Re: [Numpy-discussion] official binaries on web page.
Ralf Gommers ralf.gomm...@gmail.com wrote: but the layout of that page is on purpose. scipy.org is split into two parts: (a) a SciPy Stack part, and (b) a numpy scipy library part. You're looking at the stack part, and the preferred method to install that stack is a Python distribution. OK, I'm not sure that's a great idea, but if we take that as a given: That page could use some clarification about what the heck the stack is, and what its relationship to the scipy and numpy packages is. And I still think it wouldn't hurt to more obviously point people to how to get either numpy or scipy themselves. So maybe my section about the official binaries, but lower on the page. I don't like custom as a title, as that makes it sound like advanced numpy-fu, not where a newbie looking for just numpy is going to look. But it sounds like the real problem is with the surrounding pages--that's the page you find when you try to figure out how to get numpy--if that page is about the stack, it should not be linked to directly from the numpy.org page without explanation. We do have a branding problem: scipy is a package, a stack and a ecosystem/community. It should be clear which one is being referred to when. -Chris ___ NumPy-Discussion mailing list NumPy-Discussion@scipy.org http://mail.scipy.org/mailman/listinfo/numpy-discussion
Re: [Numpy-discussion] official binaries on web page.
On 10/23/2013 8:51 AM, Chris Barker - NOAA Federal wrote: Ralf Gommers ralf.gomm...@gmail.com wrote: but the layout of that page is on purpose. scipy.org is split into two parts: (a) a SciPy Stack part, and (b) a numpy scipy library part. You're looking at the stack part, and the preferred method to install that stack is a Python distribution. OK, I'm not sure that's a great idea, but if we take that as a given: That page could use some clarification about what the heck the stack is, and what its relationship to the scipy and numpy packages is. And I still think it wouldn't hurt to more obviously point people to how to get either numpy or scipy themselves. So maybe my section about the official binaries, but lower on the page. I don't like custom as a title, as that makes it sound like advanced numpy-fu, not where a newbie looking for just numpy is going to look. But it sounds like the real problem is with the surrounding pages--that's the page you find when you try to figure out how to get numpy--if that page is about the stack, it should not be linked to directly from the numpy.org page without explanation. We do have a branding problem: scipy is a package, a stack and a ecosystem/community. It should be clear which one is being referred to when. -Chris ___ NumPy-Discussion mailing list NumPy-Discussion@scipy.org http://mail.scipy.org/mailman/listinfo/numpy-discussion Chris, thanks for taking this on! You very clearly state all of the confusion I have had with Numpy and Scipy distributions and branding. I also agree that relying on a Python distribution to provide Scipy and Numpy is not a good idea. --jv ___ NumPy-Discussion mailing list NumPy-Discussion@scipy.org http://mail.scipy.org/mailman/listinfo/numpy-discussion
Re: [Numpy-discussion] official binaries on web page.
Hi, On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 8:16 AM, jim vickroy jim.vick...@noaa.gov wrote: On 10/23/2013 8:51 AM, Chris Barker - NOAA Federal wrote: Ralf Gommers ralf.gomm...@gmail.com wrote: but the layout of that page is on purpose. scipy.org is split into two parts: (a) a SciPy Stack part, and (b) a numpy scipy library part. You're looking at the stack part, and the preferred method to install that stack is a Python distribution. OK, I'm not sure that's a great idea, but if we take that as a given: That page could use some clarification about what the heck the stack is, and what its relationship to the scipy and numpy packages is. And I still think it wouldn't hurt to more obviously point people to how to get either numpy or scipy themselves. So maybe my section about the official binaries, but lower on the page. I don't like custom as a title, as that makes it sound like advanced numpy-fu, not where a newbie looking for just numpy is going to look. But it sounds like the real problem is with the surrounding pages--that's the page you find when you try to figure out how to get numpy--if that page is about the stack, it should not be linked to directly from the numpy.org page without explanation. We do have a branding problem: scipy is a package, a stack and a ecosystem/community. It should be clear which one is being referred to when. -Chris ___ NumPy-Discussion mailing list NumPy-Discussion@scipy.org http://mail.scipy.org/mailman/listinfo/numpy-discussion Chris, thanks for taking this on! You very clearly state all of the confusion I have had with Numpy and Scipy distributions and branding. I also agree that relying on a Python distribution to provide Scipy and Numpy is not a good idea. --jv I know what you mean. I think there are two groups of users out there: 1) Want software, want it now, with minimum fuss; no beef with installer being primarily based at a single company 2) Like to know how everything got onto my computer, strong preference for community-supported distributions I guess that there's a fairly large group 2 in the Python community. For me, that was a powerful reason to switch from MATLAB. Some of this group is just starting, they own Macs or have Windows machines, and they need binary installers. I don't think there's any practical way of shifting people between groups, and trying to do so will likely cause heated arguments. There's no need to prefer one group over the other - we just need to make sure that both groups have instructions and binaries they can recognize as being for their case. As in: (Group 1): The easiest way to get (Group 2): You can also install the stack from community-supported binaries, this is more complicated, but possible by ... Cheers, Matthew ___ NumPy-Discussion mailing list NumPy-Discussion@scipy.org http://mail.scipy.org/mailman/listinfo/numpy-discussion
Re: [Numpy-discussion] official binaries on web page.
23.10.2013 20:10, Matthew Brett kirjoitti: [clip] There's no need to prefer one group over the other - we just need to make sure that both groups have instructions and binaries they can recognize as being for their case. As in: (Group 1): The easiest way to get (Group 2): You can also install the stack from community-supported binaries, this is more complicated, but possible by ... This is pretty much what scipy.org/install.html page currently says. What can be improved is adding more noticeable links to the binaries. I'm convinced that relying on a Python distribution on Windows and OSX is a good idea, and needs to be emphasized over needs of advanced users, who should have enough patience to read the bottom of the page. -- Pauli Virtanen ___ NumPy-Discussion mailing list NumPy-Discussion@scipy.org http://mail.scipy.org/mailman/listinfo/numpy-discussion
Re: [Numpy-discussion] official binaries on web page.
23.10.2013 17:51, Chris Barker - NOAA Federal kirjoitti: [clip] But it sounds like the real problem is with the surrounding pages--that's the page you find when you try to figure out how to get numpy--if that page is about the stack, it should not be linked to directly from the numpy.org page without explanation. We do have a branding problem: scipy is a package, a stack and a ecosystem/community. It should be clear which one is being referred to when. Yep, the scipy.org website has a navigation structure problem, in that the scipy library and scipy stack and community parts are not separated clearly enough. The navigation items for both sections are visible at the same time, the graphical style is the same, numpy.org is on a different domain etc., so it's a bit of a mess. Still an improvement over Moinmoin, though. One option would be to separate the navigation tree of the scipy library part from the entry page. This would likely make things much clearer. -- Pauli Virtanen ___ NumPy-Discussion mailing list NumPy-Discussion@scipy.org http://mail.scipy.org/mailman/listinfo/numpy-discussion
Re: [Numpy-discussion] official binaries on web page.
Hi, On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 10:55 AM, Pauli Virtanen p...@iki.fi wrote: 23.10.2013 20:10, Matthew Brett kirjoitti: [clip] There's no need to prefer one group over the other - we just need to make sure that both groups have instructions and binaries they can recognize as being for their case. As in: (Group 1): The easiest way to get (Group 2): You can also install the stack from community-supported binaries, this is more complicated, but possible by ... This is pretty much what scipy.org/install.html page currently says. What can be improved is adding more noticeable links to the binaries. Yes, sure. Obviously it's a subtle matter of emphasis, and also obviously, that current situation has some people confused. I'm convinced that relying on a Python distribution on Windows and OSX is a good idea, and needs to be emphasized over needs of advanced users, who should have enough patience to read the bottom of the page. I am arguing that whether it's a good idea or not, according to us, is not going affect the guys and gals in Group 2, and that, unless we want to lose or discourage those people, we'll always need to support (and give mind- and page-space to) community-built binary installers. Cheers, Matthew ___ NumPy-Discussion mailing list NumPy-Discussion@scipy.org http://mail.scipy.org/mailman/listinfo/numpy-discussion
[Numpy-discussion] Redirecting f2py output to a logfile (when called via distutils)
In Clawpack, we use numpy.distutils to handle compilation and wrapping of
Fortran source files via f2py. This generates a huge amount of output
(warnings generated by f2py in intermediate steps) that (it seems) can
safely be ignored. However, it's problematic to have pages of warnings fly
by whenever a user installs the package. I would like to redirect this
output to a log file.
I have tried adding
sys.stdout = open('install.log', 'w')
in the setup.py file. This redirects some of the output, but not all of
it. Below I've pasted an example of output that still prints to the
terminal. How can I force all of this output to go into a log file and not
be printed to the screen?
An example setup.py file is here:
https://github.com/clawpack/pyclaw/blob/master/src/pyclaw/setup.py
Some example output that I can't redirect is here:
In file included from
build/src.macosx-10.5-x86_64-2.7/clawpack/riemann/euler_4wave_2Dmodule.c:18:
In file included from
build/src.macosx-10.5-x86_64-2.7/fortranobject.h:13:
In file included from
/Users/ketch/anaconda/lib/python2.7/site-packages/numpy/core/include/numpy/arrayobject.h:15:
In file included from
/Users/ketch/anaconda/lib/python2.7/site-packages/numpy/core/include/numpy/ndarrayobject.h:17:
In file included from
/Users/ketch/anaconda/lib/python2.7/site-packages/numpy/core/include/numpy/ndarraytypes.h:1728:
/Users/ketch/anaconda/lib/python2.7/site-packages/numpy/core/include/numpy/npy_deprecated_api.h:11:2:
warning: Using deprecated NumPy API, disable it by #defining
NPY_NO_DEPRECATED_API NPY_1_7_API_VERSION [-W#warnings]
#warning Using deprecated NumPy API, disable it by #defining
NPY_NO_DEPRECATED_API NPY_1_7_API_VERSION
^
build/src.macosx-10.5-x86_64-2.7/clawpack/riemann/euler_4wave_2Dmodule.c:111:12:
warning: unused function 'f2py_size' [-Wunused-function]
static int f2py_size(PyArrayObject* var, ...)
^
2 warnings generated.
clawpack/riemann/src/rpn2_euler_4wave.f90:2.59:
subroutine
rpn2(ixy,maxm,meqn,mwaves,maux,mbc,mx,ql,qr,auxl,auxr,wave,s,amdq,ap
1
Warning: Unused dummy argument 'auxl' at (1)
clawpack/riemann/src/rpn2_euler_4wave.f90:2.64:
subroutine
rpn2(ixy,maxm,meqn,mwaves,maux,mbc,mx,ql,qr,auxl,auxr,wave,s,amdq,ap
1
Warning: Unused dummy argument 'auxr' at (1)
There is a LOT more of it, of course.
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Re: [Numpy-discussion] official binaries on web page.
23.10.2013 21:06, Pauli Virtanen kirjoitti: 23.10.2013 17:51, Chris Barker - NOAA Federal kirjoitti: [clip] But it sounds like the real problem is with the surrounding pages--that's the page you find when you try to figure out how to get numpy--if that page is about the stack, it should not be linked to directly from the numpy.org page without explanation. We do have a branding problem: scipy is a package, a stack and a ecosystem/community. It should be clear which one is being referred to when. Yep, the scipy.org website has a navigation structure problem, in that the scipy library and scipy stack and community parts are not separated clearly enough. This may help: https://github.com/scipy/scipy.org/pull/31 ___ NumPy-Discussion mailing list NumPy-Discussion@scipy.org http://mail.scipy.org/mailman/listinfo/numpy-discussion
[Numpy-discussion] profiling numpy functions
I have a question about numpy profiling. When I run my script with -m cProfile I see timings for lots of functions, but not for some like np.exp(). How do I see these timings? I don't want to have to work around it by writing a lot of functions like def mynumpyexp(A): return np.exp(A). ___ NumPy-Discussion mailing list NumPy-Discussion@scipy.org http://mail.scipy.org/mailman/listinfo/numpy-discussion
Re: [Numpy-discussion] official binaries on web page.
On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 11:10 AM, Matthew Brett matthew.br...@gmail.com wrote: I am arguing that whether it's a good idea or not, according to us, is not going affect the guys and gals in Group 2, and that, unless we want to lose or discourage those people, we'll always need to support (and give mind- and page-space to) community-built binary installers. Indeed, and also web pages that make it easy to find them, and clear what you are or aren't getting in each case. When updating the scipy site, we do need to keep in mind that people often (most often?) come into a particular page via a link from elsewhere or a search -- i.e. they haven't read the home page, etc. So even if a page is about how to install the entire scipy stack, folks that are searching for just numpy, etc should find what they need -- or links to what they need. This makes me think: apparently there is an offical scipy stack -- and I even found it with a quick google: http://www.scipy.org/stackspec.html There is not a whole lot there, and all the packages in it either currently provide binary installers (or aren't all that hard to build, or Chris Gohlke has built them). So maybe we should have a single point of download for a community scipy stack, compatible with the python.org python install. All of the hard work has been done -- we just need to set it up somewhere (and maintain it) -Chris Christopher Barker, Ph.D. Oceanographer Emergency Response Division NOAA/NOS/ORR(206) 526-6959 voice 7600 Sand Point Way NE (206) 526-6329 fax Seattle, WA 98115 (206) 526-6317 main reception chris.bar...@noaa.gov ___ NumPy-Discussion mailing list NumPy-Discussion@scipy.org http://mail.scipy.org/mailman/listinfo/numpy-discussion
Re: [Numpy-discussion] official binaries on web page.
23.10.2013 22:50, Chris Barker kirjoitti: [clip] This makes me think: apparently there is an offical scipy stack -- and I even found it with a quick google: http://www.scipy.org/stackspec.html If you click More information... on the front page, or About Scipy in the sidebar, it takes you to an explanation that says that the scipy exists and what it is. A newcomer may possibly read that. -- Pauli Virtanen ___ NumPy-Discussion mailing list NumPy-Discussion@scipy.org http://mail.scipy.org/mailman/listinfo/numpy-discussion
Re: [Numpy-discussion] official binaries on web page.
23.10.2013 23:24, Pauli Virtanen kirjoitti: 23.10.2013 22:50, Chris Barker kirjoitti: [clip] This makes me think: apparently there is an offical scipy stack -- and I even found it with a quick google: http://www.scipy.org/stackspec.html If you click More information... on the front page, or About Scipy in the sidebar, it takes you to an explanation that says that the scipy exists and what it is. A newcomer may possibly read that. The reason why it's so obscure is probably that the discussion seems to have mostly been on the Numfocus mailing list, and not here, and I don't remember it being announced at any point. Oh well, -- Pauli Virtanen ___ NumPy-Discussion mailing list NumPy-Discussion@scipy.org http://mail.scipy.org/mailman/listinfo/numpy-discussion
Re: [Numpy-discussion] official binaries on web page.
Folks, After some more discussion here and on the pull request I submitted earlier, here is anew pull request -- I think conforms to what folks suggested, but still makes it a lot easier for folks to find the stand-alone installers if that's what they are looking for. https://github.com/scipy/scipy.org/pull/32 -Chris On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 12:50 PM, Chris Barker chris.bar...@noaa.gov wrote: On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 11:10 AM, Matthew Brett matthew.br...@gmail.com wrote: I am arguing that whether it's a good idea or not, according to us, is not going affect the guys and gals in Group 2, and that, unless we want to lose or discourage those people, we'll always need to support (and give mind- and page-space to) community-built binary installers. Indeed, and also web pages that make it easy to find them, and clear what you are or aren't getting in each case. When updating the scipy site, we do need to keep in mind that people often (most often?) come into a particular page via a link from elsewhere or a search -- i.e. they haven't read the home page, etc. So even if a page is about how to install the entire scipy stack, folks that are searching for just numpy, etc should find what they need -- or links to what they need. This makes me think: apparently there is an offical scipy stack -- and I even found it with a quick google: http://www.scipy.org/stackspec.html There is not a whole lot there, and all the packages in it either currently provide binary installers (or aren't all that hard to build, or Chris Gohlke has built them). So maybe we should have a single point of download for a community scipy stack, compatible with the python.org python install. All of the hard work has been done -- we just need to set it up somewhere (and maintain it) -Chris Christopher Barker, Ph.D. Oceanographer Emergency Response Division NOAA/NOS/ORR(206) 526-6959 voice 7600 Sand Point Way NE (206) 526-6329 fax Seattle, WA 98115 (206) 526-6317 main reception chris.bar...@noaa.gov -- Christopher Barker, Ph.D. Oceanographer Emergency Response Division NOAA/NOS/ORR(206) 526-6959 voice 7600 Sand Point Way NE (206) 526-6329 fax Seattle, WA 98115 (206) 526-6317 main reception chris.bar...@noaa.gov ___ NumPy-Discussion mailing list NumPy-Discussion@scipy.org http://mail.scipy.org/mailman/listinfo/numpy-discussion
Re: [Numpy-discussion] official binaries on web page.
My first stop is always pypi to find the link to binaries. https://pypi.python.org/pypi/scipy however the direct download link points to 0.11 Josef ___ NumPy-Discussion mailing list NumPy-Discussion@scipy.org http://mail.scipy.org/mailman/listinfo/numpy-discussion
Re: [Numpy-discussion] official binaries on web page.
On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 10:27 PM, Pauli Virtanen p...@iki.fi wrote: 23.10.2013 23:24, Pauli Virtanen kirjoitti: 23.10.2013 22:50, Chris Barker kirjoitti: [clip] This makes me think: apparently there is an offical scipy stack -- and I even found it with a quick google: http://www.scipy.org/stackspec.html If you click More information... on the front page, or About Scipy in the sidebar, it takes you to an explanation that says that the scipy exists and what it is. A newcomer may possibly read that. The reason why it's so obscure is probably that the discussion seems to have mostly been on the Numfocus mailing list, and not here, and I don't remember it being announced at any point. Here are (some of?) the relevant threads: http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.comp.python.scientific.user/32928/focus=32939 http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.comp.python.scientific.user/33270/focus=33313 https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/numfocus/scipy$20stack/numfocus/MnRzBhmqXqk/mFGIIbRFWSIJ Ralf ___ NumPy-Discussion mailing list NumPy-Discussion@scipy.org http://mail.scipy.org/mailman/listinfo/numpy-discussion
Re: [Numpy-discussion] official binaries on web page.
On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 10:34 PM, josef.p...@gmail.com wrote: My first stop is always pypi to find the link to binaries. https://pypi.python.org/pypi/scipy however the direct download link points to 0.11 Grrr. IIRC that's because you have to link a page on SF which has the actual binaries, and that link has to be updated by hand which I apparently forgot when making a release. I'd be tempted to replace that unreadable link with http://sourceforge.net/projects/scipy/files/scipy/ and not care about pip/easy_install scanning that page. Binary installers don't work anyway and source bundles are on pypi already, so download_url is mainly for human consumption. Ralf ___ NumPy-Discussion mailing list NumPy-Discussion@scipy.org http://mail.scipy.org/mailman/listinfo/numpy-discussion
Re: [Numpy-discussion] official binaries on web page.
On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 1:45 PM, Ralf Gommers ralf.gomm...@gmail.com wrote: I'd be tempted to replace that unreadable link with http://sourceforge.net/projects/scipy/files/scipy/ and not care about pip/easy_install scanning that page. Binary installers don't work anyway and source bundles are on pypi already, so download_url is mainly for human consumption. until we have binary wheels, then that sounds like a fine idea. -Chris -- Christopher Barker, Ph.D. Oceanographer Emergency Response Division NOAA/NOS/ORR(206) 526-6959 voice 7600 Sand Point Way NE (206) 526-6329 fax Seattle, WA 98115 (206) 526-6317 main reception chris.bar...@noaa.gov ___ NumPy-Discussion mailing list NumPy-Discussion@scipy.org http://mail.scipy.org/mailman/listinfo/numpy-discussion
[Numpy-discussion] Announcing Bokeh 0.2: interactive web plotting for Python
Hi everyone, I'm excited to announce the v0.2 release of Bokeh, an interactive web plotting library for Python. The long-term vision for Bokeh is to provide rich interactivity, using the full power of Javascript and Canvas, to Python users who don't need to write any JS or learn the DOM. The full blog post announcement is here: http://continuum.io/blog/bokeh02 The project website (with interactive gallery) is at: http://bokeh.pydata.org And the Git repo is: https://github.com/ContinuumIO/bokeh Cheers, Peter ___ NumPy-Discussion mailing list NumPy-Discussion@scipy.org http://mail.scipy.org/mailman/listinfo/numpy-discussion
