binaries. As explained on my site, the exported fonts (by PfaEdit) where different in the definition from the postscript code used in Abcm2ps JF Moine told be it would be better to use the %%postscript and %%deco command directly in the abc source, and provided me some help for this. I managed to do this for the quarter notes symbols I've created later (see http://anamnese.online.fr/iran/persian_music.html), I've also made the more western symbol used in some bretonian music for ex. for quarter notes used in voices, it's in the font definition but I haven't made a special page for this yet. So far I haven't worked again on the renaissance fonts, all is almost done, but the huge work will be for the font definition (maybe it's not that difficult). Since I've created those notes PfaEdit seems to have got several improvement, maybe also in export fct. So I'll probably work more on all this soon (why not today... ?) Hello, it's still a work in progress, but you can look at : http://anamnese.online.fr/abc/renaissance_fonts.html that's _very_ nice - if you need assistance converting your existing font into PostScript, feel free to contact me. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] re : ANNOUNCEMENT - Typesetting Music with ABC available
yes, this manual is nice. I've d/l the italian manual when it was released and couldn't understand all in it, but I got the impression at least it was well done and well detailed. The english version confirm that, even if I haven't studied all in depth (since I already know how to use most of abcm2ps commands, but I can grab some usefull tips as well, ex. I didn't know for inserting eps graphics in a partition... probably it's a new feature ?) I'll recommend it to all my friends who are interested in using abc. A little comment : In page 16 : Do not mistake chords for something completely different! If you want to get something like this: /.../ these are not chords, but different voices on the same staff. This will be the subject of Section 4. Now it's possible to achieve this with abcm2ps : X:1 T:test M:4/4 L:1/8 [c2e3] B2 e [A2c4] G2 | I don't think you talk about that in your manual (this *very* nice feature helped me much when I was reluctant to write a new voice for only 2 notes in such a chord) (I suggest we don't start a new debate on this list about different lenght in chords... :) last time it was so long...) ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] abcm2ps and EPS
I've tried the new feature of Abcm2ps, for including eps files. The eps provided in the source is very clean, so there is no pb with it. I created one with a vectorial application, but when I imported it it didn't work : the first time there was a buffer overflow (I recompiled it with a more tolerant value), and since it didn't worked I tried with an other application. I wasn't better so I opened the eps file with ghostview and reexported it to eps. The code was 3 times smaller :) (and 10 times smaller in comparison to the 1st one). I got the image, but not the music : in the eps file there were some values about page setup that shortcut the ones for the partitions. So, my question is what kind of application can I use in order to include a proper eps image in an abc file ? ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] Renaissance notes, anyone?
Hello, it's still a work in progress, but you can look at : http://anamnese.online.fr/abc/renaissance_fonts.html ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] Inverted quadruplets
thank you very much, I had forgotten this notation's existance. Now all just work fine. I'll add this in my abc tutorial (in french) Writing F5/4 will cause problems for most display programs, since the time value 5/4 can't be displayed as a single note in staff notation. Player programs will generally have no problem with it though. You can do what you want using the extended tuplet notation: (4:5:4F,FCF should work. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] Inverted quadruplets
in Abc notation, for playing 5 notes in the time of 4 we can use
quintuplet. Now, let think I want the opposite, playing 4 notes in
the time of 5. How can I do that ? I used for ex :
F,5/4F5/4C5/4F5/4 instead of F,FCF . It seems correct this way,
but some applications seems to complain (abcm2ps for ex.).
Abc2midi seems to play it correctly. Is there a specific notation
(probably not in abc) but for music in general for this kind of
effect ?
ex :
X:6
T:The storm before the calm
Z:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- http://anamnese.fr.st
M:none
L:1/8
Q:1/4=57
K:A
%%MIDI transpose 0
%%MIDI program 0
%%staves {1 2}
%%vskip 2cm
V:1
|: [M:5/4] c10/4A10/4 d/d/-d2-d/A/ | [M:4/4] B2 G-G/d/ c3-c/A/ :|
V:2
%%MIDI transpose -24
%%MIDI program 0
K:A bass
|: [M:5/4] F,5/4F5/4C5/4F5/4 B,B[Fd]B | [M:4/4] CB[Fd]B ccAc :|
without this specific effect it should have been :
X:6
T:The storm before the calm
Z:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- http://anamnese.fr.st
M:4/4
L:1/8
Q:1/4=57
K:A
%%MIDI transpose 0
%%MIDI program 0
%%staves {1 2}
%%vskip 2cm
V:1
|: c2A2 d/d/-d2-d/A/ | B2 G-G/d/ c3-c/A/ :|
V:2
%%MIDI transpose -24
%%MIDI program 0
K:A bass
|: F,FCF B,B[Fd]B | CB[Fd]B ccAc :|
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[abcusers] Adding PostScript fonts?
oups, it seems I forget to post this one after typing it... If you're using ghostscript... you put in /fonts/ your new fonts (ex : Hansagotisch.pfb, maybe there are also other definitions, I can't remember, such as Hansagotisch.afm, Hansagotisch.inf Hansagotisch.pfm but they're probably not all necessary) then, in /lib/ you edit Fontmap.GS such : in section % Actual fonts you add : /HansaGotisch (Hansagotisch.pfb) ; /AlteSchwabacher(AlteSchwabacher.pfb) ; /AlteSchwabacherDemi(AlteSchwabacherDemi.pfb) ; /AlteSchwabacherShadow (AlteSchwabacherShadow.pfb) ; and you can also add a section for % Aliases ex : /AlteSchwabacher-Bold /AlteSchwabacherDemi; /AlteSchwabacher-Italic /AlteSchwabacher; /AlteSchwabacher-Bold-Italic/AlteSchwabacherDemi; etc. then you can use the alias name with Abcm2ps in your abc file ex : %%textfont AlteSchwabacher-Bold 15 %%vskip 0.5cm %%center F r a u N a c h t i g a l l %%center Volkslieder vom 12. Jahrhundert bis zur Gegenwart %%textfont AlteSchwabacher 12 %%vskip 0.5cm %%center Herausgegeben %%center von %%center Carl Reyß und Fritz Spieser If you want to have a look to what you can get with this : http://anamnese.online.fr/abc/nachtigl.pdf you'll get all the sources in the http://anamnese.online.fr/abc/ directory I even used some celtic fonts for http://anamnese.online.fr/abc/celtia.pdf Hope that help. I haven't processed new files for long, so I can't remember all. Anyway, if you can't make it work, you can email me. I remember it worked fine for some fonts, but I had pb with some others (especially Garamond). ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] online abc previewer
I'm not sure my hosting service would allow to run applications... Hmmm, that would be a problem... yes, I tried yesterday, they don't allow this, I uploaded a version of abcm2ps I compiled on linux, but they don't even allow to change the CHMOD on it so it's not possible to run it. And many of your php scripts have functions they don't allow at all, in a way they're not wrong because of some abuse... 1) My code is a bit spaghetti here and there. When it goes fast I find btw I don't know much about php and such... so I can't really know what to do. I'll try it on local, as soon as I reinstall a decent linux o/s. 2) Although I did (re)start some translation (look in lokale) the comments to the code are mostly in danish, sorry... det er ikke noe problem... ;) Jack Campin : Not necessarily - there is no port of abcm2ps for the Mac, but Ghostscript (and other ways of printing Postscript files) are available for it. ah yes, that's right. But if you compile the source of abcmp2ps, doesn't it work ? Or is it because there is no command line on Mac ? I hope with MacOSX it is o.k. now. Sue Andrews : whether there is way to print out fiddle tunes in the bass clef? yes there is ! :) or ex. I play this tune on fiddle (it should be cello btw, or conterbass I can't remember) : X:41 T:Premier Divertissement - Jupiter modérément (version de travail) C:Forqueray O:France Z:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- http://anamnese.fr.st M:C L:1/8 Q:1/4=147 K:Dm GFE |: DFEF AFED | ^CA,^CE AGFE | FDFA dfed | ^cd^cB ABAG | FAdf agfe | GBdg bagf | ed^cB Aeae | fgfe dGFE | DFEF AFED | ^CA,^CE AGFE | FDFA dfed | ^cd^cB ABAG | FAdf agfe | GBdg bagf | ed^cB AGFE | FGFE DGFE | To display it for bass key, just add this : K:Dm bass %%MIDI transpose -24 it gives : X:41 T:Premier Divertissement - Jupiter modérément (version de travail) C:Forqueray O:France Z:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- http://anamnese.fr.st M:C L:1/8 Q:1/4=147 K:Dm bass %%MIDI transpose -24 GFE |: DFEF AFED | ^CA,^CE AGFE | FDFA dfed | ^cd^cB ABAG | FAdf agfe | GBdg bagf | ed^cB Aeae | fgfe dGFE | DFEF AFED | ^CA,^CE AGFE | FDFA dfed | ^cd^cB ABAG | FAdf agfe | GBdg bagf | ed^cB AGFE | FGFE DGFE | It works fine even on http://atte.dyndns.dk/lovsang/input.php if you don't have all the ghostscript things installed on your system. For a folk tune it's the same : just add bass in the K: field (it seems it's not necessary to add %%MIDI transpose -24 (or -12) for the lastest abcm2ps, it is intelligent and can transpose automatically) X:3 T:Statia Donelly's R:jig O:Ireland - Éire Z:[EMAIL PROTECTED] M:6/8 L:1/8 Q:3/8=130 K:C bass E |: AGA cBA | ede ged | ege ede | cec dBG | AGA cBA | ede ged | edc BAB | cAA A2 E :| |: A2B cBA | c2d ecA | G^FG dBG | dBG BAG | A2B cBA | GBA GED | EDC B,A,B,|1 CA,A,A,2 E :| CA,A,A,2 z || your son will be able to play all the O'Neill book on cello now ! :) ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] online abc previewer
http://atte.dyndns.dk/lovsang/input.php Feel free to try it out and share any thoughts (please say which browser and platform). (sorry, it's only in danish for now, vis means show, slet alt means clear everything): Well, gratulieren da ! It looks very good ! Is it a result from Abcm2ps ? oh yes, probably. I think it looks better here (in png) than with ps / pdf on my computer. Btw, maybe it could also generate a pdf file (if possible) for those who want to print it (not ps, it's useless, ppl who can install ghostscript probably don't need to use your tool, they'd generate partitions from their own machine...) Anyway, your converter is very conveniant. I wrote the above before you made some changes in the code... I see there is now pdf generation, great. But now it seems the png file has smaller notes hasn't it ? I tried also to use some %%postscript and %%deco codes, and it works perfect (like on my own computer). I'll recommend your site to friends of mine who can't install all the abcm2ps / ghostscript package... Maybe I could also install your php script on my own homepage, but I'm not sure my hosting service would allow to run applications... (I've got the 1st release, but now there seem to be a pb on http://atte.dyndns.dk/lovsang/kildekode-tarball.php ) ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] Re: abc for linux
Welcome to the promised land! I'm afraid you'll have to get used to the Unix/Linux way of getting some things done lol, welcome to the promised land where all is harder to work :) btw among all the programs you mentionned I use them both on window$ and linux ;) ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] 8va notation, abcm2ps
Does anybody know how (if possible) to put octave notation, e.g. 8va basso - - - - - - into abc so that abcm2ps can render it? I tried making it lyrics, and Yes I know : write something like that : K:C treble-8 maybe for you it will be instead bass-8 for octave up it would be +8 from the new.feature file of abcm2ps we get : - line number indicates on which staff line the base clef is written. Defaults values are: G / treble 2 C / alto3 tenor 4 F / bass4 - '+8' or '-8' draws '8' above or below the staff. When no clef is specified, clef changes are automatically inserted when needed (only 'bass' or 'treble'). ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] Laurie Griffiths : sad news
ouch, it's very shocking to learn... I didn't know him personnaly, but I knew him by just a few emails and on this list... It's such a pity ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] iabc 0.6 released
I've tried the midi export, it works good, but if I want to hear midi directly from iabc, it seems to work only with the windows media players (I have 2 sound cards and the first one, with no output right now, is the default one use by media player, but that's not the pb) : I tried to set other midi players, Winamp and some other freeware I've found, but none of them works properly, the direct output is not recognised (but if I export to midi irst and then load it in any application then it works). Maybe you should allow, like for AbcMus, to set external programs with some parameter, maybe it would work better this way... Could iabc save also the last folder used, instead of opening from the /My documents folder ? (I never put abc files in this folder...) I've seen also it doesn't save the size of the last window used. But iabc seems promising ! ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] Goodbye
Frank, I'm so sorry you can't maintain Musicaviva any longer... It was a good place on the web. Is there a hope it will come back again ? Is it a money problem (cost of servers...) ? If so it's a real pity then. Can't you move to a free account ? I've seen also you speak about a job problem. I'm not good a saying things in such cases so I'll keep quiet then. about always remember that some of Gods greatest gifts come in the form of unanswered prayers. Given the place you live, in the northern part of the world, I think the most helpfull and trustfull one would be SKADI ! Stå på ! Vær ikke sur. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] Lost in abcm2ps
So you've got your abcm2ps Windows executable - but I suspect that what you do *next* is also causing you some doubt. whoo, it's a very complete and well detailled step by step process you've written Steve ! I remember your good tutorial for the abc notation (I probably used it when I begin with abc). Is this help for abcm2ps on your homepage also (I'll check for it) ? So I could pass the url to people who want to start with abcm2ps, if not, then I'll forward them this msg. About ghostscript, I've installed it in an other sub-directory than the default one (I don't like to have program folders in the root) and it works fine (even for creating pdf files), but I remember I've changed several things in the configuration files for that, so as Steve said it's probably better for a beginner to let the default installation directory. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] Lost in abcm2ps
abc2ps (and abcm2ps) assumes you have knowledge of how to compile C on your computer oh, you should probably use Abcm2ps, it's newer and better than the old abc2ps. Binaries and helps can be found on Guido Gonzato's website. I don't have the url here you can find it with www.google.com and probably also at : http://abcplus.sourceforge.net/ ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
re : [abcusers] abc drum notation and abc2ps
If you have access to a linux system, you can always create the new symbols using the application PfaEdit http://pfaedit.sourceforge.net/ It works fine. Then, with the %%deco option in abcm2ps, you can add new symbols. I'm currently working on such stuffs, it's not that easy but it works. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] The symbol and abc2midi
instead of adding the midi command for each tune, you may find it easier to recompile the sources you just have to change this : in the file store.c ratio_a = 2; ratio_b = 6; (6 instead of 4, which made the Hornpipe rythm) I can also provide my recompiled version if you prefer not to bother with this... Greetings. Eric. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] RE : Finally, a tune I know!
nice tune ! isn't this part a bit strange ? BcBc z4 |B2 c2 d2 e2| except the problem about the blank lines you should avoid (the issue has already been debated so I won't comment more), you could if possible give all the clues you have about the tune in the diverse fields (ex : H: B: C: etc.). You should also add your name in the Z: field. Don't stop posting tunes please ! :) ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] RE : quarter-tones with abc in abc2midi and abcm2ps
About his quartertone notation, I managed to use some postscript
fonts for using in Abcm2ps. I've made also an equivalence for
western music, like the one found in some bretonian songs (I found
it in a CD)
I've upload a pdf with the result if some may be interested :
anamnese.online.fr/abc/quartertone.pdf
the midifile of the scales are :
anamnese.online.fr/abc/midi_quartert.zip
I think it sounds rather bad, not close to the original music
(maybe because it uses the pitchbend function). I'll seek further
if it's possible to do something better.
using timidity to play the midi file,
then you can reset the temperament to contain quartertone
intervals.
Thanks for the tips.
Timidity could be usefull then if I can totally customize the
temperament (not only use quarter-tones).
In fact Persian music can be simplified by using quarter-tones,
but in practice quarter-tones are not used, and the pitch
difference between 2 notes are dependent of the modes : for
example seekers made experiences and noticed the traditional
musicians in practice used for a mode 33 savars between B and
c, and for an other 26.5 savars between B and c (here the savar
is 1/50 of the occidental tone, so 26.5 would be very close to our
B, but 33 would be for 2/3 tone)
I don't know much about all this, I'm still learning)
I would guess it needs to be sent an event to put things back to
normal, otherwise MIDI would assume that the pitch is still bent
for
successive notes.
yes, that's why I was forced to cheat in the code by adding
those !=! (or !normal!) after the note to reset the pitchbend.
I'd really like to find a solution to get rid of them.
I don't know if http://home.planet.nl/~roosp/mt_pitch.html is
right or not
Sorry if it turns out I'm being stupid, only trying to help and
understand.
thank you ! I don't think this was a stupid answer at all ! :)
I'm not really a programmer (though I can read a tiny bit of C)
My real
it's exactly the same for me : I can read and make some small
changes, but can't rewrite all or add something new in the
sources.
The problem with using midi pitchbend is that the number which
represents
the amount of pitch change is not standardised
oh, it's usefull to know then. I'll do some further comparisons to
know more about it, and if it can be faultly to use the pitchbend
for this purpose then. But if it turns to be standardized at least
on the soundcard, I think it's enough.
Maybe a finetune change would be better, if it's possible (but I
can't find it in abc2midi source code).
I think I should study more closely the midi standard.
About the postscript definition (for using with abcm2ps), here are
them :
%%postscript/sori { % usage: str x y sori
%%postscriptgsave translate 0.022 dup scale
%%postscript0 100 translate
%%postscriptnewpath
%%postscript120 327 moveto
%%postscript 105 329 lineto
%%postscript 104 -92 lineto
%%postscript 114 -86.5 113 -91 120 -87 curveto
%%postscript 120 327 lineto
%%postscriptclosepath
%%postscript16 316 moveto
%%postscript 1 318 lineto
%%postscript 0 -103 lineto
%%postscript 11 -97 9 -102 16 -98 curveto
%%postscript 16 316 lineto
%%postscriptclosepath
%%postscriptfill
%%postscript-51 219 moveto
%%postscript 232 127 lineto
%%postscript -47 -5 lineto
%%postscript -47 33 lineto
%%postscript 160 123 lineto
%%postscript -50 183 lineto
%%postscript -51 219 lineto
%%postscriptclosepath
%%postscriptfill
%%postscriptgrestore
%%postscript } bdef
%%postscript
%%postscript/koron { % usage: str x y koron
%%postscriptgsave translate 0.022 dup scale
%%postscript0 100 translate
%%postscriptnewpath
%%postscript26 361 moveto
%%postscript 26 228 lineto
%%postscript 174 298 lineto
%%postscript 26 361 lineto
%%postscriptclosepath
%%postscript26 -138 moveto
%%postscript 16 -146 18 -138 0 -145 curveto
%%postscript 0 397 lineto
%%postscript 25 397 lineto
%%postscript 228 300 lineto
%%postscript 26 190 lineto
%%postscript 26 -138 lineto
%%postscriptclosepath
%%postscriptfill
%%postscriptgrestore
%%postscript } bdef
%%postscript
%%postscript/quartdiese { % usage: str x y quartdiese
%%postscriptgsave translate 0.022 dup scale
%%postscript-100 100 translate
%%postscriptnewpath
%%postscript16 48 moveto
%%postscript 292 72 lineto
%%postscript 292 32 lineto
%%postscript 16 8 lineto
%%postscript 16 48 lineto
%%postscriptclosepath
%%postscriptfill
%%postscript164 -152 moveto
%%postscript 164 -152 lineto
%%postscript 164 397 lineto
%%postscript 138 397 lineto
%%postscript 138 -151 lineto
%%postscript 138 -151 lineto
%%postscript 150 -154 151.333 -163.333 164 -152 curveto
%%postscript 164 -152 lineto
%%postscriptclosepath
%%postscriptfill
%%postscript12 210 moveto
%%postscript 288 234 lineto
[abcusers] quarter-tones with abc in abc2midi - Pitchbend in abc2midi
I've studied a bit the code of abc2midi and found it was probably
difficult to make some change in it (for the value pitch) so
that new quarter notes can be added between the normal notes :
the array pitch is set for integer values (and many times in the
code, not easy to change this to float), and the normal values are
for example 60 for middle C, 62 for D etc., so there is no place
between them.
But I thought to the value pitchbend it's probably easy to add
something emulating :
%%MIDI pitchbend [bass/chord] high byte low byte
In found the place to program it : in store.c circa line 2181,
there is
if (strcmp(p, fff) == 0) {
event_specific(MIDI, beat 127 125 110 1);
done = 1;
};
so I can had for example
if (strcmp(p, koron) == 0) {
event_specific(MIDI, pitchbend 0 96);
done = 1;
};
if (strcmp(p, sori) == 0) {
event_specific(MIDI, pitchbend 0 32);
done = 1;
};
if (strcmp(p, normal) == 0) {
event_specific(MIDI, pitchbend 0 64);
done = 1;
};
(!koron! would be for a flat quarter. It could be easily changed
later, to !k! or something else for other type music with quarter
tone)
So how does this pitchbend exactly work ? (what is exactly the
low byte ?) The modification I made seems to work here, but I
can't set really the effect on only one note : it transpose the
whole sequence of notes, and not only one. So I had to use the
!normal! (I used !normal! only for example's sake, it could be
shorter to write) musical instruction to stop the pitchbend, like
that :
X:1
T:test
M:4/4
L:1/8
Q:1/4=90
K:C
%%MIDI program 111
C2 !koron!C2!normal! D2 E2 | C2 !sori!D2!normal! E2 |
Is there an easier way to have it ? For having to write only one
instruction :
C2 !koron!C2 D2 E2 | C2 !sori!D2 E2 |
(and we can also think to have something like that instead at the
end :
C2 !b!C2 D2 E2 | C2 !#!D2 E2 | etc. )
___
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[abcusers] quarter-tones with abc
I'm transcribing some Persian (Iranian) musics, and I'm currently working on some additional fonts for abcm2ps for the quarter tones (called koron for quarter-tone flat and sori for quarter-tone sharp). Is there a way to make some abc application play quarter-tones (and/or other subdivision of tone as well) ? I've seen such a debate in the past, but unfortunately http://www.mail-archive.com/ don't have all the archives for this, I can't find it again. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] Jcabc2ps for MSWIN (new version from the corrected sources)
Well, strange enough I didn't get any warning this time when I compiled (using mingw), I may have done something wrong the last time (maybe by adding and removing some flags for cygwin, then there was wrong flags when I compiled with mingw). The new binary, with the 20020929 sources, are now at : http://anamnese.online.fr/abc/jcabc2ps2.zip (so you can compare them with the other, buggy, one.) ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] Re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation
: is about. Look at the Subject line. The topic is abc bracketed chord : notation. The melody note in a chord is the one that a monphonic : player plays. There's nothing deeper than that. I started only with this topic because I saw there was some applications which begun to use a notation I find conveniant. In fact I didn't noticed the ones that care only about playing abc (like AbcMus or Abc2midi), but for some times ago when I discovered Abc I thought it was natural to write such [G,4C4e2] chords. I noticed then the programs I'm using to display partitions (Yaps, and later Abcm2ps) couldn't handle this, and in fact it was not allowed in the Abc draft, so I gave up with this. Of course I think to use 2 or more voices is easier, clearer, better than this notation, but on the other hand it seems logical to have it in the Abc draft (for some special cases). Then I saw Abacus and Skink could handle this very well so that's why I talked about it. Sorry if it has taken so much proportions. I think Phil Taylor resumes well the problem : I really think we're wasting a lot of time on this. The only use for it is to notate an odd chord or brief passage of double-stopping in a piece which is otherwise monophonic. I would just add : ...in a piece which is otherwise monophonic, or in multivoice to avoid to use one more voice for a brief passage. So I hadn't in mind if the first note, or longer note had to prevail, I wanted just to a conveniant way to notate some chords as they are required in some guitar or piano partitions. I think Abacus actual notation is all that I expected : it supports also tied notes in those chords, so there was no problem for writing all sorts of chords. It's up to the transcriber to write something which make sense. For the note prevail issue, I can't really give my opinion, I don't know in fact. Maybe shortest note prevails would permit more flexibility because it permits to stop to think about the chord if there is just a few chords within the measure bar. Example : X:1 T: M:3/2 L:1/8 Q:1/4=95 K:Am [A6c6e2(b] c')(b a)g (fe) [A2d2f2] [c2z] e | (I don't know how slurs would react if it's the melody note is the first in chord) Another issue is the one about the [G,,B,,D,]8 There is a considerable benefit: brevity. If you've written many melodybass pieces, you'll have done a helluva lot of [G,,8B,,8D,8] stuff that would have been more readably written [G,,B,,D,]8 . We have had several postings in this list over the years from people who've tried to do that and been surprised to find it didn't work. It's so intuitively sensible that it *ought* to work. That's true it's clearer to read, and quicker to type. Will it be adopt such ? So it would also mean [G,,B,,2D,]4 == [G,,4B,,8D,4] ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] Abacus printing problem
I've reported in the past a print problem for abacus (it prints only parts of the score (- the key, time signature, the notes but not the tails, the bar lines but not the staves). I've tried to print something else on an other computer with an other printer (Canon BJC-210, the first time it was an old HP) and it's exactly the same problem. Has anyone who downloaded Abacus succeded in printing something with a printer other than an Epson ? A minor bug also, I had a tune with a comment after the key K:C % transposed from G after loading in abacus, I get then : K:C%transposedfromG ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] RE : Different-size note heads
With the current syntax, a { can't be
followed by a digit. So the suggestion is to allow a digit after
{ as
a note size.
Wonderfull idea !
Maybe I ask too much, but is it intended to have the possibility
to have those small notes in parenthesis also ? We can find this
notation in some partitions. But it's not primordial.
Presumably this will be fairly rare, so an alternative would be
to use
the
letters H---Z. For example, abc could have something like
!this note has a tiny head!
/.../
|ABc Qe fg| or |ABc [Qe3f3g3]|
I personnaly find this less elegant, because we always get
confused with a new letter which is not a note, it's less readable
than to use an other ascii character such as {1
And with John Chamber suggestion, it gives the possibility to have
different note sizes.
And eventually it's maybe possible to redefine the different {1 {2
{3 etc. with your system so that we could have not only different
sizes, but also different shapes (notes between parenthesis,
between brackets...), like for example in html coding with the
h1 h2 ... tags which may looks different if you redefine them
with css.
U:{2 = !this note has a tiny head!
U:{3 = !this note has a head between parenthesis!
U:{4 = !this note has a head between brackets!
U:{5 = !this note has a less tiny head than {2! etc.
of course we should also find standardized shortcuts for the
different styles (for example !smallhead!, !tinyhead! etc.) :)
Alternatively, we could use abcm2ps-like commands to redefine the
style of the heads :
(like for %%measurebox etc.) %%headstyle 3 parenthesis ,
%%headstyle 4 brackets , %%headstyle 5 tiny1 %%headstyle 6 tiny3
etc.
!smallhead! doesn't convey any inherent *musical* information
about
the work, it's solely related to the printed form.
one interesting feature of the abc notation is it can be...
printed !
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[abcusers] re : Abacus 1.0.0
- I didn't managed to print scores with my HP DeskJet 520 Printer. It works OK on my Epson Stylus 440. I'll try it on other printers to check this... I can't see the point of taking up valuable space on the screen for something you aren't using all the time. But for browsing several tunes it could be usefull. Maybe if this subwindow would stay on top and doesn't disappear if we load a tune (so we could move it at a corner of the screen), then we could choose another tune and so on. (And eventually close it when we don't want it any longer with the x on the top) I think all you are asking is for Full ABC to be full screen. In fact it's for full abc not to use a subwindows (in option) : for example AbcMus allows to change in the options full edit of abc (called here raw edit) is default. But for those who prefer, it's always possible to have a more user friendly header editor (like the default editing in Abacus). but processes only the tune we want to display. (Abacus should do the same It does. ok, it's true the crash I had was for a file containing a tune with a wrong X: code (with a letter). For other crashes it was on request :) (generally when they were V: ) Don Whitener said : I wonder... I get exactly the same presentation. The application runs at full (real full) screen, covering even the task bar, and the middle restore button is grayed out and inactive. I have no other application that does this. It's possible to emulate the middle restore button if you double click on the title bar, then the application will be in a more normal window and you can resize it. An other thing strange I noticed was the scrollbar at the side of the partition area didn't follow the general scrollbars adjustement in MSwindows, I have them very thin, but this scrollbar wasn't. I would have thought most people wouldn't have it and those with less computer expertise would be put off by lots of technical jargon along the lines of If you've got this file do this but if not do that. Windows XP (Pro) includes msvbvm60.dll as standard. I'd *guess* that it comes along with 2K and ME as well I've them too but I run only MSwin98, I've certainly installed an other program with this file in standard. In fact many people do install upgrades for M$ for VB support, DirectX etc., or they install many programs in general, so most of those libraries a easily available. You could ask the users here who tried your program to read the file St6unst.log (you know what ? they can even open it with Abacus !) to check if they already had some of the dll. If you propose different packages -- it's just an advice --, you could prevent people to look for an other abc application if they think yours is too heavy to download. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] re : suggestions for [A4A2] notation
Bryan Creer : I've gone for highest note prevails in the counting of the times so you can do things like - X:1 T:The Cotillion C:Trad (Bosham Band) M:4/4 L:1/8 K:G [G4D4][d4B,4]|[B2D4]AB [G2B,4]AB|[c2E4]B2[A2D4]G2|[FD4]GAF [D3A,3]D| I've seen that Skink happily supports this notation too. (and multiple undo, I've just noticed that) I hope more and more programs will be able to handle this, and maybe the standard could allow it too. Perhaps it should be by length of the first note in the chord. Jack Campin said : This is a very good idea, but the semantics I'd need in every instance where I've wanted it would be that the *shortest* note counts. This is more reliable than hoping you don't get pedal notes above the melody. I've thought to that too, in fact I find it logical to use a tie before a new barline instead of having notation like that : cd[C4e2]d2[c2A,4] | [A,2d]e[B,4f2]e2[d2G,4] etc. Here is an example : (I've just realized that my notation is incorrect, I should have begun with cd | [C4e2] etc. to avoid the ties and to be on the correct strong beat. This tune was one of the first I've transcribed. Nevertheless it's just an example to illustrate the idea of this [A4A2] notation) X:4 T:Rapunsel C:Kari Rueslåtten D:Demo Recordings O:Norge Z:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- http://anamnese.fr.st M:4/4 L:1/8 Q:1/4=100 K:Eb cd[C4e2]d2[c2A,2-] | [A,2d]e[B,4f2]e2[d2G,2-] |\ [G,2c]d[C4e2]d2[A,2c2] | [G,2=B]c [G,2B2][C4c4] | /.../ In an other tunes, I was really stuck because I had already 3 voices, it was a really long tune, and I didn't want to had a 4th voice full of rests just to add some extra notes in the last mesure, so I think there is a real need for such a notation... In guitar it's often there is a pedal note (or a chord) whereas there is a melody line above, and to have only a voice is more logical in a certain way. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] re : Skink sound, Abacus 1.0.0, and iabc
Eric it still has problem with the sound, Have you tried the latest version (that just came out last week)? I still have problems playing in Linux, but I didn't hit any problems on Windows in the small amount of testing I did there. Of course I did :) I'll always check new version of any program. For the sound, on MSwindows I have the java version recommended, and I have sound, but it's not fluid at all, music slows down and then speeds up. It may come from my computer that is not powerfull enought (350 Mhz), I don't know, but if it's the case, so many pple may have the same pb. I know AbcMus and Abacus are quickly converting the abc to midi before reading the midi file, so there is not this sort of problem. (Will it be possible on Abacus in the future to play (roughtly) notes when you enter them ?) I've downloaded on a friend's computer who have the adsl the newest java from sun for windows and linux. When I'll grab them, I'll try skink with this, it will maybe better. Otherwise, I do appreciate much the fact it doesn't stop any longer for code it doesn't understand, so we can see the other tunes (and often the tune incriminated if this is a minor error it detects.) It even helped me to find syntax error in my tunes. Concerning Iabc, it's the same, it works better now it don't process all the tunes in a tunebook, but processes only the tune we want to display. (Abacus should do the same, since it's instable with some code it doesn't understand, but on the other hand it's less sensitive than skink was) Someone said there was a pb with the time signature for iabc, it is always 4/4, it's strange because there was not this problem in the previous version. For both Iabc and Abacus, the fact we have to use a subwindow is less powerfull than the list in Skink, this one is always displayed. I've just seen we can even browse the tune with the up and down arrows, so it's a pleasure to use it for this purpose. You can select several continuous tunes with shift, or individual tunes with ctrl, it's very conveniant, and then you can make a sort of playlist for printing, playing etc.. On Abacus it's true it's quick to open the tunelist with ctrl+o , but if you select a tune with the arrows, you can't validate with enter... I'll test Iabc on Linux as soon as possible, but on MSwindows it has the habit to crash badly the whole system, often when you open a second file after a first one, so it's better to close Iabc between two files (I've tested Iabc on 2 computer with Mswindows98 and it's the same pb) Back to Abacus, I've just tryied to create a tune with it, and it crashed (I made a mistake and entered Q:1/48=120 instead of 1/8) so I've lost my tune :( Could it save the abc tune before crashing ? ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] re : Abacus 1.0.0 launch
Abacus is an abc editor/player/printer programme - Windows only I'm afraid. Nice program ! I like when there are new abc applications, so I can complete my collection :) The print quality is adequate without being outstanding. The display is good. I'll give you my first impressions, if it can help. It's quite long, but you'll get my full impressions. 1) Installation and download - For the future you should write down on your homepage which version is the current for Abacus (and ABCcheck as well) so pple would know if they have to download a newer version or if they already have it. - Are the different dll and ocx files standard or specific for your program ? Are they necessary for the download or could the user already have them in his system ? Those two files are quite big : msvb...dll mscomocx hmhm, I see in the installation log : ACTION: SystemFile: C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM\MSVBVM60.DLL (File currently on disk was already up to date) so this *huge* file was not compulsory to download. 2450 ko is really much for an application ! (but to be honest I was occupied on Irc when I downloaded it so it was not really a pb for me.) It could retain some pple to try it. You should made different packages, a full installation one and a light one with only your program, and/or propose to the user to download from your site the libraries they don't already have. If I remember well it was the same pb for ABCcheck (which is an interesting prg too). 2) System : - It's a pity it doesn't support drag n drop - ark, it doesn't support either command like ctrl+A for select all - it crashes from time to time. (execution error 13. Incompatible type or something like that) There are several reasons, but I find among others I had a tune with X:12b . I know it was a silly idea, but it is a tune in addition in a tunebook and I don't want to change the order of the others. I could have found something better but it's a weak point in a program if it can't handle this sort of problem. It cashes too in some copy/paste functions, or if I try to save it at a wrong place, or in the open subwindow if I click on delete in some cases. - when you start Abacus, it comes in a sort of full screen mode and hide the MSwindows taskbar and you have to resize Abacus (like for some old windows 3.11 applications) : ok, it's a minor pb, but a bit annoying. - there is not shortcuts for play / pause / stop 3) functionalities : - I really like the real-time display of the partition !! It's really efficient and nice to see the notes displaying when you type them in abc ! - The way of changing clefs, L: fields etc. is good also. It's not compulsory to have those tools, but it's user friendly and nice for newcomers in abc. - redraw score is not always active (it becomes active after a print). The fact that Abacus is displaying notes when you type them in in abc implies maybe the drawback the display is quite loose : I mean if you display music, and then an other application is coming in front of the display window, the notes disappear, and you have to redraw them. I type a space in the abc and then the partition come back, but it would be great not to have lost it. 4) others : - I didn't noticed bugs in the parsing, but I didn't tested all my tunes either. It seems to be accurate at least. It seems to support all the abc fonctionnalities of the abc standard. And, well, it's great : IT SUPPORTS NOTATIONS like [Af2], displaying a chord with a quarter A below a half f. If only it could inspire other applications to act such... I don't know why it's not in the standard, with for example a rule saying that in such a notation the longest note prevails in the counting of the times, for example X:1 T:Derrière chez nous M:2/4 L:1/8 Q:1/4=140 K:F G2GF | G3 A| BAGF | G2 DE | F2FE | F3 G | AGFE | [D4A2] :| could be legal and /.../ | AGFE | [D4A6] :| wouldn't be (or the result would be unexpected) Let's go back to your application... - I didn't managed to print scores with my HP DeskJet 520 Printer. I'll try with an other one on another computer. It works well if I print with ghostscript but not directly to my printer : there are parts of the partition that didn't print at all (like big parallel lines, and it's not because the cardridge is empty !) - The few I saw of the printing is that the staff lines are too thick. I noticed with abc to postscript tools that depending they are printed on ink printers or laser printers, the same lines may not be the same at all, if it's too thin it may display well on ink printers but not on laser printer (but we can find compromises). You could think to have an option to select the thickness of the lines. - If I play music, display full abc and then type ok to close the full abc display, it stops playing. - I would maybe have prefered the playlist selector on a window more accessible (at the side of the main window, instead of a subwindow) - The playing is not as good as abcmus (it's a bit
[abcusers] RE : suggested patch for abcm2ps-2.11.3
I don't know if JF Moine often read this list (from times to times he posts here) so I take the right to answer this question (and because I regulary download the latest Abcm2ps release) : First, abcm2ps is now at version 3.0.20 (at least) !! Is this 2.11.3 version from the sourceforce.net ? The last time I checked the abc.sf.net page (recently) I saw there was still a very old release (can't remember the number). Such a pity. There should be just a link to http://moinejf.free.fr and the outdated files should be deleted. You should check it, there is much improvement ! Or maybe the 2.11.3 is the lastest stable version but I find the 3.0.20 as stable. Your contribution has been welcomed and used because it is said : Version 3.0.20 - 02/07/14 '-N' command line option extension (thanks to John Fattaruso). Have the decorations tied to the note under the slurs. -- I sent this patch to Jean-François about two weeks ago and haven't heard anything whether he might consider it for a future version, so I thought I'd just post it here for anyone who might need such page numbering in the In fact since I need to have the page numbers at the bottom, I find conveniant to use the perl script pspage done by Christoph Dalitz. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] some bugs in abcmus2 beta
In abcmus2 beta 1 In the change default length tool, I had a ^f^g a (in K:Am), and the tool gave ^f2_a2 a2 . I expected ^f2^g2 a2 instead, without shifting notes... (it occurs when the whole tune is processed) Worse, this same tool doesn't seem to care about the rests when it changes length... The way AbcMus interprets the !trill! command, and lower/upper mordents as well, is amazing ! It sounds really realistic for baroque guitar music for example. I like the way AbcMus can interpret the rhythm field, it gives something to the music, but indeed sometimes when practicing music one may need not to have the predefined rhythm definitions because other musicians may not play like that, so the only way to temporary disable this feature was to make a backup of the abcstyle file and remplace it with an empty file... When I export multipart files to midi, there is sometimes some notes in chord which are skipped. Sometimes AbcMus crashes when performing an undo, but I can't describe it better when it occurs. I had also some sequence notes (with slurs) which make AbcMus to give unexpected results. Ask if you want to have a tune with this sort of error, and a picture displaying the difference if the tune is processed with abc2midi (and gives the right notes) I've downloaded AbcMus2 beta2 but I don't see the difference with AbcMus2 beta1 ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] RE : tune finder
That depends. Do you just want the information to be present somewhere in the headers? Or would you like software to be able to use the information sensibly? both if possible. I want pple to be able to find again this tune if they had only the tune somewhere else, or to come back later to find new tunes in the tunebooks I'm making. But on the other side, if it can enable software to be more efficient, I'll try to follow the rules. I may use this F: field in the future Someone at http://www.terra.es/personal8/niltoni/ made a copy of many tunes found everywhere, and if most of them had the original url somewhere in the tune, it would help to find the rest again. K:D % EDorian This made it clear that the transcriber knew the correct key and mode, and was intentionally giving incorrect information. Presumably I think that the transcriber wanted to help people like me reading D key ? oh, so there is 2 sharps in it. If I read EDorian I have to find my table with all the modes, find the right one, and then the number of accidentals etc. ( but it's true with abc software displaying the notes, you have all that immediately... ) I don't think the transcriber was a sort of musical terrorist whose aim was to puzzle softwares related to mode. this was to defeat people using software to look for things by key. Isn't the problem for mode instead ? We have the right key, but the right mode is after the % The problem with the Key/Mode issue is that the ionian mode corresponds to the key, so if I intentionally decide to write the key and don't care about mode, there is always someone saying : hey, you're wrong, it's not in the ionian mode, it's in dorian/phrygian etc. In the C key there is a specific notation for the aeolian, we had a small m to have Am, for mixolydian we add Mix to have GMix etc. Why isn't there any specific notation for the ionian ? With CMaj for example, we would be sure it's in the ionian mode, and there whould be no confusion with the C key. When people do things like this, there's a real temptation to throw up your hands, and go play some tunes to cool off. I thought it was a good idea to use 2 K: fields to write both the mode and the key, but this solution of K:D % EDorian is maybe better. Will you forgive me if I use it in the future ? :) If it generalizes, it will be maybe easier for a cleaver script to understand it, and better than to give a bad result for a bad choosen mode in the K: field. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] RE : ABC source code license? what I'm planning...
Well, I suppose DNA is coding. yes, and there is enven a Dna2Abc on sourceforge ! http://dna2abc.sourceforge.net/ (and it doesn't seems to be a joke for Chris Walshaw's Abc international) I want to build an application that depicts classical dance via language scripts and a musical score (piano). great idea ! I've searched the web for a long time to find if there was an equivalence to abc for dance notation, but only for folk because I learn many fine dances and I'd like to archive them in a conveniant way. From the music and language, 1 or 2 dancers would be animated before your very eyes. Do you know Don Herbison-Evans' projects ? He has made some (free) softwares that can do this, using the Labanotation dance system as basis. http://www-staff.mcs.uts.edu.au/~don/pubs/nudes.html (and there is also the program called Led) Unfortunately, I don't find the labanotation suits well folk dances, maybe it's a bit complex for this type of music. The Feuillet notation is not better for this purpose. I'd really like to find a system for dance which would be as simple as the abc for music. Any suggestion ? Or would your future work suits this need, Jeff ? ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] RE : tune finder
It's maybe possible for your tune finder to use this code to archive the tune (I don't know exactly how the tune finder works) and if there is no replicant of the tune (i.e. if the original website where the tune has its origin is down) to use it nevertheless, so the code would mean only it's not an original tune, you've been warned, and then if there is allready several tunes with the same name and code, don't display it. For example I've made a set of tune I play with my folk band, I transcribed some and there is a copy elsewhere on my homepage, and copied others available on internet, but I want to present this abc file nevertheless. But it's really no use for the tune finder, and I guess there is several other homepages and tunes in this case. | Could we directly insert a little code at the beginning of an abc | file to exclude it from your tune finder, like for the robot | exclusion header in html files? Actually that's not a bad idea. I've been a bit busy lately; not time to answer much email. But I'll try to get arount to it. But there are the contra-indications ... I use the Z: field to write I made the transcription, and give then only the email adress. I found conveniant to write the Url after it, so I don't use the F: field for this because I would have been redundant. Do you think we should generalize the use of the F: field for this purpose ? We've had occasional suggestions that we use the F: header line to contain a tune's original URL For example, all the tunes by Marin Marais (there is some on the web). Wouldn't anybody transcribing stuff that complicated put it into a separate file or identifiably distinct site and advertise the fact? yes, but we can find the main theme for some pieces : X:1 T:Alcyone T:Menuet pour les bergers et les bergeres C:Marin Marais B:XVIIIeme M:3/4 L:1/4 Q:C4=60 K:C a f g | a2 d | g/f/ e d/^c/ | d2 A | a f g | a_b a | g fe | e3 :| |: fg f | cd c | A_B A | A F G | A f A | B B^c | d ^cd | d3 :| There is also available by Marais in abc the famous Airs des Matelots, which can be found in the english tradition under the title : The female sailor, or Matelotte. I don't know where this great tune finds its spring... ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] JC's tune finder
Concerning John Chamber tune finder (I find it very useful and use it to find new tune, but I download always the full version of the abc file on the original site, so if I'm a bit fool, it's obviously for other reasons) Jack Campin said : assuming you haven't been fool enough to fish a single tune off the web with the Tune Finder discarding its context. Sometimes I feel the need to find a tune by composer, but it doesn't seems to be possible from JC tune finder. For example, all the tunes by Marin Marais (there is some on the web). It could be nice to be able to search your tune finder by any abc fields, like by D: for example if you like Malicorne and want to find some traditional tunes they've made a cover of. John Chamber said : (And I'll once again mention that I can exclude sites or URLs from my indexes. If you don't want something indexed, send me the URL. Could we directly insert a little code at the beginning of an abc file to exclude it from your tune finder, like for the robot exclusion header in html files ? I hope people won't use it to fool your tune finder, but to prevent it from indexing useless tunes (for example I've made a 'favorite' for my own purposes and it's a replication of other abc files, and I've also some tunes which are still works in progress or temporary files (I sent it to my website for backup only) This code could be in the form : %%tunefinder-exclude * so it could exclude the whole file. Or if it's possible it could exclude some particuliar tunes in it (identified with the X: field) : %%tunefinder-exclude 1 2 4 7 8 12 21 34-42 According to my server logs, this happens but isn't common. The most common pattern is that a search request is followed by one or more requests for a GIF with the same title. This accounts for roughly 2/3 I can't compare my work with your, but I can also see what pple are seeing on my homepage. I've seen that most of them looked at the pdf version (I only propose abc or pdf), and for some tunebooks didn't care at all at the abc one (I would have made the opposite) For example for the month of june : /abc/orain.pdf 20 and none of them downloaded the abc version and out of the 28 who came on my page about Tielman Susato, 10 downloaded the partitions in pdf but none looked at the abc file. Strangely it was the opposite for my book of song by H. Davenson : abc/davenson.abc124 abc/davenson.pdf99 I was quite amazed to see how many pple went on my main page just for one month abc/abc.html367 but few downloaded all my set of tunes abc/anmn_abc.zip19 I've recently added a search engine, and it can also reveal that pple can come on the abc page I made for other purposes : I've found in the log file things such as : 35 tour vynyle disque axel bauer nothing to do with abc or folk / ancient music :) ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] Arbeau's Orchesography
I've been warned of an Arbeau's Orchesography with the FULL TEXT in middle french, and abc, available on line at : http://graner.net/nicolas/arbeau/ I thought first the author made an other abc transcription (there is already one by Steve Mansfield, by me and several tunes were transcribed by Frank Nordberg) but he explained to me he transcribed the notes in his own notation and then processed a perl script to generate html files with gif notes (you should have a look to it, it's really amazing !) so his transcription really looks like the Arbeau one. Then the abc file was generated as well. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] re : shortcuts in Muse
Furthermore a snippet that is copying may alter the context for following notes (for instance it may include a K:) so that makes about 8 variants that's why I prefer using plain text abc instead of graphical notes, so this is only the bare text I copy : in fact for transcribing I don't need much to transpose, change key (AND use the same part in a different key) etc. But that's true some other pple could need those features. An idea : ctrl+x / c / v would copy only the music ignoring the original context, but ctrl+x / c/ v + right mouse button or something else could display a popup windows (like in Cakewalk for example) with the options you mentionned. But appart to this, an abc application which could use both abc text and graphical staffs would be great (instead of just import / export abc), like an Abc2Win version 3 ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] re : RE: Intergalactic naming conventions
| Lewes, East Sussex, England. Take a look at=20 | http://whatson.brighton.co.uk/folk/. ... The URL worked, but there were no clues there about which planet it might be on. try to do a WHOIS on it, a DNSLOOKUP, a TRACEROUTE, or even a FINDPLANET and you'll probably find it. Finally a bright side to the Norwegian/Danish alphabet. I'm fairly certain my present home town is the only place on earth named Bodø ;-) When I've been in Bodø and Nord-Norge in winter (Jul), I thought it was HEAVEN (or to be more correct, VALHALL) ! :) ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] modes (again)
| ... It was already too late to change when I first mentioned
it.
Since it's not possible to add a new field dedicated to mode, I
thought it was possible to write 2 K: fields in a tune, if
necessary : the first one for the signature, and the second one to
*precise* the mode used, so clever applications or users could
find out what is mode and what is the signature (and the others
will have at least something to find the right key from and play
the right accidentals). So that way I guess no application would
be fooled by a new standard.
chance of getting the tonic or the mode right. The people running
the
project will make the reasonable rule that if the key isn't
obvious,
just type the major key that gives the same signature. In such
cases,
it would be better if the transcriber could type only the
signature.
that's just what I do so I'm always sure to give the right key,
the way it should be displayed and not how it should be understant
- though the experts whould find themselves the right mode.
1)
Sure, but I've seen quite a few tunes with K:D and then every
single C in
the piece naturalised. In those cases invariably the description
is half
right - the tonic D is right, but the mode is wrong. If the key
signature
so does it means the right notation was to write K:Dm ?
2)
It could be worse. There are a number of tunes that are played
in
both major and minor. I've seen several cases where one of them
was
written with a major key signature and then accidentals
written
throughout to put it into minor. One can get a certain
perverse
thrill from seeing something so idiotic actually make it into
print.
for 1) and 2) : is it this kind of thing you're thinking about ?
X:11
T:Yester House
R:Reel
C:Niel Gow
O:Scotland
A:Inver (Perth)
B:(n°233) Gow Collection of Scottish Dance Music - Oak
Publications
Z:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
M:C
L:1/8
Q:1/4=130
K:A
a | eA~ec d=GB=g | eA~ec ef=g(b|\
a)f=ge d=GBd | ~ed=gB {B}A2 A :|
B | Aaaf =gGBd | Aaag aAab |\
=gbeg dGBd | ~ed=gB {B}A2 AB |
Aaaf =gGBd | Aa~ag aAab |\
=gbeg dGBd | ~ed=gB {B}A2 A |]
I've transcribed it as it was written in the book I own. All the G
are written with a natural in front of them, and the signature is
A. I've made a second version of it, which seems more logical to
me (and unlike the above it sounds good in AbcMus).
X:12
T:Yester House (2)
R:Reel
C:Niel Gow
O:Scotland
A:Inver (Perth)
B:(n°233) Gow Collection of Scottish Dance Music - Oak
Publications
Z:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
M:C
L:1/8
Q:1/4=130
K:D %% or AMix ?
a | eA~ec dGBg | eA~ec efg(b|\
a)fge dGBd | ~edgB {B}A2 A :|
B | Aaaf gGBd | Aaag aAab |\
gbeg dGBd | ~edgB {B}A2 AB |
Aaaf gGBd | Aa~ag aAab |\
gbeg dGBd | ~edgB {B}A2 A |]
Was the A key written in the original version to make understand
it's in a A mode ? Can we write then it's in AMixolydian ?
Was it a bad choice in the original book ?
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[abcusers] Muse
And incidentally, was Muse one of the programs that you tried? Yes, the first programs I tried when I first heard of abc (when I discovered internet as well) were Muse and Abc2win. To be honest, I was first reluctant to Muse because of the drawing of the notes. But I tried it anyway and find there was several useful options / editing facilities. It can many features, including transposing (good idea the transpose, play different look the same and conversely) and several more I didn't catch yet. And it's really efficient to enter notes with it. But I made a separation between pure abc applications and programs such as Muse, MusEdit, TablEdit, MusicEase, Stringwalker etc. which can a bit abc but are not dedicated to it (the fact that none of the above can edit the abc source code denote that, and they even not have multivoice support, and advanced abc features). Muse seems to be tablature-oriented and it seems to do that well. Someone asked one day for a guitar tablature application and I recommended to try TablEdit and Muse. Generally speaking, I think the main drawback of Muse is the display, can't you use true type fonts, like Abc2Win ? There is certainly domain public musical fonts you could use. It's true the apparence is not primordial for working on music, but it could be an advantage to look nicer. The way of changing options, only in the menu bar, is a bit frustrating because if you want to configure the guitar tab for example, you have to go to options muse settings tablature generation settings [option to change] several times : if there was a pop up window with all the tablature generation settings, you could change this quicker. To be able to select with the mouse would be better than to select with and (or to have the choise of the two) About tablatures, I'm using to generate ascii tab a freeware called PowerTab. It has an efficient feature called Shifter tool and can shift string-wise or fret-wise, so it's quite quick and easy to configure several notes as wanted. Muse goes a bit further in configuration, but it's longer to configure. There is also something strange. I've guitar partitions (no tab, only partitions) in abc and I use two voices (or more) because it's not possible to write chords with different note lengths in abc (like [E2A2c2e/] and unfortunately nobody seems to complain about this limitation), so it doesn't work well in Muse if I import the abc, but it's not the problem if I use a converted midi file. The problem is the tab should look like this : Gavotte 1 (R. de Visée) 2/2 ||--0---0-|-0-|--5---3-|-1-3-0---0---0-|-0-|| ||o-1-|-1--0-3-10-|-1--|-0-|-0o|| ||--2-|-2--2--1---|-2--2-0-|-2-0-1-|-1-|| ||--2-|---|-2--3---2---|-2---3---2-|-2-|| ||o---|---||---|--o|| |||---||---|---|| and it can display well in Muse, but after exportation to .tab ascii file, the chords are now arppegio : E---0-|---=---0-|-0-=---| B-1---|-=---=---|---1-0---3---1---=---0-| G---2-|---=---=-|-2-=---2---1---=---| D-2---|-=---=---|---| A-|-|---| E-|-|---| 5---=---3-|---1---3---0---=---0---0-| --1---|-0---| 2---2-0---|-2---0-1-| --2-3-=---2---=---|-2---=---3---2---| --|-| --|-| Maybe I missed an option ? The = for tied notes are not really relevant in an ascii tab. To have only the bare tab could be better (or to have the choice to get rid of the =). In fact it's still possible to replace with a text editor the = by - o so it's not a real problem. PowerTab is worse and write the tied notes by repeating the note with the same in brackets so it's not possible to get rid of them (unless write a little macro in perl maybe) I think I counted that Muse has about 70 shortcuts defined (so there's heavy use of Ctrl+this and Shift+that). It would be a very expert user that knew them all. It's not a pb is those users know the commands they use most. To be able to redefine the shortcuts is also a nice feature (for example I like to use space bar to play / pause if I play fiddle with the computer, it's easier to strike than the 'p') There is also no multiple undo (usefull in music editing) You talked about trying to maintain a download size file close to 300 ko, but I
[abcusers] Modes (and iabc skink)
Iabc doesn't understand the K:Am
That's completely unacceptable; the program should never have
been
released in that state.
It's not very kind for the author. I think it have to : it's good
to see a new application. And as far as I'm concerned, I've never
used modes in the K: fields but only the key definition (K: is for
key isn't it ?). For me C indicate there is no flat or sharp in
the tune, F indicate there is a B flat etc. If in addition the
tune is in the Am or Dm mode it doesn't change the way it is
played or displayed.
It's good if an application can understand modes, but why bother
with them ? The abc draft gives :
K - key; the key signature should be specified with a capital
letter which may be followed by a # or b for sharp or flat
respectively. In addition, different scales or modes can be
specified and, for example, K:F lydian, K:C, K:C major, K:C
ionian, K:G mixolydian, K:D dorian, K:A minor, K:Am
It says : *In addition*, so it's not compulsory. Anyway... most
tunes written for a relative mode don't take care of the seventh
and then it is written in the K: field a Bm instead of D, just
because the tunes begin with B, but there is no ^A in it (as
expected in the Bm mode (in minor harmonic))
I didn't say modes are useless (it's maybe because I don't master
them I don't think I need to write them down), but they should be
an option only. Bryan Creer talked about the idea of having the
mode in a separated field, but as he said it's too late now. I've
noticed that AbcMus have the tendency to privilege modes rather
than key because some tunes heards bad in a key and it plays good
if you use the corresponding mode i.e. with Ab / Fm but there is
also several others such bug (for example Gb / Ebm). I'll write to
the author to give him some feedbacks. For example, if you play :
X:1
T:test
N:you can use it for your telephone :)
M:3/4
L:1/8
Q:1/4=180
K:C
CAB^c2cBA^GF2
K:Gm
C
it won't play as expected. I think it's because I didn't entered
any mesure bar | before the key change , but if it was allowed not
to enter it would be easier to transcribe tunes : I generally
enter mesure bars at the end (but now I know it, so I'll take care
and I'll try to get rid of this bad habit).
K:Am [...]
A2B cBA|BAG AGE|A2B cee|dBA G2({A/G/}E)|
Grace notes gives error in skink
Unfortunately, given the current ABC spec, it should. Grace
notes at
present have only one length; you should have written {AG}
instead.
This needs to be fixed but you can't blame Skink for following
the
rules.
yes, you're right, I didn't remember that. I thought it was the
slur and then the grace notes which caused pb.
there is also a limitation in iabc which cause tunes with a X:
field with a high number to be well processed but it won't be
displayed later.
Okay, all programs have size limits; eventually they always get
increased. If the documentation's up-front about what they are
it's not usually a problem. Putting 955 tunes in one file is a
bit ambitious.
It was for the O'Neill project and the X: field was only for the
reference in the real book.
I found the file on John Chamber's website and there was only 35
tunes in it but it begins at ref. n°971.
the
behaviour of programs that generate many output files from one
ABC
multi-tune input file. None of the Unix ports I've seen on the
Mac
do this in a remotely sane way and I imagine they look just as
bad
on Windows (imagine something that made NT filenames by
truncating
all the tune titles starting The Road to... in O'Neill
Abc2midi can generate several midi files by name (only the 8 first
caracters) or by X: tunes, this way : it takes the abc file's name
and add to it the X: number of the tune (but since I create new
tune by coping an ancien one, I've often replicated X: numbers,
unless I tidy them a bit).
- not lock a file loaded especially if it doesn't write
anything
in it : in iabc it's not possible to make correction in an abc
file (with an ascii editor for example) and then save it to
review
Yes, although strictly speaking Mac programs are supposed to
leave
files open when the data is on display to prevent another program
there is also an alternative, which I found really conveniant :
Some html editor (like Dreamveaver 2 (now this version is free))
give a warning if an application has modified the file already
opened in the editor. So you have then the choise to refresh the
content of the editor with the new file, or to delete the changes
made by the other application (I often use both a text editor and
a WYSIWYG editor to make webpage) and leave the file as before.
Programmers of top (rhmmm) level applications like Word doesn't
seem to have integrated this is *really* useful : they should
program things like this instead of useless easter eggs in their
softwares (like their flipper or flying simulator)
An option I forget : Multiple undo if possible. Some programs even
give the option to choose the undo level to save memory.
for
[abcusers] RE : Re : Renaissance fonts and Abc
Great work, Eric. Any chance of a Mac version? I used to have a program for porting TrueType fonts between MAc and Windows, but it seems I've mislaid it. as far as this font is finished, it will be available for everyone interessed. Pfaedit allow to export to postscript binary for mac so it's probably possible to use it there. My further understanding, again I could be wrong but I've looked into it, is that postscript doesn't handle True-type fonts natively, but the level 3 Postscript version of the language is capable of using the OS's underlying there is several ttf2pfa / pf* / ps utilities, so when the font is designed, it's not really a problem. The main problem is for key mapping, because in the case of application using ttf I guess they have their own key mapping (in fact I don't know I've only tried to use it for abc2win for now). Compared to font designing (even if it's not finished and some had to be redesigned), the mapping is not a piece of cake at all ! That's also why I wish to get rid of the ttf fonts in the future and concentrate more on type 1 fonts, but I have to learn more on them before that (I've downloaded some reference books from adobe). I think there is also some renaissance / medieval musical fonts packages available, but they are certainly for MusixTek or related. And I wanted to have fonts close to the one used in Orchesography (I'll check it but I think it's quite the same in Playford manuscript). It is planned also to have even several font designs, some manuscripts uses narrower notes, differents bass or treble key etc. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] Renaissance fonts and Abc
I've begun to make a true type font for renaissance music, and I hope to adapt it soon for Abcm2ps, or other applications. It can be useful to recreate historical manuscripts, like the Playford one and those of the Village Music Project. The problem is that I can't extract fonts used by abcm2ps because it's not like Abctab2ps which use type 1 fonts. I haven't tried yet to adapt it for Abctab2ps but I think those separated fonts are only for the tablature, and for the partition it seems to use fonts located in syms.c like Abcm2ps. If someone is interested in helping to developp this project, the fonts (in several formats) are at : http://anamnese.online.fr/abc/renaissance_fonts.html There are also comparation between an original manuscript (a tune from Orchesography) and an abc tunes with this font. It doesn't look so bad (it's cleaner but it's quite the same). But it won't work for every tune at the moment. How were designed the fonts in the abc to postscript applications ? And how could I made the necessary changes to make them work for other applications ? I've used pfaedit (http://pfaedit.sourceforge.net/) in order to convert my vectorial drawings into font. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] re : Broken rhythms / triplet rhythms
Here's your example with general tuplets thank you very much Frank ! I didn't know this feature because it's not in the abc-draft 1.7.6 but in the standard-propose.txt so I missed it. It's not really quicker to write than my notation with slurs (sorry, ties... ;) ) but it had the advantage to display the good notation. Will it be revised in the future to make it shortened ? ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] Broken rhythms / triplet rhythms
The convention for writing broken rhythms like A3/ A/ is AA Is it possible to find a way of writing more friendly this sort of notation : (3A-AA ? I don't know if it's common in music but I've several medieval / trad. tunes which are written or played such. For abc2midi there is the notation %%MIDI ratio 2 1 but it's not standardized in other applications or in the abc standard. I've even a partition written with normal dotted notes, but it is indicated above the partition : A3/ A/ = (3A-AA So I had to adapt it for abc : 1st version : X:39 T:La jalousie est cause R: N: O:France Z:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- http://anamnese.fr.st M:2/4 L:1/8 Q:1/4=125 K:Db K:Bbm %%MIDI ratio 2 1 F | BB cc | d2 cc | BB cd | c3F | BB cc | d2 cc | BB cd | c3c | fe dc | B2 BB | ed cB | F3F | BB cd | AA d2 | cB B=A| B3F | BB cd | AA d2 | cB B=A| B3z || W:Derrière la fontenelle, près d'un ruisseau coulant (2x) W:Il y a trois demoiselles qui s'en vont en disant : W: W: La jalousie est cause que l'on vit en tourments ! (2x) second version : X:40 T:La jalousie est cause R: N: O:France Z:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- http://anamnese.fr.st M:2/4 L:1/8 Q:1/4=125 K:Db K:Bbm F | (3B-BB (3c-cc | d2 (3c-cc | (3B-BB (3c-cd | c3F | (3B-BB (3c-cc | d2 (3c-cc | (3B-BB (3c-cd | c3c | (3f-fe (3d-dc | B2 (3B-BB | (3e-ed (3c-cB | F3F | (3B-BB (3c-cd | (3A-AA d2 | (3c-cB (3B-B=A| B3F | (3B-BB (3c-cd | (3A-AA d2 | (3c-cB (3B-B=A| B3z || W:Derrière la fontenelle, près d'un ruisseau coulant (2x) W:Il y a trois demoiselles qui s'en vont en disant : W: W: La jalousie est cause que l'on vit en tourments ! (2x) what can we do for this ? Find a new notation like the AA one ? For example (3AA or better, allow (3A2A ? Or write it like dotted notes but give a command to make software understand this is an other type of rhythm ? (Generalise the %%MIDI ratio n m command, or find a new one, like %%Broken Rhythm ration n m because it may not only concern midi but display as well) ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] antialiasing and test on ps files
pages because the file sizes are much larger and the download
times
that much longer, and because the results on-screen are
unpredictable.
I don't really agree, even if you're right in some extends :
A gif file (I mean a partition) that looks cool on a browser with
16 colours is ci. 9 ko. The same in ps is 29 ko, but converted in
pdf it's only 11 ko (I've tried for a small tune). The difference
is that both ps and pdf will print good, the gif will be ugly if
printed. And it's not true to say there is an antialiasing problem
(at least it can be corrected).
If you want to have a look, I've copied the test files here :
http://anamnese.online.fr/lastened/princess.gif and
http://anamnese.online.fr/lastened/princess.pdf
http://anamnese.online.fr/lastened/princess.ps
To see what my antialiased ps files look like, princess.gif is
just a screen-copy of ghostview. I find it strange that most of
users complain about antialiasing with ghostview when the
antialiasing problem just comes from the lines : if the staff
lines are understood to be quite thick, then ghostview will
antialias them and the results will be awfull (some lines will
be antialiased, some others not). Just change the thickness of the
staff lines, and only the notes will be antialiased and the
display nicer. For example, a ps generateed by abcm2pq will begun
such :
%%BeginSetup
/bdef {bind def} bind def
/T {translate} bdef
/M {moveto} bdef
/dlw {0.8 setlinewidth} bdef
{0.8 setlinewidth} may be too large to display well (but it
prints better on laser printers), so if you edit by hand the ps
files, you can lower the value, to {0.7 setlinewidth} or less (it
displays well with 0.7 for me, at least with graphic alpha turned
to 2, not 4).
You can of course alter the source code of the program in order to
make this value the default (for example to compile 2 programs,
one to generate ps files for the screen, the other for the printer
etc.)
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[abcusers] re : new version of Five Line Skink
Any interest in having Skink as a 'front end' for a command-line tool? in other words, use Skink to enter, proof read and proof-listen, and then invoke abcxxps for final output? yes, why not ? It's a good idea. Even if I can use runabc.tcl for this the ability for Skink as proof read and listen give something more. But for me runabc.tcl runs both on linux and windows, and I can't make Skink works on linux. I've Mandrake 8.2 and they seem to have forgotten to give us a decent / recent JRE. I wonder how Atte Andre Jensen managed to make it run because he has also a Mandrake and they give only an old java console, called Kaffe. I can't download the latest JRE because I've only a slow connection. (If I had an ADSL, quick connection why should I bother to download all those abc files ? I would download music in MP3 format instead ! ;) ) ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] RE : reasons for using abc
I stated on my homepage (in french) the pros and cons (in my opinion) for abc : - Only one whole file for a collection of tunes (unlike midi...) - quick to download (due to compactness (see above) and size) (but you know all that) - quite easy to transcribe (if one can a bit music) and really *fast* to enter score (more than any click'n'whateverelse expensive WYSIWYG software) - the bare partition (unlike abc, not all midifiles can be properly imported in sequencers : there is often notation problems) - can easily generate postscript (and then pdf) files - meeting nice people sharing their works, and more involved in music than in money-making (I hope it will stay like that). So rarely nowadays on internet. - no human expression in it (midi can a bit), no nuancies (but who really care ?) - need to know a bit solfege to use it (but it may be an advantage if it can give pple the idea to learn more musical theory thanks abc) - limited for some musics (in amplitude, even if one can write E, or a'') - an ambiguous name (there is many thinks not related to music with abc in it, so it gives bad clues in websearch : lilypond or mup are unique and more original names (I guess)) - the abc-draft evolves slowly (is it frozen now ?) :) The only faster way to get music into a computer is to play it on a midi keyboard, and even then you are usually going to have to do a lot of post entry editing. maybe to use a notation scanning software. I've never use one but it's certainly faster than abc (abc is good for folk music, but for more than 2 staffs partitions it becomes a bit tricky). We can dream of a software that could scan a paper partition and transcribe it directly to abc. phone (sorry, but I don't know which manufacturer) with an undocumented feature that allows her to enter her own tunes for the phone to play when it rings. The syntax is a bare-bones, stripped-down version of abc. Imagine having access to 100,000 tunes (thanks to John Chambers's web bot) to download into your cell phone! Oh n, please ! Don't reveal the existence of abc to the masses ! The abc sites all around the web will be parasited with those custom your phone rubbish :) ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] RE : Some minor complaints about abc
I have downloaded various things and used abc2Win and whatever behind the scenes tool that runs on one of the sites to create printable sheet music. The minor complaint that I have is that the measures seem to be awefully cramped together. try using a program supporting postscript, like abc2ps : it's hightly configurable, and the output is beautiful (I personally use Abcm2ps, I guess it's one of the most advanced in features and display). It's not so user friendly as Abc2Win but it's more effective (I have great respect for Abc2win because I begun with it, but it's quite old now) ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] multivoice and multiparts
Could it be possible to have a mix of the multivoice and parts features ? I enjoy the possibility in musical programs like trackers to made on one side all the musical part, and in an other how they play together : I would be usefull in abc for complex musical parts X:1 T:multivoice and multiparts M:C L:1/4 Q:1/4=120 %% orderlist P:A1 A3 A1 A2 - - A1 P:B1 B2 B3 B1 - B2 B2 P:C2 C2 C1 C1 C3 - C3 K:C V:1 P:A1 blablabla... P:A2 blablabla... P:A3 blablabla... % V:2 P:B1 blablabla... P:B2 blablabla... % V:3 P:C1 blablabla... P:C2 blablabla... so it could mean that parts A1 + B1 + C2 are played together first, and then A3+B2+C1 etc. (the orderlist would be at the beginning P:A1 A3 A1 A2 - - A1 P:B1 B2 B3 B1 - B2 B2 P:C2 C2 C1 C1 C3 - C3 it means we could have a bass played several times the same, while the melody differs etc. other possibility (maybe more logical) : X:2 T:multivoice and multiparts 2 M:C L:1/4 Q:1/4=120 V:1 P:1 2 3 V:2 P:1 2 4 V:3 P:5 6 7 K:C P:1 blablabla... P:2 blablabla... P:3 blablabla... P:4 blablabla... P:5 blablabla... P:6 blablabla... P:7 blablabla... with possibility to use non-numerical voice labels like : P:cel1 %cello_part1 blablabla... P:contra4 %contrabass_part4 blablabla... It's just an idea. The problem with abc is that it can be quickly confused with multivoices and long scores (the nice Vivaldi's tunes Frank send recently are a good example of this, even if it may not be possible to compact it more in the case of baroque or classical music) What about the document made by Phil Taylor about multivoice support ? Will the solutions proposed incorporated in the next abc-draft ? (1.7.6.1.1 beta, no need to hurry...) ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] re re : slurs and ties
It is just simply incorrect to not make the normal distinction between ties and slurs in any form of musical notation (which does include ABC), and, worst of all, ultimately confusing to users if improper usage is allowed. Ties and slurs are not the same thing, nor are they intended to be, nor were they ever intended to be so far as I know. To not make the correct distinction is just simply unnecessary, in my opinion, and will continue to promote sloppy, or lazy, or ignorant, or individualistic, or non-standard, or what ever you want to call it, practices in writing ABC. we can draw a parallel with the : in fact we don't need this symbol, instead of A A there is the A3/2 A/ notation but it's simplier to use. I don't think people, like me or John Chamber, who want in this case a more tolerant standard wish to confuse pple with the notions of slurs and ties. For example B and G *can't* (physically, in acoustic) be tied, can they ? So we could say this is just a convention to notate slur *both* with - and (). That doesn't mean slurs becomes ties. And a last remark : in french we only use one word for the two : it is called liaison, we would not confuse the two. But I've just read in a musical theory that there was a difference of interpretation for slurs according as the slur concerns only two notes, or several notes : it is said for two slured notes which are at a different length, the 1st one should be emphasized, i.e. : (c2B) z/ d/ (d2c) z/e/ | (e2d) /.../ so it's not so illogical to use - to write a slur/tie (liaison) between 2 notes (whatever they are and whatever that particular slur/tie means) and brackets for slur between several notes (more than 2 at least). For ties between more than 2 notes like A3-A2-|A2 I don't find it really logical to allow (A3 A2 |A2), but why not ? ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] re : slurs and ties
| brackets for slurs when it's possible. If not (if it may confuse) | I'll use - instead. In any case, most musicians don't consider them to be different. This one does. :-) Some folk musicians may not consider them to be different, but I'd argue that most classical musicians do. Oh, didn't I say that I do only the difference when it comes to copy written partitions to abc format ? I don't want to betray the original partition, or at least to loose the fewer informations so I write them. But when I play I don't bother longer with slurs or ties... :) For example in some partitions there is no slurs noted but the notes are obviously legato (especially on fiddle), but most of the time I don't read if there is slurs, one can feel is they are needed or not. And last but not least, it's faster to slur more than 2 notes than to tie them : I'd never think to write for example : c2-B-B-| G-B-F-B | instead of (c2B B | G B F B) | ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] Fingering for instruments... (was : To tell the dancer from the dance)
I've just been transcribing some tunes from Ryan's/Coles for John Chambers' project. These include fingering for the fiddle on some notes. I had to use guitar chords to stick this in, and, to be charitable, it looks awful. The numbers are too far from the notes, and often conflict with other markings on the same notes. abcm2ps allows !0!C!1!D !2!E!3!F !4!G!5!A !+!B c to display nice numbers above staff and the w: field to display them below... simple, easy, efficient... ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] RE : Percussion notation...
Is there some abc software for percussion notation? it won't work for notation purposes, but this feature is suppose to make some rythms : %%MIDI drum string [drum programs] [drum velocities] I didn't managed to make it works correctly, the reference is rather unclear about that. Will this feature be extended in the future ? ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] what does THAT means ??
From: Toby Rider [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [abcusers] BOUNCE [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Non-member submission from [ForgeotEric [EMAIL PROTECTED]] ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse @yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Subject: [abcusers] Action against spam
Toö=O bad yöu can't réad türkisk... they jüst saÿ they appologizzz=Ee for the waÿ the=Ey advertizze thèir marvellous prödücts. KAMPANYALARINIZ iCiN, MUHTESEM KAMPANYA.!! - =3Chtml=3E=3Chead=3E=3Cmeta http-equiv=3DContent-Language content=3Dtr=3E=3Cmeta http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D=22text=2Fhtml=3B charset=3Dwindows-1254=22=3E=3Ctitle=3ETR Rehber 6=3C=2Ftitle=3E=3C=2Fhead=3E =3Cbody background=3D=22http=3A=2F=2Ftrreklam2=2Esitemynet=2Ecom=2Fback1=2Egif=3E=22 topmargin=3D1 leftmargin=3D1 bgcolor=3D=22#CECFFF=22=3E 1) Let's vote about what the opinion is with spam. Do you think it's a good idea that only subscribers can post here. I thought that only subscribers could post on a mailing list. It works like that on the others. I doesn't retain some vicious ppl to suscribe just to spam others, but I least I could decrease the spam abusing (a spam is always an abuse). SO, YES, LET'S MAKE ONLY SUBSCRIBERS POST HERE. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] RE : Linux abc HOWTO
About James Allwright's Linux abc HOWTO : All aspect for beginning with abc and linux seems to be here. But I use Mandrake 8.x, and all was allready configured for me : timidity, gv and ghostscript so I had no problem. With the use of a window manager such as KDE, you just have to clic to get all that, without the use of long commands. (One can easily make an association between midi files and timidity) You could also mention tclabc (JF Moine) which permit to create, display and hear abc file on systems with tcl/tk (on linux at least, I couln't make it works on m$window$) Since it's a Howto, you could explay that using TeX (with abc2mtex) is not the best way for beginners. greetings. (sorry for the delay anwsering this message... in France, Wanadoo (ISP) doesn't permit relay with smtp, so I can only use my yahoo account with pop3, not to send via smtp. So I use web based email and I forget sometimes to post some msgs on my hard disk.) ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] RE : concatenate abc files
Thanks to all who helped me, especially, Richard, Buddha Buck and John. With little modifications, it works well. I'll try to learn in the future more of those basic commands by myself. Richard said : I have various stuff in perl to do these kinds of things - abc-cat, abc-grep, abc-sort, etc etc, by rough analogy to what you'd expect from /.../ comprehensibly commented). Would there be much demand for something like this, or has every other unix-er already got their own ? I'd like to try your perl tools Richard. If you don't mind to send them to me. Thanks in advance. I'll try those made by John Chamber too. Perl seems to be a fantastic script tool. John said : This one abuses the P header line, by generating pages that use a single initial T line to give a title to the page, and then changes the tune T lines into P lines. Each tune then becomes a part in a medley. This sort of thing has led to a bit of debate in the past. For some musical uses, it's a really useful way to interpret the concept of a part. this one abuses also several abc tools or programs I use, when I open such files in them :( This encourages you to put your tunes into single-tune files. Putting a lot of tunes into a big file is convenient for downloading all of them. But if you actually want to use the tunes, a big file pretty much prevents using all the usual directory tools. That's right I don't do intense use of small files and large amount of directories, but I fear that acting such would overflow my hard disk. I've allready so many files on it. Isn't the allocation table limited in some extends ? And for working with abc (editing, creating or searching) I use a really conveniant program, it's called EditPad (www.jgsoft.com), probably the best ascii editor for window$. I wish there would be such an editor for unix-based system. People will say : there is : try Emacs, try Jed, try Vim, try Sed etc. but none of them are so small and easy to use, just for editing many ascii files at the same time and find, copy paste informations in them. For me, abc files with between 20 and 150 tunes in them are at a good length (like for the Village Music Project). But the largest I have is the one with the 1850 O'Neill in them :) ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] abctab2ps and midi
Is there a midi support with abctab2ps ? (It doesn't seem so) Or is it possible nevertheless to hear files in the abctab2ps format ? (Before playing a tune, I need to *hear* it, especially when it concern lute tablatures.) Wayne Cripps Tab can generate Midi files. Is there a way to convert an abctab2p file into this tab format ? There is a tool for converting tab to abc but not in the other way. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] RE : Latest ABC tune search
As a result, my count of known ABC sites is now 239, an increase of 45 from a month ago. My tune index now contains 115097 tunes, this is a great tool you have programmed ! Is it possible to have a top ten list ? :) More seriously, have you a report of those website (with the number of tunes) on your own site ? Part of the argument is the ongoing fear of ABC being Napstered. I hope it will never be the case. Since folk-music is no longer 'pop' (=popular) music, Abc will certainly remains 'clean'. Can we make something in order to help your bot find easier the tunes we've transcribed ? ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] pdf files (re : from ABC to image)
Which version of Acrobat? They keep changing the file format you don't need acrobat to generate pdf files. (see other replies) On my setup (old Macs) I can generate PostScript from some applications for free (I think, haven't tried lately) but creating Acrobat files needs a utility that costs money. Is there a way to do it free on any current platform? I use Ghostscript (gs) (and ghostview), I don't know if it works on mac. I generate ps files first (for my own purpose), and then convert them to pdf - thanks gs-, for my website, because I suspect most users *can't* read ps files /or don't bother about abc files. If they are able to use ps abc (with tools like abcm2ps), so they don't need ps files either. Is it possible to compile and use abcm2ps on a mac ? ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] RE : from ABC to image
Is there any tool to convert abc document into an image? I was using abcm2ps, but when music is too big, it generates two images. Hi, I've seen your website. 2 remarks : 1/ About converting abc to eps files, or other image format, you should use pdf instead because most users have access to a pdf reader (gv, acrobat, xpdf etc.). Postcript files are not easily readable by windows users who don't have ghostscript (=most of them). If most of your tunes are not too much big, you can try to change the size of the abcm2ps output with this : ABCM2PS3-0-1.EXE abc_temp.abc -F fileformat with a file named : fileformat.fmt like that : % parameters for typesetting music scale 0.65 % you can even use a smaller factor continueall maxshrink 0.90 staffsep 30pt etc. It could fit on just one page. You can try also to add commands inside the abc file %%staffsep 49pt %%sysstaffsep 27pt That's what I do when I get a staff alone on a third page etc. 2/ It would be useful to have in addition on you site a zipped file with all the abc in it... for offline. ___ Do You Yahoo!? -- Une adresse yahoo.fr gratuite et en français ! Yahoo! Mail : http://fr.mail.yahoo.com To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
[abcusers] re : jcabc2ps and mystery breton tune
I found the jcabc2ps sources in the repertory :
http://trillian.mit.edu/~jc/music/abc/src/jcabc2ps/
I didn't managed to find any .gzipped file in it. Maybe in
/src/jcabc2ps/ at an other adress (I remember for some years ago
there was an other one) ?
So I used an offline browser to get all the files.
about the mystery breton tune that Tri Yann calls Kerfank 1870,
you said :
Looking through old mail, I ran across this one. Did anyone give
you
any information about the tune? It's a nice tune, and it'd be good
to
have a proper name, etc.
| Anybody know anything about this tune? (I already asked this on
| uk.music.folk, no answer). I got it as a graphics file off the
| Internet years ago and have been playing it ever since, but have
| come across it recently in two different contexts - a Canadian
| fiddler I know plays it, and the first half is similar to the
| opening of the 19th century Welsh hymn tune Alexander. So I'd
| like to know more about it; the Breton title would be a start.
|
| X:1
| T:Breton tune
| N:octave shifts ad lib
| N:tempo unknown, seems to work at any speed
| Z:Jack Campin [EMAIL PROTECTED] abcusers 2002-2-27
| M:2/4
| L:1/16
| K:E Minor
| E2B2 B2AB|c2B2 AGFG|A2A2 B2A2|GFEF G2F2|
| E2B2 B2AB|c2B2 AGFG|A2A2 B2A2|GFEF E4 :|
| E2E2 F2GF|E2E2 FEFG|A2A2 B2A2|GFEF G2F2|
| E2E2 F2GF|E2E2 FEFG|A2A2 B2A2|GFEF E4 :|
Tri Yann gave a name to it, but this is certainly an anonymous
andro that didn't had any name at all (like 99% of the breton
tunes (when they aren't songs of course))
Do you know how to danse Koster Hoed (another breton danse) ? It's
very funny :)
X:9
T:Kost'er Hoed
R:Kost'er Hoed
C:Trad.
O:France
A:Bretagne
Z:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
M:4/4
L:1/8
Q:1/4=175
K:C
AB cB dc {Bd}B2 | cB AG A2A2 | AB cB dc BB | cB AG A2A2 ::
AB cB dc (3BcB | AB cd ee/e/ eg | e2 dc ed {ce}c2 | Bc AG A2A2 :|
I wish there where a danse notation as simple as Abc notation to
use, in order to remember or share trad. danses. (Baroques
notations like Feuillet's one are only graphical, and not easy to
use).
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