[biofuel] Seals and hoses ?s
x-charset ISO-8859-1As I've said earlier, I just bought a 1984 VW Vanagon. I'm planning on running it on B100 and SVO in a two tank system. (I'm leaning towards Greasel). My question is: does anybody who knows a lot about VWs know if I will have to replace the seals on my engine? (i.e. are they rubber or something else?) I would really appreciate any knowledgable advice on the matter. I'm not planning on mixing SVO and low sulfur diesel. I hope that the person running their TDI on 20%SVO and 80% low-sulfur diesel has good luck and their TDI keeps running for a long time. .. . but 40,000km on a brand new diesel engine is but a drop in the bucket. namaste, Justin Care2 make the world greener! Protect your right to breathe clean, smoke-free air: http://www.care2.com/go/z/11238/1043 Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Buy Ink Cartridges or Refill Kits for your HP, Epson, Canon or Lexmark Printer at MyInks.com. Free s/h on orders $50 or more to the US Canada. http://www.c1tracking.com/l.asp?cid=5511 http://us.click.yahoo.com/mOAaAA/3exGAA/qnsNAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ /x-charset
[biofuel] Re: Weapons of Mass Deception
x-charset ISO-8859-1--- In biofuel@yahoogroups.com, Walt Patrick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Someone lacking the stones to even sign his post. Please don't swagger around like some testosterone saturated teenager looking for trouble. Look at the email address if you want to see my name. Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ /x-charset
Re: [biofuel] Resurgence of Atkins Diet
If ADM sells less as high carb. food, because people are on the Atkins diet, they will sell more chicken feed, so they win either way. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Buy Ink Cartridges or Refill Kits for your HP, Epson, Canon or Lexmark Printer at MyInks.com. Free s/h on orders $50 or more to the US Canada. http://www.c1tracking.com/l.asp?cid=5511 http://us.click.yahoo.com/mOAaAA/3exGAA/qnsNAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Moral Dilemma...
x-charset ISO-8859-1Bryan, As you point out Todd, I was the first to frame this discussion in the us-them democrat-republican thing, but it was merely an anticipatory post Yup. Pretty sad that. Thankfully life in general isn't orchestrated the same way you would manipulate a conversation. If it were to model your method there would be but birth and death with no trip in between. As for your to wit? PNGV was Gore/Clinton's baby. They saw the writing on the wall and certainly were capable of understanding that while fuel cells hold futuristic benefits, they were and are not a technology that can fill the enormous gap in the interim. It will take 30-40 years at best to convert a liquid fuels infrastructure to a market wide hydrogen economy. And that's under a transportation Marshall Plan. Putting 10 year life cycles on automobiles, on average, these people knew full well that there would be 2 and 3 generations of automobile manufacture before a general onset of fuel cell powered transport could become a reality. That's hundreds of millions of vehicle sales that could have largely been alternatives to present market offerings. But when using your pre-emptive thought process Gore would have scragged PNGV as readily as Bush? Yeah. Right. And the pope is going to convert to Episcopalianism. You really need to get those political scales of yours recalibrated. You seem to think the end results of a dual party legislative/executive cycle are going to yield duplicit results as a single party cycle. There's a big difference between a set of scales at least partly in balance and those where a heavy thumb is always depressing one side.. As for I don't discount them in the least; I simply doubt that anything I can do (within the current electoral system) will make a difference on their actions. Then I suggest you sit on your thumb and spin to your heart's content while the rest of the world picks up your slack. Todd Swearingen - Original Message - From: Bryan Brah [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, February 23, 2004 12:43 PM Subject: RE: [biofuel] Moral Dilemma... As you point out Todd, I was the first to frame this discussion in the us-them democrat-republican thing, but it was merely an anticipatory post. Any time Dubya does something stupid, shortsighted, or reckless, which happens often enough, invariably the lamentation goes up that had he not stole the election from Al Gore, everything would be different. To wit: I can tell you one thing for absolute certain. Had Shrub not been appointed we'd still have PNGV and probably a few 10,000 more hybrids on the road and a myriad of other similar far reaching policies that would benefit future generations rather than lining the pockets of contemporary corporations as is the present destructive trend. How can you be so sure? With Republicans controlling both houses Wooden Al would be hard pressed to pass anything. And while they don't have enough votes to override a presidential veto, they could easily have inserted their environmental rollbacks in appropriations, national security, or trade legislation. Oh wait a minute, that's what they did anyway under GW. Uhhhthere's just one other thing. If you think that you can effect substantial change much beyond what color of socks you're going to wear in the morning, you're going to have to give some long consideration to utilizing whatever yahoos might be in office on any given day - either utilize their stupidity against themselves or utilize their sway. Nice theory, but I don't have 180 million dollars, and as the last election proved, my vote isn't worth squat. As far as utilizing those yahoos in office, they're a lot more conniving and savvy than you give them credit, how do you suggest influencing them, by writing letters and signing petitions? How about protesting, what do you think that will get you besides an entry in the Terrorist (er I mean Total) Information Awareness Database? But you won't get as much done by discounting them. I don't discount them in the least; I simply doubt that anything I can do (within the current electoral system) will make a difference on their actions. -BRAH [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Buy Ink Cartridges or Refill Kits for your HP, Epson, Canon or Lexmark Printer at MyInks.com. Free s/h on orders $50 or more to the US Canada. http://www.c1tracking.com/l.asp?cid=5511 http://us.click.yahoo.com/mOAaAA/3exGAA/qnsNAA/FGYolB/TM
[biofuel] Re: CAFE Au Lait
x-charset ISO-8859-1--- In biofuel@yahoogroups.com, Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The big concern, according to Becker, is that the Bush administration would regulate the fuel economy of light trucks by dividing them into weight or size classes instead of using fleet-wide efficiency targets. While the current CAFE program has two automotive classes -- cars and light trucks -- the new proposal would create additional truck weight classes, with different fuel-economy standards for each classification. In a nutshell, said Becker, the system would produce an incentive for companies to add weight to their cars to bump them up into higher classes and qualify them for looser efficiency restrictions. Interesting. Apparently the new standard is following the recommendations of the http://www.trb.org/ Transportation Research Board of the National Research Council. Please see the report _Effectiveness and Impact of Corporate Average Fuel Economy (CAFE) Standards (2002)_, chapter 6, page 113, finding #12. CAFE might be improved significantly by making it a system based on vehicle attributes. The report suggests the different classes on weight even though it states that the old distinctions between car and truck have broken down. Well, we saw how that went. Now, when bloated Suburbans and Yukons are the favored modes of transport for groceries, it's abundantly clear that car manufacturing has been going anywhere but in the direction of the Pinto. Today a whopping 50 percent of vehicles sold in the U.S. fit into the light-truck category, up from 20 percent when CAFE was implemented. Personal opinion here - I'm wondering how many people will get one of these vehicles once the current fad wears off. They aren't as convenient to drive or park. I am waiting to see what the _next_ vehicle these people purchase will be. Think of the mini-van fad a few years ago. Yes, people still drive them but they don't seem to be the biggest happening any more. Secondly, it appears that the auto makers are getting better at putting the features people want into vehicles that aren't so big. The smaller SUVs, what looks like a station wagon with more ground clearance, seem to be on the rise. I'm guessing this is natural, given that the easiest way to roll out SUVs was to base them on existing truck platforms until next generation designs could reach the market. If you remember minivans in the early '80s, the same thing happened. It's hard to complain about the size of light trucks when they include huge vehicles like the PT Cruiser. 8^) Since 1975, when the standards were first implemented, automobile-related death rates have fallen by more than 12 percent and Detroit's revenues have ballooned by more than 300 percent. So much for the doomsday scenarios. Careful with the statistics. Safety, as measured by fatalities per hundred million VMT [vehicle miles traveled], has steadily improved since 1930, and it is likely that this general trend will continue. In evaluating the safety consequences of fuel economy measures requiring vehicle modifications, this overall trend must be taken into consideration. Otherwise, safety improvements are likely to be erroneously attributed to changes that are unrelated or even detrimental to safety. National Research Council _Automotive Fuel Economy How Far Should We Go?_ 1992. Interesting read, I'm glad I bought the report in book form to read. If you go back to the first report I talked about, finding #2, page 111, all but two members of the committee concluded that the downweighting and downsizing that occurred in the late 1970s and early 1980s, some of which was due to CAFE standards, probably resulted in an additional 1300 to 2600 traffic fatalities in 1993. revealed that an SUV's size and weight give it less precise and responsive handling, longer braking times, and a higher risk of rollover -- all serious safety disadvantages. Gladwell also argues that drivers of large vehicles develop an attitude of invincibility that leads to recklessness. Yep, people can be pretty dumb at times, and can become their own enemy if they aren't careful. Somewhere I have a reference (dang, wish I could find it at the moment) to this factor not appearing in vans in the same way it appears in other vehicle types (in accident statistics, I mean - vans will roll over easier than cars). The reference was the van drivers apparently are aware of what they are driving and change their behavior to match the vehicle. According to Clarence Ditlow, director of the Center for Auto Safety, new reports consistently show that heavier vehicles are far and away more deadly -- these are rolling battering rams that cause more carnage not only to the car's passengers but to those in the other cars involved in the crash. In addition to the high risk of rollover, says Ditlow, most trucks have a steel beam that runs from bumper to
[biofuel] NY artist seeking collaboration on biodiesel project
x-charset ISO-8859-1Hi biofuel forum, I am an artist in New York looking to embark on a biofuel project. This project involves making biodiesel and fueling a road trip(s) to various cities in the US. I am very interested in collaborations and exchange in the process of making work. I would be very interested in discussing the finer points of what I hope to do with anyone in the greater New York area who has a running biodiesel operation or has knowlegde and is interested and has experience in working on putting together a biodiesel operation. If anyone in the forum can suggest an able biodiesel enthusiast in the area I could contact I would be greatly appreciative. Thanks, Peter Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Buy Ink Cartridges or Refill Kits for your HP, Epson, Canon or Lexmark Printer at MyInks.com. Free s/h on orders $50 or more to the US Canada. http://www.c1tracking.com/l.asp?cid=5511 http://us.click.yahoo.com/mOAaAA/3exGAA/qnsNAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ /x-charset
Re: [biofuel] Re: Make plans to shut O'Hare down long-term
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 2/23/2004 12:07:36 PM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Perhaps. But don't forget that the particulates in question are soot, which tends to absorb heat rather than reflecting it. That's the point. The soot absorbs heat that would otherwise reach the ground and increases the emissivity of the upper atmosphere, radiating more heat into space. Ah. Now I understand the mechanism. I realize they went to a lot of effort to eliminate smoke from jets; when I was young almost all jets were smoky. However, given that the airlines fly under government regulation, a mandatory smoky engine could be imposed by any dumb non-elected FAA administrator, as long as the scientifically trained lawyers in congress would permit it. Quite possibly, it could be achieved without any engine modifications -- don't want to void the warranty -- by additives to the fuel (easy to enforce) or by injecting something into the exhaust. I know there's no shortage of morons in Congress, but, fortunately, I don't think any of them are quite _that_ dumb. If they could seed cloud formation at high altitude (big if), the clouds would be more effective than soot. Funny you should mention that. One time, while I was living in Germany, on my way to work this one morning I watched an airliner fly across the sky. It was a bright, clear morning with a brilliant blue sky. The airliner left a bright white contrail across the sky. My office was in a corner of an upper floor of a large hangar, with big windows so I had a good view of the sky. Over the course of the next couple of hours I watched that contrail expand until it had become a thin overcast of cirrus clouds covering almost the entire sky. There is no doubt in my mind that under the right conditions airplanes can indeed seed high altitude cloud formation. AP Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] did you guys see ?
x-charset ISO-8859-1the headline story on drudge today? about how the saudi oilfields have peaked! scary stuff. i wonder if thats what this war is actually about. also check out the files section of http://groups.yahoo.com/group/schoolbusconversionuts for a homemade biofuel plant. many members there are running veggie oil in thier skoolies. Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ /x-charset
Re: [biofuel] Weapons of Mass Deception
Walt Patrick wrote: About 140 years ago, a group of federalists took over the government and waged a war of conquest which destroyed more than a million lives thereby establishing the principal of rule by conquest as the foundation for the federal government. If they could kill hundreds of thousands of Southrons, and they did, then it's not much of a stretch for them to continue on that path killing anyone else who gets in their way. I believe you mis-spelled Southerners. Or perhaps Confederates. And don't forget that the South fired the first shot. Some Southerners had been preaching war for years, and very many were happy when it came. But you've reduced The Civil War (The War Between The States) to blue and grey, and it wasn't that simple then either. There were Union militias formed in the deep south, and union sympathizers into the deepest of the deep south. Likewise there were Confederate militias formed north of the Mason-Dixon line that made life interesting in the North. And there were also Confederate sympathizers all over the north. The Confederate states themselves were a fractious lot that had more differences than commonalities. Particularly in the last year of the war, their leaders spent nearly as much time fighting among themselves as they did fighting the Union. Your comment about the military-industrial complex rings hollow, because after 1865 the military-industrial complex practically ceased to exist. The United States didn't keep a large standing army, so it didn't need a large industry to supply a large standing army. And yet, to this day, The Civil War was our most damaging war to date. Largely because of the use of Napoleanic tactics in early industrial warfare there were huge numbers of casualties. Because of this The Civil War produced more American deaths than all of our other wars combined. For all of those who are making comments like Demicans and Republicrats the only thing I have to say is that getting The Shrub out of the White House is the first step. The thought of that hyper-religious madman getting re-elected scares me. I don't like being scared of my politicians. You've obviously been staying away from the polls in droves, because the only candidate that showed a glimmer of being something different, Howard Dean, just quit because he couldn't get enough support. That leaves us with John Kerry, the Republican part of the Democratic party, and John Edwards, who isn't any better. At this point any of the alternative party candidates are merely spoilers, and votes for any of them are effectively votes for Bush. I say again, get Bush out of the White House first. Worry about making major changes to the federal government later. And while you're at it, don't forget all of the congressional elections, state and local elections, and other issues that will be on your ballots this year. AP Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Buy Ink Cartridges or Refill Kits for your HP, Epson, Canon or Lexmark Printer at MyInks.com. Free s/h on orders $50 or more to the US Canada. http://www.c1tracking.com/l.asp?cid=5511 http://us.click.yahoo.com/mOAaAA/3exGAA/qnsNAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Biodiesel Quality?
x-charset ISO-8859-1hi what you did is right your biodiesel will be of good quality.. butb4 using the biodiesel, heat it for 110 degree celsius and thn use it.-vidhya --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: - Hi all, I just made my second large batch of Biodiesel. (10 gallon) I have made 8 different blender batches, the first 3 I screwed up the amount of lye. (the scale was way off) The next 5 came out great, (I think) I have gotten great seperation on every good batch that I have made. 2 very distinct layers with the top layer being the same color top to bottom and the bottom layer much darker and on the bottom. I mix it for 1 hour then let it sit over night and draw off the good stuff from the top and put it in the washer. I wash it with 1/2 the amount of water for 6 to 7 hours and let it sit over night and repeat this 3 times. My last wash water is just about clear and the ph is about 6. Having told you this, is there anything to do to test the quality of my fuel. It looks good in the jug. I have one batch that has been done for a couple of weeks and it looks the same now as it did when I got done washing it. I am ready to put it in a fuel tank and run a gen set but just want to be sure I am not going to mess any thing up. Thanks Rick M Brownstown, Mi. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard - Read only the mail you want. http://antispam.yahoo.com/tools Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ /x-charset
Re: [biofuel] Weapons of Mass Deception
x-charset ISO-8859-1I like the Biofuels list BECAUSE it has comments from all sides of the political spectrum. I am an Australian, and consider that of late, the Americans have become bullies: if you do not do as we say, we have the power to force you. Often this power is not the Armament might, but the voices from the American controlled Multi-national companies. Many of these companies have enough access to money, to be more powerful than many smaller countries. This power is used in insidious ways in weaker countries, to enable these companies to make more money at the plight of the poor. Unfortunately, America is not the only country that does this, as European nations, even some Asian nations also exploit. America, however, seems to be the flagship, being vocal aggressive, so America seems to be the country that repressed peoples rally against most. The US stance in the middle east, where the US ignores the fact that Israel has atomic WMD, but attacks others that it accuses of having WMD, but do not! If America was fair Just, it would help the Jews Arabs sort their differences, come to an equitable solution, disarm Israel before the Middle East blows up into another World War. All I want is a fair equitable system in the world where every person can live in peace harmony, no matter what religion. (Step off soapbox) Doug PS: I do not consider this email as being anti-US, as I am not. However I think that the US as a Christian Nation, should be more Christian in nature! (I am pointing at the system, not the individuals.) On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 10:24 am, Walt Patrick wrote: At 04:50 AM 2/25/04 +0900, Keith wrote: Politicians, right and left, lie. That's hardly news, and hardly likely to change unless conditions render them irrelevant. That's why I'm here on this list, to glean information which might help further that goal. It's becoming quite evident that other would rather pursue their paritsan agenda regardless of how many people it drives off-list. I'd like you to amplify that please. Please be specific, you've intimated something like this previously - who and what exactly are you talking about? And why do you think people are been driven off-list? Which people? Are you sure I'm the one you're thinking of? I believe that this is the first time I've raised the issue, but others have heretofore protested the abuse of the list and been essentially told point blank to shut up or leave. I can assure you that I've thought about unsubscribing more than once in the last few weeks due to the level of partisan hatred that's dominated the list of late. I come here to learn about biofuel, not to hear rants from folks who hate Bush but somehow fail to remember the thirty to forty thousand men, women and children who were infected with HIV and Hep-C by tainted blood drawn from Arkansas prisons and illegally sold in Canada in order to fund Clinton's run for the White House. I can't conceive how anyone could not be totally outraged over that. I think you're falling into your own trap of seeing things according to a partisan agenda, but in a different, much broader, and much more important sense, that goes much further than the national concerns of some among the minority American contingent here. Us and them, and you're not considering them, but them is the majority here, non-Americans of every ilk. You think your election only concerns Americans? It's not my election. I'm not a citizen. The actions of your current administration See above comment. have been the cause of the biggest protests worldwide and the most vocal and united opposition the world has ever seen, by a very long way, quite unprecedented. Not according to my reading of history, but even if it were true, I'm not particularly impressed by volume and quantity. You think it has nothing to do with biofuels and localising power sources? If so you're not thinking very clearly. Please don't mistake my focused interest in biofuel for a lack of interest in other matters, but meaning no offense, there are other lists which cover those topics with less vitriol and more insight than I've seen displayed here. Now please tell us just who and what you're pointing the finger at. Since you asked . You're the list owner, so I guess that would be you. I would invite you to give some thought to just what mission you want this list to serve, and whether you want to impose a requirement that in order to participate folk most be (1) interested in the development of biofuels and (2) hate Bush's guts. I believe that there are lots of people who can advance the first criteria without having to pass the litmus test of the second. As list owner, you can do what you want, but it's important to ask yourself whether you bear something of a host's obligation to
[biofuel] Re: Weapons of Mass Deception
I wouldnt really call Bush hyper-religious. If he is a true Christian, he is an aweful one and must have his own 'special' bible. I can even guess who wrote his. Take care. Mike M. www.cpnc.info - Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard - Read only the mail you want. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Buy Ink Cartridges or Refill Kits for your HP, Epson, Canon or Lexmark Printer at MyInks.com. Free s/h on orders $50 or more to the US Canada. http://www.c1tracking.com/l.asp?cid=5511 http://us.click.yahoo.com/mOAaAA/3exGAA/qnsNAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Biodiesel Quality?
x-charset ISO-8859-1There's no need to heat the finished fuel to this high of a temp to dry it. Approximately 120*F (~46*C) is more than sufficient to get any microscopic water to settle out before putting the fuel in the tank. The simplest home test for fuel acceptability is to put equal parts fuel and water in a closed container and agitate radically for a few seconds. If the fuel and water separate immediately with no emulsion other than a thin interface film you're good to go. Todd Swearingen - Original Message - From: pinky 22in [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2004 4:18 AM Subject: Re: [biofuel] Biodiesel Quality? hi what you did is right your biodiesel will be of good quality.. butb4 using the biodiesel, heat it for 110 degree celsius and thn use it.-vidhya --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: - Hi all, I just made my second large batch of Biodiesel. (10 gallon) I have made 8 different blender batches, the first 3 I screwed up the amount of lye. (the scale was way off) The next 5 came out great, (I think) I have gotten great seperation on every good batch that I have made. 2 very distinct layers with the top layer being the same color top to bottom and the bottom layer much darker and on the bottom. I mix it for 1 hour then let it sit over night and draw off the good stuff from the top and put it in the washer. I wash it with 1/2 the amount of water for 6 to 7 hours and let it sit over night and repeat this 3 times. My last wash water is just about clear and the ph is about 6. Having told you this, is there anything to do to test the quality of my fuel. It looks good in the jug. I have one batch that has been done for a couple of weeks and it looks the same now as it did when I got done washing it. I am ready to put it in a fuel tank and run a gen set but just want to be sure I am not going to mess any thing up. Thanks Rick M Brownstown, Mi. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard - Read only the mail you want. http://antispam.yahoo.com/tools Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ /x-charset
[biofuel] The Power Player
See also: http://www.planetark.com/dailynewsstory.cfm/newsid/23888/story.htm Energy sector generous to likely House energy chair http://tompaine.com/feature2.cfm/ID/9996 The Power Player Sheryl Fred is an investigative reporter for the Center for Responsive Politics and its online newsletter, CapitalEye.org. One of the most coveted committee slots on Capitol Hill became vacant this week when Rep. Billy Tauzin, R-La., officially stepped down as chairman of the House Energy and Commerce Committee. Members of the committee-and the chairman, in particular-regularly rake in campaign contributions from energy companies, drug manufacturers, telecom firms and others within the committee's wide-ranging jurisdiction. It looks as though Tauzin will now turn to an even more lucrative endeavor. Having already turned down an attractive offer to replace Jack Valenti as chairman of the Motion Picture Association of America, Tauzin is reportedly weighing a multimillion-dollar offer to become the chief lobbyist of the Pharmaceutical Researchers and Manufacturers of America (PhRMA). As Tauzin moves on, energy, pharmaceutical and telecom interests are losing a key ally in the House. But Tauzin's likely successor, Texas Rep. Joe Barton, may prove to be an even more loyal friend to many of these industries. A champion of drilling in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge (ANWR), storing nuclear waste in Nevada's Yucca Mountain and weakening the Clean Air Act, Barton is a longtime advocate for energy companies, which have generously funded his campaigns. The congressman has received $1.6 million from the energy sector since 1989, more than any other member of the House. Barton's support from oil and gas companies ($829,000 since 1989) and electric utilities ($650,000 since 1989) comes as no surprise given his history of unabashed support for energy industry deregulation. He started his career in 1981 as an aide to Department of Energy Secretary James Edwards, the force behind one of the first efforts to eliminate price controls on natural gas. After a short stint as a natural gas decontrol consultant to Atlantic Richfield Oil Gas, Barton was elected to the House in 1984. Nearly 20 years on the job have only strengthened his resolve to push for deregulation. Barton demonstrated his unwavering commitment to this policy following the Enron energy trading scandal in 2001. At a time when most lawmakers were keeping their distance from energy interests, Barton introduced a bill that would have deregulated the industry even further. In terms of energy markets, I think Enron shows that markets work, he told National Journal in January 2002. When the Enron trading room stopped, the markets opened the next morning and prices didn't go up, contracts were delivered. There was no discernable impact at all. No Friend To The Environment Barton also has repeatedly called for drilling in ANWR, a move environmentalists strongly oppose. Barton's top contributor in the 2004 election cycle so far is Anadarko Petroleum, one of the country's largest independent oil and gas companies and, by its own admission, the most active driller in North America. The company's employees and their immediate families gave Barton $48,000 in 2003 alone. Already drilling in parts of Alaska, Anadarko is one of many companies hoping that Congress will green-light oil exploration in ANWR soon. Barton, as chairman of the Energy and Air Quality Subcommittee, authored much of the energy legislation that passed the House in November. Although his ANWR provision was dropped from the final bill, Barton did manage to score some major victories for his top contributors. In addition to tax breaks for the oil and gas, nuclear power and coal industries, the House energy bill included legal protections for the makers of MTBE, a fuel additive known to pollute groundwater. The bill also contained provisions that would repeal the Public Utility Holding Company Act, a consumer-protection law that slows utility consolidation, and allow the Energy Department to sidestep certain environmental laws when placing electrical transmission lines on federal lands. Barton has said he will now turn his attention to the Senate, where Democrats filibustered the bill last fall. My first priority will be to work with the president to ensure a comprehensive energy bill passes the Senate, he said after being nominated to succeed Tauzin. Caring For Health Corporations Though he has made his mark primarily on energy issues, Barton, a member of the Energy and Commerce Subcommittee on Health, also has a good working relationship with the health sector. Contributors in this category have given him a combined $646,000 since 1989. In 2003, health professionals ($43,000) and drug companies ($40,000) were Barton's third- and fourth-largest contributors, respectively. Much to the delight of the health sector, Barton has been an
RE: [biofuel] pagans
x-charset Windows-1252I believe Islam came in somewhere between the old testament and the new testament. I read somewhere that Islam derived its teachings from the old testament with Mohamed proclaiming himself as God's one and only prophet thus the similarities of Islam with Judaism e.g. Passover and Ramadan. =-Original Message- =From: Alan Petrillo [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] =Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2004 2:08 AM =To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com =Subject: Re: [biofuel] pagans = = =Curtis Sakima wrote: = = But doesn't the Jew historic line lead up to modern CHRISTIANITY?? = = Sumerian War-God --- Jews -- Judeo-CHRISTIANS??? = =But, if you follow the history back to its source, God first revealed =himself in the Sacred Flame to King Zoroaster, and Zoroastrianism is =noted, IIRC, as the first western monotheistic religion. So the family =tree looks something like = =Zoroastrianism -- Judaism -- Christianity = =With Islam popping up in the 7th century CE. I'm not sure where Islam =would fit in that family tree, but it is a descendant of Zoroastrianism. = = =AP = = = = =Biofuel at Journey to Forever: =http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html = =Biofuels list archives: =http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ = =Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. =To unsubscribe, send an email to: =[EMAIL PROTECTED] =Yahoo! Groups Links = = = = = Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Buy Ink Cartridges or Refill Kits for your HP, Epson, Canon or Lexmark Printer at MyInks.com. Free s/h on orders $50 or more to the US Canada. http://www.c1tracking.com/l.asp?cid=5511 http://us.click.yahoo.com/mOAaAA/3exGAA/qnsNAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ /x-charset
RE: [biofuel] Moral Dilemma...
Todd, I'm speaking from historical and empirical evidence when I say that it doesn't matter which party is in power, nor does it make a whit who you vote for. The illusion of a two party system it is just that. While each party pushes its own pet programs, history has shown time and time again, that only when those plans benefit the corporate oligarchs do they come to fruition. So you can dream all you like about how wonderful the world would be if Al Gore had not had the election stolen from him, but that doesn't change the fact that it was and perhaps that was the reason so. Here's a little pointer to help you navigate the real world, your political naivety would almost be charming were you not so self righteous. -BRAH -Original Message- From: Appal Energy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, February 23, 2004 7:58 PM To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [biofuel] Moral Dilemma... Bryan, As you point out Todd, I was the first to frame this discussion in the us-them democrat-republican thing, but it was merely an anticipatory post Yup. Pretty sad that. Thankfully life in general isn't orchestrated the same way you would manipulate a conversation. If it were to model your method there would be but birth and death with no trip in between. As for your to wit? PNGV was Gore/Clinton's baby. They saw the writing on the wall and certainly were capable of understanding that while fuel cells hold futuristic benefits, they were and are not a technology that can fill the enormous gap in the interim. It will take 30-40 years at best to convert a liquid fuels infrastructure to a market wide hydrogen economy. And that's under a transportation Marshall Plan. Putting 10 year life cycles on automobiles, on average, these people knew full well that there would be 2 and 3 generations of automobile manufacture before a general onset of fuel cell powered transport could become a reality. That's hundreds of millions of vehicle sales that could have largely been alternatives to present market offerings. But when using your pre-emptive thought process Gore would have scragged PNGV as readily as Bush? Yeah. Right. And the pope is going to convert to Episcopalianism. You really need to get those political scales of yours recalibrated. You seem to think the end results of a dual party legislative/executive cycle are going to yield duplicit results as a single party cycle. There's a big difference between a set of scales at least partly in balance and those where a heavy thumb is always depressing one side.. As for I don't discount them in the least; I simply doubt that anything I can do (within the current electoral system) will make a difference on their actions. Then I suggest you sit on your thumb and spin to your heart's content while the rest of the world picks up your slack. Todd Swearingen - Original Message - From: Bryan Brah [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, February 23, 2004 12:43 PM Subject: RE: [biofuel] Moral Dilemma... As you point out Todd, I was the first to frame this discussion in the us-them democrat-republican thing, but it was merely an anticipatory post. Any time Dubya does something stupid, shortsighted, or reckless, which happens often enough, invariably the lamentation goes up that had he not stole the election from Al Gore, everything would be different. To wit: I can tell you one thing for absolute certain. Had Shrub not been appointed we'd still have PNGV and probably a few 10,000 more hybrids on the road and a myriad of other similar far reaching policies that would benefit future generations rather than lining the pockets of contemporary corporations as is the present destructive trend. How can you be so sure? With Republicans controlling both houses Wooden Al would be hard pressed to pass anything. And while they don't have enough votes to override a presidential veto, they could easily have inserted their environmental rollbacks in appropriations, national security, or trade legislation. Oh wait a minute, that's what they did anyway under GW. Uhhhthere's just one other thing. If you think that you can effect substantial change much beyond what color of socks you're going to wear in the morning, you're going to have to give some long consideration to utilizing whatever yahoos might be in office on any given day - either utilize their stupidity against themselves or utilize their sway. Nice theory, but I don't have 180 million dollars, and as the last election proved, my vote isn't worth squat. As far as utilizing those yahoos in office, they're a lot more conniving and savvy than you give them credit, how do you suggest influencing them, by writing letters and signing petitions? How about protesting, what do you think that will get you besides an entry in the Terrorist (er I mean Total) Information Awareness Database? But you won't get as
Re: [biofuel] Resurgence of Atkins Diet
Incidentally, I, and I assume many others who might more or less be fans of some resurgence of the diet, am not an unrestricted fan of the diet, as a diet for life. I just sort of like some of it, and I like some of the idea of it bringing about some long-overdue change in overall food total consumption and types of food consumption. I also like the fact that this guy (Atkins) went about his business despite the naysaying from the smuttily arrogant University Professors and such. Atkins kills ADM? A pleasant scenario... Well, maybe. http://www.westonaprice.org/caustic_comments/summer2003.html Caustic Commentary, Summer 2003 Atkins' Revenge The latest Consumer Expenditure Survey of the US Department of Labor indicates that Americans are buying fewer grain products and more meat, poultry, fish and eggs. Wheat consumption (mostly in the form of refined flour) in the US dropped 4 percent from 1997 to 2001 and the cereal industry is not happy. The Wheat Foods Council has launched an educational campaign at nutritionists and the medical community to counter these trends. Healthful grain-based foods have become the scapegoat for weight gain, when overeating and under-exercising are at issue, said Carol Pratt, a Kellogg nutrition and regulatory affairs expert and incoming chairwoman for Wheat Foods. The grain industry blames Dr. Atkins for declining sales, and rightly so, as several studies now lend credence to his low-carb diet for weight loss. I'm very much concerned, says Mark Dirkes, spokesman for Interstate Bakeries, maker of Wonder Bread. He [Atkins] has run a very effective campaign. That just can't be good for our industry. According to the wheat council, Americans who follow the Atkins diet increase their risk of health problems, including cardiovascular disease, high cholesterol kidney damage and some cancers (Reuters March 16, 2003). Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Buy Ink Cartridges or Refill Kits for your HP, Epson, Canon or Lexmark Printer at MyInks.com. Free s/h on orders $50 or more to the US Canada. http://www.c1tracking.com/l.asp?cid=5511 http://us.click.yahoo.com/mOAaAA/3exGAA/qnsNAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Biodiesel Quality?
x-charset ISO-8859-1Why heat it ? Met vriendelijke groeten, Pieter Koole Netherlands The information contained in this message (including attachments) is confidential, and is intended for the addressee(s) only. If you have received this message in error please delete it and notify the originator immediately. The unauthorized use, disclosure, copying or alteration of this message is strictly forbidden. We will not be liable for direct, special, indirect or consequential damages arising from alteration of the contents of this message by a third party or in case of electronic communications as a result of any virus being passed on. - Original Message - From: pinky 22in [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2004 10:18 AM Subject: Re: [biofuel] Biodiesel Quality? hi what you did is right your biodiesel will be of good quality.. butb4 using the biodiesel, heat it for 110 degree celsius and thn use it.-vidhya --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: - Hi all, I just made my second large batch of Biodiesel. (10 gallon) I have made 8 different blender batches, the first 3 I screwed up the amount of lye. (the scale was way off) The next 5 came out great, (I think) I have gotten great seperation on every good batch that I have made. 2 very distinct layers with the top layer being the same color top to bottom and the bottom layer much darker and on the bottom. I mix it for 1 hour then let it sit over night and draw off the good stuff from the top and put it in the washer. I wash it with 1/2 the amount of water for 6 to 7 hours and let it sit over night and repeat this 3 times. My last wash water is just about clear and the ph is about 6. Having told you this, is there anything to do to test the quality of my fuel. It looks good in the jug. I have one batch that has been done for a couple of weeks and it looks the same now as it did when I got done washing it. I am ready to put it in a fuel tank and run a gen set but just want to be sure I am not going to mess any thing up. Thanks Rick M Brownstown, Mi. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard - Read only the mail you want. http://antispam.yahoo.com/tools Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Buy Ink Cartridges or Refill Kits for your HP, Epson, Canon or Lexmark Printer at MyInks.com. Free s/h on orders $50 or more to the US Canada. http://www.c1tracking.com/l.asp?cid=5511 http://us.click.yahoo.com/mOAaAA/3exGAA/qnsNAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ /x-charset
Re: [biofuel] Biodiesel Quality?
Hi again, Another dumb question. Is this heating a needed step and if it is how long should it be heated for? There's no need to heat the finished fuel to this high of a temp to dry it. Approximately 120*F (~46*C) is more than sufficient to get any microscopic water to settle out before putting the fuel in the tank. If it seperates like you say I am good to go before heating or after? Thanks again Rick M Brownstown, Mi The simplest home test for fuel acceptability is to put equal parts fuel and water in a closed container and agitate radically for a few seconds. If the fuel and water separate immediately with no emulsion other than a thin interface film you're good to go. Todd Swearingen [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Re: Weapons of Mass Deception
At 12:36 AM 2/24/04 +, you wrote: --- In biofuel@yahoogroups.com, Walt Patrick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Someone lacking the stones to even sign his post. Please don't swagger around like some testosterone saturated teenager looking for trouble. Look at the email address if you want to see my name. People who have the courage of their convictions aren't shy about signing their names to what they post. They don't hide behind email addresses. You called me out by name to ridicule my post; at least have the class to sign yours. Unless it's the policy of the list owner to allow anonymous personal attacks. Walt Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Bhopal
x-charset ISO-8859-1Hey, esbuck, I didn't write that either! Oh well, never mind, in fact I'd wanted to do a piece on Bhopal for Journey to Forever's FYI section, but I didn't get that far, and we've stopped updating that section now, too much else on our plates. There's some good stuff there though: http://journeytoforever.org/index.html#FYI In a message dated 2/23/2004 7:30:44 AM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: such as Union Carbide's metamorphosis into Dow Chemicals after its corporate terrorism in Bhopal (1984). As I understood it, there was terrorism, but not by Union Carbide. Someone sabotaged the plant. Can you clue us in on what really happened? Please? I'd really like to know what happened and how and who was at fault. Damn... Sorry - same problem, a bulging file of info, 5.6Mb of it, 129 documents, have to pare it down. Yeah, well, okay... Bhopal was and still is today an appalling atrocity, still ongoing after 20 years, a major crime against humanity and something we all should know about. And be outraged about. So pardon my mumblings, I'm glad that you ask. You'll have to spend some time doing some research, but all the information is ready to hand, you just have to read it. The bald, bare facts are quite bad enough, but the full picture in all its sickening detail is far worse, and it's important to get the full picture. I hope your stomach is strong. It's not at all what you think - the sabotage story is just a part of the considerable amount of disinfo and evasion generated by UC/Dow, and even were it true, what the saboteur is alleged to have done should not have had those results, it should have been 100% impossible. Instead, it was just waiting to happen, and the company knew it. - Though the design of the methyl isocyanate (MIC) unit at Bhopal was based on Union Carbide's West Virginia plant, grossly lower standards were employed in the selection of construction material, monitoring devices and safety systems. - Union Carbide wanted to save money. Accidental leaks from all the Bhopal units were frequent, and operators and workers were regularly exposed to different substances. The factory was running at a loss. In November 1984 the most important safety systems were either closed down or not functioning. - Between 1980 and 1984 the work crew of the MIC unit was halved from 12 to six workers, the maintenance crew from six to two workers. On December 26, 1981 a plant operator was killed by a phosgene gas leak. Another phosgene leak in January 1982 severely injured 28 workers and in October the same year MIC escaped from a broken valve and four workers were exposed to the chemical. The senior officials of the corporation, privy to a business confidential safety audit in May 1982, were well aware of 61 hazards, 30 of them major and 11 in the dangerous phosgene/MIC units. Remedial measures were then taken at Union Carbide's identical MIC plant in West Virginia but not in Bhopal. In Bhopal, prior to the disaster, environmental safety concerns by private citizens were responded to by legal threats from the company and repressive managerial measures were employed against workers who raised occupational health concerns. - Secret Union Carbide documents obtained by discovery during a class action suit brought by survivors against the company in New York, reveal that the technology used at the fatal Bhopal factory - including the crucial units manufacturing carbon monoxide and methyl isocyanate (MIC) - was unproven, and that the company knew it would pose unknown risks. The corporation knew the danger, but regarded it as an acceptable business risk. - Senior Carbide officials, including ex-CEO Warren Anderson, not only knew about design defects and potential safety issues with the Bhopal factory, they actually authorised them. - On the night of the disaster, water (that was being used for washing the lines) entered the tank containing MIC through leaking valves. The refrigeration unit, which should have kept the MIC close to zero degrees centigrade, had been shut off by the company officials to save on electricity bills. The entrance of water in the tank, full of MIC at ambient temperature triggered off an exothermic runaway reaction an consequently the release of 27 tons of the lethal gas mixture. The safety systems, which in any case were not designed for such a runaway situation, were non-functioning and under repair. Lest the neighborhood community be unduly alarmed, the siren in the factory had been switched off. Poison clouds from the Union Carbide factory enveloped an arc of over 20 square kilometers before the residents could run away from its deadly hold. - People woke up coughing, gasping for breath, their eyes burning. Many fell dead as they ran. Others succumbed at the hospitals where doctors were overwhelmed by the numbers and lacked information on the nature of the poisoning. By the third
Re: [biofuel] Biodiesel Quality?
Why heat it ? Met vriendelijke groeten, Pieter Koole Netherlands Right Peter - no need, unless you're in a hurry. Letting it settle until it's clear is fine. 110 deg C (230 F) is at any rate completely unnecessary, waste of energy. Some people do 60 deg C (140 F), but I agree with Todd: Approximately 120*F (~46*C) is more than sufficient. If that doesn't clear it, do it again, but it shouldn't be necessary to do it again. Of course heating it will always clear it, but that doesn't mean it will stay clear when it cools down. Rick: washer. I wash it with 1/2 the amount of water for 6 to 7 hours and let it sit over night and repeat this 3 times. My last wash water is just about clear and the ph is about 6. No need to settle it so long between washes, an hour or so will do (but longer won't hurt either). Ideally the final wash water should be clear rather than just about clear. Sorry to ask again, but how do you measure the pH? I wonder if it's an accurate measure, it should be more like 7, or at least more like the pH of your tap water - which is what, by the way? Best Keith - Original Message - From: pinky 22in [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2004 10:18 AM Subject: Re: [biofuel] Biodiesel Quality? hi what you did is right your biodiesel will be of good quality.. butb4 using the biodiesel, heat it for 110 degree celsius and thn use it.-vidhya --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: - Hi all, I just made my second large batch of Biodiesel. (10 gallon) I have made 8 different blender batches, the first 3 I screwed up the amount of lye. (the scale was way off) The next 5 came out great, (I think) I have gotten great seperation on every good batch that I have made. 2 very distinct layers with the top layer being the same color top to bottom and the bottom layer much darker and on the bottom. I mix it for 1 hour then let it sit over night and draw off the good stuff from the top and put it in the washer. I wash it with 1/2 the amount of water for 6 to 7 hours and let it sit over night and repeat this 3 times. My last wash water is just about clear and the ph is about 6. Having told you this, is there anything to do to test the quality of my fuel. It looks good in the jug. I have one batch that has been done for a couple of weeks and it looks the same now as it did when I got done washing it. I am ready to put it in a fuel tank and run a gen set but just want to be sure I am not going to mess any thing up. Thanks Rick M Brownstown, Mi. Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] GMOs are Bad Bad Bad
esbuck wrote: It is my understanding that most of the foods we eat are genetically modified, but the mods. were made millenia ago. Corn (maise) cannot reproduce without human help, since the kernels, seeds, stick to the cob. Obviously, corn is genetically different than wild maise. similarly with wheat. I believe domestic wheat has many more genes than the wild variety, emmer. Civilization would not exist, except for genetic modifications. Anyone out there prepared to expand on that? It's completely wrong. Natural selection and the selective breeding practised by the many generations of careful and wise peasant farmers who've developed our food crops through the millenia have NEVER used genes from OTHER species to do so, and that's the basis of what's called Genetic Engineering and Genetically Modified Organisms. Myth No. 1: Genetic engineering (GE) is not new. It is just the same as speeded-up selective breeding. FACT: Genetic engineering (GE) and conventional breeding are worlds apart. Breeding does not manipulate genes; it involves crossing of selected parents of the same or closely related species. In contrast, GE involves extracting selected genes from one organism (e.g. animals, plants, insects, bacteria) and/or viruses, or synthesising copies, and artificially inserting them into another completely different organism (eg. food crops). GE usually employs virus genes to smuggle in and promote the inserted genes, and antibiotic resistance genes to act as markers. All these inserted genes are present in every cell of the plant. http://prorev.com/genetic.htm Thirteen myths about genetic engineering Basic but a useful document. More: http://www.plant.uoguelph.ca/research/homepages/eclark/10reasons.htm Ten Reasons why farmers should think twice before growing GE crops http://www.prwatch.org/prwissues/1999Q4/myths.html Biotechnology Will Feed the World and Other Myths http://www.seedsofdeception.com/Genetically-Modified-Foods-are-Inheren tly-Unsafe.php?menu1_id=9menu2_id=1 Genetically Modified Foods are Inherently Unsafe ESB, your level of information on GMOs is in a parlous state. Please see the GMO refs I provided in the post you've responded to (but snipped): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/BIOFUEL/32240/ It's something you need to know about if you're interested in biofuels - you'd be wrong to think that biodiesel derived from GMO soy monocrops or ethanol from GMO maize monocrops were necessarily environmentally friendly. At the tailpipe maybe, but not far beyond that. It's something you need to know anyway. Best Keith Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Buy Ink Cartridges or Refill Kits for your HP, Epson, Canon or Lexmark Printer at MyInks.com. Free s/h on orders $50 or more to the US Canada. http://www.c1tracking.com/l.asp?cid=5511 http://us.click.yahoo.com/mOAaAA/3exGAA/qnsNAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Re: America has gone super-sized
Keith Addison wrote: He knew what the basic wealth is, very wise. You'd think of course an agricultural research scientist would know that, but so many don't, even today. Yields! Efficiency! Having grown up in the era of the green revolution, it's been very hard to accept that modern farming practices are detrimental. I remember watching films at school touting the victory of modern farming over pestilences, and how increased yields were wiping out hunger. Much of this propaganda tied directly into the jingoism taught as fact by the entire culture around me as I grew to adulthood, so it was easy to dismiss my uncle's concern as third world sour grapes. Further, the fertilization / pesticide / herbicide cycle harks back to the 19th century idea that putting something into the soil means you can take something out of it. (I can't remember from whence that originated.) This mentality leads to chemical inputs--e.g. the plants don't care what kind of nutrients they're receiving, as long as they are nutrients! So, we sterilize our soil in an effort to grow plants. . . Then I went to college. Watershed restoration had become somewhat of a passion for me, and since biology was part of my major, I really wanted to see forests return to their natural state. Surprisingly, I learned that soil is the key to a healthy forest ecosystem--it's teeming with microscopic life, and without it, plants cannot thrive. (This makes sense when we really think about it. Root systems can only uptake what exists in the soil. Micro organisms do a lot of chemistry work on the plant's behalf.) Ultimately, my uncle was right. If we take care of the soil, the soil will take care of us. Now, as spring approaches (it's only February, but my fruit trees are ALREADY budding--you'd think I was back in California!) and everyone in the neighborhood is buying pesticide spray, I'm worrying about my strategy for soil remediation this year. I found a place that is giving away composted goose manure, and I'm waiting for the local recycling depot to open so I can mix a bunch of compost and get some organic material into the dirt for my flower beds and fruit trees. A couple of weeks ago I was emptying out my own compost bin and noticed earthworms in the compost! (I have never seen an earthworm on this property. . .) It may take time to get my garden functioning, but I have to start with soil. Otherwise, I'll be spraying everything to kill bugs and force my plants to grow, just like my neighbors do. What do you do when it happens socially, face to face? This is a hard question. Intellectual interchange is a different concept than mere gainsaying and ridicule of another person's perspective, yet the latter is often mistaken for the former. When I encounter people who are unwilling to think I have a hard time restraining my desire to belittle or ridicule. My favorite mechanic believes that I.Q. is a static number, so that as population increases, overall intellectual capacity declines. . . I think of people as a resource, rather than a liability. However, attitude makes a HUGE difference in any single person's ability to effect positive change. I have little tolerance for anyone who thinks too highly of himself. (Besides, I've read somewhere that God opposes the proud, but exalts the humble.) Likewise, though I come from a great country, one doesn't have to look to hard to realize that it's far from perfect. People who think America can do no wrong are living in a self imposed fantasy. Just smile and accept it? Why should you accept it here? Perhaps some people don't mix enough with others who might have different views from their own, but then they should, and they surely should be aware that a list like this isn't their local bar. This is a very diverse forum, and many people who post here have political views considerably to the left of mine. That doesn't mean their perspectives have no merit, nor is the criticism frequently leveled at my country lacking in at least some truth. It's not always pleasant to read, but I don't see how lashing belligerently at the critics solves the problems about which they complain, nor does doing so change any minds. The arrogance I've read from some of my own countrymen merely serves to reinforce the stereotype of myopic jingoism common among a people whose perspective simply cannot accomodate any view other than their own. Perhaps it's easier for me to handle the critics of America because I live as a guest in someone else's country, a place where America bashing is part of the cultural identity. (It's harmless, and really quite funny--especially when people doing the bashing learn that I'm an American!) What I wish the jingoists among us would learn, is that our friends around the world truly are our friends. Many nations who have criticized our policies have stood shoulder to shoulder with us on the battlefield. Others have
Re: [biofuel] Weapons of Mass Deception
In a message dated 2/24/2004 4:00:56 AM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: . At this point any of the alternative party candidates are merely spoilers, and votes for any of them are effectively votes for Bush. If your only goal it to defeat Mr. Bush, you vote for the lesser of two evils, but you still get evil. Especially in the congressional races, your vote won't count for much, but your protest vote, for another party, will send a powerfull message, especially if the scum can't get a real majority. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Buy Ink Cartridges or Refill Kits for your HP, Epson, Canon or Lexmark Printer at MyInks.com. Free s/h on orders $50 or more to the US Canada. http://www.c1tracking.com/l.asp?cid=5511 http://us.click.yahoo.com/mOAaAA/3exGAA/qnsNAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] the veils being rent
Good Intelligence; Wrong Conclusions We are at an epochal moment in history. Some at the top know of the breathtaking earth changes coming, but are reacting in fear to protect their own rather than see that the lesson to be learned is that we are all part of the same ecosystem. We must transition from fossil and nuclear. The evil in each of us has led to the ascendancy of short term and small context motivations and their effects; we are creating a hell. At the same time, a beautiful possible future is becoming clearer to some. Jim McCue composter and biotech researcher = http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_svo.html http://www.fryaway.com http://homepage.mac.com/webmasterkai/fryaway/diesel.html http://homepage.mac.com/webmasterkai/fryaway/rudolfdiesel.html http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuels-biz/ http://www.ott.doe.gov/pdfs/jtb_biodiesel.pdf = From: CLIMATE COLLAPSE: The Pentagon's Weather Nightmare The climate could change radically, and fast. That would be the mother of all national security issues. FORTUNE Monday, January 26, 2004 By David Stipp http://www.fortune.com/fortune/print/0,15935,582584,00.html Growing evidence suggests the ocean-atmosphere system that controls the world's climate can lurch from one state to another in less than a decade - like a canoe that's gradually tilted until suddenly it flips over. Scientists don't know how close the system is to a critical threshold. But abrupt climate change may well occur in the not-too-distant future... the Pentagon has become interested in abrupt climate change...Though Mother Nature caused past abrupt climate changes, the one that may be shaping up today probably has more to do with us...A few years ago such changes seemed signs of possible trouble for our kids or grandkids. Today they seem portents of a cataclysm that may not conveniently wait until we're history...possible abrupt climate change within two decades... http://www.tompaine.com/feature2.cfm/ID/9882 International Panel on Climate Change Summary for Policy Makers http://www.ipcc.ch/pub/spm22-01.pdf Environment 2004: Bush's Record on Global Warming http://www.environment2004.org/global_warming.php = http://www.informationclearinghouse.info http://www.projectcensored.org http://www.universalfriends.org = http://www.johndinges.com/condor/revelations.htm ...CIA and FBI officials obtained interrogation reports of Condor captives while the prisoners were being tortured... = Crops 'widely contaminated' by genetically modified DNA http://www.newscientist.com/news/news.jsp?id=ns4709 US scientists are warning of a potentially serious risk to human health after the discovery that traditional varieties of major American food crops are widely contaminated by DNA sequences from GM crops. Crops engineered to produce industrial chemicals and drugs - so-called pharm crops - could already be poisoning ostensibly GM-free crops grown for food, warns the study by the Washington-based Union of Concerned Scientists... http://www.ucsusa.org/ http://www.newscientist.com/hottopics/gm/ The Biodiversity Convention http://www.biodiv.org http://www.bite-back.org === http://www.consortiumnews.com/links.html http://sunshine-project.org/ http://www.australiagroup.net http://www.topica.com/lists/biowar/read/
Re: [biofuel] Re: Make plans to shut O'Hare down long-term
Alan, The soot layer is more likely to be on the ground, combined with large areas of misc. constructions and clearance of land mass. This would give a larger emission factor of the ground and a warming of the lower atmosphere. Maybe the global waring have a contribution from this also. The upper atmosphere would not only radiate more heat to space, but also to earth, with different wave length. You would also get a significant warming of the upper atmosphere and what we talk about is global warming of the lower atmosphere. I do belive that the changes in emission factors do play an important part in climate change. Hakan At 06:23 24/02/2004, you wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 2/23/2004 12:07:36 PM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Perhaps. But don't forget that the particulates in question are soot, which tends to absorb heat rather than reflecting it. That's the point. The soot absorbs heat that would otherwise reach the ground and increases the emissivity of the upper atmosphere, radiating more heat into space. Ah. Now I understand the mechanism. I realize they went to a lot of effort to eliminate smoke from jets; when I was young almost all jets were smoky. However, given that the airlines fly under government regulation, a mandatory smoky engine could be imposed by any dumb non-elected FAA administrator, as long as the scientifically trained lawyers in congress would permit it. Quite possibly, it could be achieved without any engine modifications -- don't want to void the warranty -- by additives to the fuel (easy to enforce) or by injecting something into the exhaust. I know there's no shortage of morons in Congress, but, fortunately, I don't think any of them are quite _that_ dumb. If they could seed cloud formation at high altitude (big if), the clouds would be more effective than soot. Funny you should mention that. One time, while I was living in Germany, on my way to work this one morning I watched an airliner fly across the sky. It was a bright, clear morning with a brilliant blue sky. The airliner left a bright white contrail across the sky. My office was in a corner of an upper floor of a large hangar, with big windows so I had a good view of the sky. Over the course of the next couple of hours I watched that contrail expand until it had become a thin overcast of cirrus clouds covering almost the entire sky. There is no doubt in my mind that under the right conditions airplanes can indeed seed high altitude cloud formation. AP Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Weapons of Mass Deception
At 02:33 AM 2/24/04 -0500, Allan wrote: I believe you mis-spelled Southerners. Or perhaps Confederates. Nope. Southron was and remains the term for a person who supported the Confederate States of America, as opposed to someone who just happened to live in the southeast. And don't forget that the South fired the first shot. When Federal troops moved in under cover of darkness and occupied Fort Sumner, right smack in the middle of the CSA's largest harbor, something had to give. The agreement worked out was that Anderson and his troops would remain in place until their food ran out, at which point they could surrender without loss of face. When Lincoln ordered ships to make the run into the harbor to reprovision the fort, he didn't leave the Confederate government with much choice. It's perhaps useful to remember that the Northern states had just passed a law that raised import duties, the sales tax of that era and the Federal government's primary funding source, from around 15% to around 35%. Even without the increase, the Federal government was taking about a hundred million a year out of the South in fees widely deemed to be governmental protection fees supporting Northern industry. Import duties were collected at customs houses, which is what Ft. Sumner was. That's why so many interpreted the occupation of the fort as a statement that the federal government intended to collect the additional tax come what may. There was a lot of behind the scenes negotiating going on as the Lincoln government attempted to get the Southern states to agree to return to the Union. Lincoln offered to roll back the tax increase to something around 20%, with the added inducement of a constitutional amendment guaranteeing that the Federal government would not interfere with the institution of slavery, but by that time, the secession fever was so strong that the offer to roll back the tax increase fell on deaf ears. Some Southerners had been preaching war for years, and very many were happy when it came. No doubt. But you've reduced The Civil War (The War Between The States) to blue and grey, and it wasn't that simple then either. Such things never are. There were Union militias formed in the deep south, and union sympathizers into the deepest of the deep south. Likewise there were Confederate militias formed north of the Mason-Dixon line that made life interesting in the North. And there were also Confederate sympathizers all over the north. Indeed. The slaveholding states of Maryland, Delaware, Kentucky and Missouri fought on the Northern side. The Confederate states themselves were a fractious lot that had more differences than commonalities. Particularly in the last year of the war, their leaders spent nearly as much time fighting among themselves as they did fighting the Union. Too true. Your comment about the military-industrial complex rings hollow, because after 1865 the military-industrial complex practically ceased to exist. You might find it interesting to study the relationship between Lamar Dupont and the Lincoln administration. The United States didn't keep a large standing army, so it didn't need a large industry to supply a large standing army. There are those who would suggest that given the corporate forces unleased by the war, most of the troops weren't in uniform, that it was only when the troops were needed to show the flag, as in the secession of Panama from Columbia, that the connection between corporate America and the troops became explicit. And yet, to this day, The Civil War was our most damaging war to date. Largely because of the use of Napoleanic tactics in early industrial warfare there were huge numbers of casualties. Because of this The Civil War produced more American deaths than all of our other wars combined. Cold Harbor is a good example of the scale of the tragedy. I say again, get Bush out of the White House first. Worry about making major changes to the federal government later. Your call. My perspective is that we all lost the war, and that the governmental protestations of democratic action have been a sham ever since. As the boss of Tammany Hall said so well, I don't care who you let vote so long as I get to decide who runs. Given the rampant emotionalism evident on both sides, it's likely that the game will continue in stalemate for some time to come. To quote Mayor Daley, Today, the real problem is the future. It's my hope that opening up new energy sources at the grass roots level (which I thought was the point behind this list) will open up new options for change. That's why we're working on building a micro reactor for converting carbon-based waste into methanol. It used to be that newspapers had a stranglehold on information, but the internet
Re: [biofuel] Re: Weapons of Mass Deception
Hello Walt At 12:36 AM 2/24/04 +, you wrote: --- In biofuel@yahoogroups.com, Walt Patrick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Someone lacking the stones to even sign his post. Please don't swagger around like some testosterone saturated teenager looking for trouble. Look at the email address if you want to see my name. People who have the courage of their convictions aren't shy about signing their names to what they post. They don't hide behind email addresses. You called me out by name to ridicule my post; at least have the class to sign yours. Unless it's the policy of the list owner to allow anonymous personal attacks. No such policy. Netiquette should be enough. Personal attacks can sometimes be appropriate, as in life, impossible to make sensible rules about it, but behaviour that called for such an attack would clearly be beyond Netiqutte and normal social mores. Taking exception as you did to a bit of sneering wouldn't qualify (especially with such an ironic result). It doesn't make much sense either to refer to an email address for a name, in view of the unfortunate (IMO) Internet custom of using noms-de-plume and in some cases multiple aliases. Whatever-his/her-name-is begins to look like a hit-and-run artist anyway. We'll see. Don't bother yourself too much about it. Best Keith Walt Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Buy Ink Cartridges or Refill Kits for your HP, Epson, Canon or Lexmark Printer at MyInks.com. Free s/h on orders $50 or more to the US Canada. http://www.c1tracking.com/l.asp?cid=5511 http://us.click.yahoo.com/mOAaAA/3exGAA/qnsNAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Weapons of Mass Deception
Walt Patrick wrote: snip It's my hope that opening up new energy sources at the grass roots level (which I thought was the point behind this list) One of them, and it's been and continues to be most successful. will open up new options for change. That's why we're working on building a micro reactor for converting carbon-based waste into methanol. It used to be that newspapers had a stranglehold on information, but the internet has completely undercut their ability to control public perception. I believe that the development of _in situ_ power sources has the potential to similarly dethrone the oil companies and make their stranglehold on society into a historical footnote. Yes, that's always the theme here, we're always saying so, the archives is full of it - it's absolutely essential, if there's to be any history. Though there'll always be a role for centralised production, but not on any throne. Politicians, right and left, lie. That's hardly news, and hardly likely to change unless conditions render them irrelevant. That's why I'm here on this list, to glean information which might help further that goal. It's becoming quite evident that other would rather pursue their paritsan agenda regardless of how many people it drives off-list. I'd like you to amplify that please. Please be specific, you've intimated something like this previously - who and what exactly are you talking about? And why do you think people are been driven off-list? Which people? I think you're falling into your own trap of seeing things according to a partisan agenda, but in a different, much broader, and much more important sense, that goes much further than the national concerns of some among the minority American contingent here. Us and them, and you're not considering them, but them is the majority here, non-Americans of every ilk. You think your election only concerns Americans? The actions of your current administration have been the cause of the biggest protests worldwide and the most vocal and united opposition the world has ever seen, by a very long way, quite unprecedented. You think it has nothing to do with biofuels and localising power sources? If so you're not thinking very clearly. Now please tell us just who and what you're pointing the finger at. Best Keith Walt Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Re: America has gone super-sized
Hi Robert Keith Addison wrote: He knew what the basic wealth is, very wise. You'd think of course an agricultural research scientist would know that, but so many don't, even today. Yields! Efficiency! Having grown up in the era of the green revolution, it's been very hard to accept that modern farming practices are detrimental. I remember watching films at school touting the victory of modern farming over pestilences, and how increased yields were wiping out hunger. Much of this propaganda tied directly into the jingoism taught as fact by the entire culture around me as I grew to adulthood, so it was easy to dismiss my uncle's concern as third world sour grapes. Further, the fertilization / pesticide / herbicide cycle harks back to the 19th century idea that putting something into the soil means you can take something out of it. Well, that's true, but... (I can't remember from whence that originated.) From Baron Justus von Liebig. This mentality leads to chemical inputs--e.g. the plants don't care what kind of nutrients they're receiving, as long as they are nutrients! So, we sterilize our soil in an effort to grow plants. . . That's right (no it's wrong!), it's called NPK thinking, all that's needed is to provide the Nitrogen, Phosphorus and Potassium that the crop will remove, with several myths attached: - that only these major nutrients matter - though the list kept being expanded until eventually there were 45 or so, including micro-nutrients, plus the addition of the law of the little bit, which holds that the nutrient, major or minor, that's missing is the constraining factor, no matter if all the others are right; - that humus and its associated soilfoodweb, the soil's teeming micro-life, simply didn't matter - the soil itself didn't matter, beyond being stuff that conveniently props the plant up (maybe). This sums it up: To grow a plant such as a sunflower successfully with chemicals, all that was necessary to know was the composition of the ash. If the inorganic materials were supplied as chemicals soluble in water and in about the proportions that they occur in soil water, a plant could be grown to full size and maturity in water cultures. Hydroponics is the modern version of the Liebig ideas. (Howard) And (also Howard): The principle followed, based on the Liebig tradition, is that any deficiencies in the soil solution can be made up by the addition of suitable chemicals. This is based on a complete misconception of plant nutrition. It is superficial and fundamentally unsound. It takes no account of the life of the soil, including the mycorrhizal association -- the living fungous bridge which connects soil and sap. Artificial manures lead inevitably to artificial nutrition, artificial food, artificial animals, and finally to artificial men and women. As is now plain to see. Liebig subsequently retracted these ideas, though the retraction has been, one can only say, censored, suppressed - it's very hard to find. He'd written this, in 1855: Unfortunately the true beauty of agriculture with its intellectual and animating principles is almost unrecognized. The art of agriculture will be lost when ignorant, unscientific and short sighted teachers persuade the farmer to put all his hopes in universal remedies, which don't exist in nature. Following their advice, bedazzled by an ephemeral success, the farmer will forget the soil and lose sight of its inherent values and their influence. Not very Liebigean, one would think. And then this, towards the end of his life: I had sinned against the wisdom of our creator, and received just punishment for it. I wanted to improve his handiwork, and in my blindness, I believed that in this wonderful chain of laws, which ties life to the surface of the earth and always keeps it rejuvenated, there might be a link missing that had to be replaced by me--this weak, powerless nothing. The law, to which my research on the topsoil led me, states, 'On the outer crust of the earth, under the influence of the sun, organic life shall develop'. And so, the great master and builder gave the fragments of the earth the ability to attract and hold all these elements necessary to feed plants and further serve animals, like a magnet attracts and holds iron particles, so as no piece be lost. Our master enclosed a second law unto this one, through which the plant bearing earth becomes an enormous cleansing apparatus for the water. Through this particular ability, the earth removes from the water all substances harmful to humans and animals--all products of decay and putrefaction, of perished plant and animal generations. What might justify my actions is the circumstance, that a man is the product of his time, and he is only able to escape the commonly accepted views if a violent pressure urges him to muster all his strength to struggle free of these chains of error. The opinion, that plants
Re: [biofuel] Bhopal
In a message dated 2/23/04 1:24:09 PM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: In a message dated 2/23/2004 7:30:44 AM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: such as Union Carbide's metamorphosis into Dow Chemicals after its corporate terrorism in Bhopal (1984). As I understood it, there was terrorism, but not by Union Carbide. Someone sabotaged the plant. Can you clue us in on what really happened? Please? I'd really like to know what happened and how and who was at fault. While we're at the subject of corporate crimes, consider the City of New York, which prohibited the use of asbestos insulation in the World Trade Center when they had only insulated the structure, against fire, up to the 44 th floor. At that time, long before 9-11, the architect said, If there's ever a fire above the 44th floor, that building is coming down. Whose fault was it that the buildings did not withstand an unusual fire above the 44th floor? Search the archives of Chemical Week Magazine for information on Phopal. It is comprehensive although there will be those who will automatically conclude that the reporting is biased because UC's defense is well stated. Bear in mind, as well, that UC's alledged liability was predicated on two things, both tlatently stated by the Indian government: First, UC was a deep pockets and second, they engaged in a dangerous activity so liability was theirs regardless of how the tragedy occurred. As far as the WTC, it is not obvious that asbestos or any other means of structural protection would have been sufficient to protect the buildings against thousands of gallons of jet fuel burning virtually all at once. I have a hard time considering this to be a corporate crime. -- Jay [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Buy Ink Cartridges or Refill Kits for your HP, Epson, Canon or Lexmark Printer at MyInks.com. Free s/h on orders $50 or more to the US Canada. http://www.c1tracking.com/l.asp?cid=5511 http://us.click.yahoo.com/mOAaAA/3exGAA/qnsNAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Moral Dilemma...
x-charset ISO-8859-1Last thing in the world I need Bryan, is pointers from people such as yourself who advocate doing less than what is possible. If you want to lay down like a doormat, great. Knock yourself out. Go ahead and waste what little political capital you have and don't vote. Seal the tomb with a little bit more of that concrete called inaction. Some people burn a candle from both ends, others from only one. You would apparently prefer to do neither and stumble around in darkness. Todd Swearingen - Original Message - From: Bryan Brah [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2004 10:12 AM Subject: RE: [biofuel] Moral Dilemma... Todd, I'm speaking from historical and empirical evidence when I say that it doesn't matter which party is in power, nor does it make a whit who you vote for. The illusion of a two party system it is just that. While each party pushes its own pet programs, history has shown time and time again, that only when those plans benefit the corporate oligarchs do they come to fruition. So you can dream all you like about how wonderful the world would be if Al Gore had not had the election stolen from him, but that doesn't change the fact that it was and perhaps that was the reason so. Here's a little pointer to help you navigate the real world, your political naivety would almost be charming were you not so self righteous. -BRAH -Original Message- From: Appal Energy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, February 23, 2004 7:58 PM To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [biofuel] Moral Dilemma... Bryan, As you point out Todd, I was the first to frame this discussion in the us-them democrat-republican thing, but it was merely an anticipatory post Yup. Pretty sad that. Thankfully life in general isn't orchestrated the same way you would manipulate a conversation. If it were to model your method there would be but birth and death with no trip in between. As for your to wit? PNGV was Gore/Clinton's baby. They saw the writing on the wall and certainly were capable of understanding that while fuel cells hold futuristic benefits, they were and are not a technology that can fill the enormous gap in the interim. It will take 30-40 years at best to convert a liquid fuels infrastructure to a market wide hydrogen economy. And that's under a transportation Marshall Plan. Putting 10 year life cycles on automobiles, on average, these people knew full well that there would be 2 and 3 generations of automobile manufacture before a general onset of fuel cell powered transport could become a reality. That's hundreds of millions of vehicle sales that could have largely been alternatives to present market offerings. But when using your pre-emptive thought process Gore would have scragged PNGV as readily as Bush? Yeah. Right. And the pope is going to convert to Episcopalianism. You really need to get those political scales of yours recalibrated. You seem to think the end results of a dual party legislative/executive cycle are going to yield duplicit results as a single party cycle. There's a big difference between a set of scales at least partly in balance and those where a heavy thumb is always depressing one side.. As for I don't discount them in the least; I simply doubt that anything I can do (within the current electoral system) will make a difference on their actions. Then I suggest you sit on your thumb and spin to your heart's content while the rest of the world picks up your slack. Todd Swearingen - Original Message - From: Bryan Brah [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, February 23, 2004 12:43 PM Subject: RE: [biofuel] Moral Dilemma... As you point out Todd, I was the first to frame this discussion in the us-them democrat-republican thing, but it was merely an anticipatory post. Any time Dubya does something stupid, shortsighted, or reckless, which happens often enough, invariably the lamentation goes up that had he not stole the election from Al Gore, everything would be different. To wit: I can tell you one thing for absolute certain. Had Shrub not been appointed we'd still have PNGV and probably a few 10,000 more hybrids on the road and a myriad of other similar far reaching policies that would benefit future generations rather than lining the pockets of contemporary corporations as is the present destructive trend. How can you be so sure? With Republicans controlling both houses Wooden Al would be hard pressed to pass anything. And while they don't have enough votes to override a presidential veto, they could easily have inserted their environmental rollbacks in appropriations, national security, or trade legislation. Oh wait a minute, that's what they did anyway under GW. Uhhhthere's just one other thing. If you think
Re: [biofuel] Biodiesel Quality?
x-charset ISO-8859-1Biodiesel naturally absorbs some water, hence the cloudiness after a wash. The wash test recommended is simply to determine whether your fuel is of reasonable enough standard as to put in a tank. You don't do that until the fuel has clarified. That can be done either with time and gravity or heat and gravity. Trying to boil the water off is a waste of energy. Todd Swearingen - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2004 11:53 AM Subject: Re: [biofuel] Biodiesel Quality? Hi again, Another dumb question. Is this heating a needed step and if it is how long should it be heated for? There's no need to heat the finished fuel to this high of a temp to dry it. Approximately 120*F (~46*C) is more than sufficient to get any microscopic water to settle out before putting the fuel in the tank. If it seperates like you say I am good to go before heating or after? Thanks again Rick M Brownstown, Mi The simplest home test for fuel acceptability is to put equal parts fuel and water in a closed container and agitate radically for a few seconds. If the fuel and water separate immediately with no emulsion other than a thin interface film you're good to go. Todd Swearingen [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ /x-charset
[biofuel] Comprehensive Biodiesel Class, Laytonville, CA, March 13
Comprehensive Homebrew Biodiesel Class March 13, 2004 At Biofuel Station, Laytonville, CA instructor: Maria Mark Alovert Biodiesel is a renewable fuel made from any plant oil and other fats. It can be used in any diesel engine without modifications, and can be made easily in your backyard. Biodiesel greatly reduces emissions, is biodegradable, safe to handle, safe to transport and store once made, and has a very positive lifecycle energy balance. It is currently produced worldwide on a commercial and home scale. Because it is so easy to make, biodiesel is a viable alternative for local, home-scale, farm- and village- scale energy production. Come learn the ins and outs of making biodiesel fuel from used restaurant fryer oil. There will be hands-on practice in making and testing small batches of fuel, as well as demos of equipment, techniques, a discussion of the biodiesel industry, co-operatives, and a related discussion of how 'homebrew' techniques can be used as part of a solution for community controlled energy. Optional textbook available for $7 (75 pages). Bring a notebook and safety glasses if you have them, and a potluck dish to share for lunch. The following day, at Yokayo Biofuels in Ukiah, is the first meeting of the Biodiesel Council of California, an alliance of consumers, producers, and distributors for sustainable B100 biodiesel (www.biodieselcouncil.org) The class will be held at Biofuel Station in Laytonville, Ca (Northern Mendocino County, off of Hwy 101) When: Saturday, March 13th, 2004 Time: 9:00 a.m. - 5:00 p.m Cost: $20-$50 sliding scale, no one turned away for lack of funds $7 for optional 75-page textbook To register: [EMAIL PROTECTED] or Kimber: 707-984 6818 Instructor contact: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For other upcoming biodiesel workshops and events, please see: www.groups.yahoo.com/group/norcal-biodiesel-events ** Previous classes have covered the following curriculum: Introduction/ overview: - Biodiesel and straight vegetable oil- two different fuels -Advantages and drawbacks of biodiesel fuel Biodiesel chemistry: - Biodiesel from virgin oil - Biodiesel from waste vegetable oil - KOH catalyst versus NaOH catalyst - Two enemies of the reaction: free fatty acids, water - Conditions and ingredients needed for reaction Safety: methanol, lye, and safety equipment Homebrew biodiesel demonstration: - how to make 1-liter test batches - washing intro Hands-on student practice: - Oil tests: testing for water content, - titration- testing for free fatty acids content - Students make liter batches - Failures and quality control: 'glop' (soap), soapy fuel, and poor conversion Troubleshooting and testing: -Acid value test (washed fuel) -Reprocess test (unwashed fuel) -Wash test (unwashed fuel) -cloud point/gel point -pH of unwashed fuel (rough indicator) -soap test and catalyst test (unwashed fuel) -Tests we don't recommend: specific gravity and viscosity Hands-on: students make full size batch Washing -bubblewashing/mistwashing -Using the wash as a form of feedback -Troubleshooting emulsification -Fixing emulsions Equipment (as seen at www.veggieavenger.com/media ): -Processor options: water heater-based, drums-based, generic plumbing for any tank you find -no-weld versus welded options -regulations, safety, and containment -Plastics and biodiesel -The problems with existing 'kit' processors -Wash tanks -Heating options -Standpipe tanks and dip tubes -Pump types -Circulating pump-based agitation, mechanical agitation -Passive methanol/catalyst mixing versus mechanical catalyst mixing -Carboy methoxide mixing systems -homebuilt bubblewash aerators -system layout for larger systems -5-gallon systems Glycerol: -Removing methanol -Free fatty acids recovery/glycerine purification -Making soap -Composting glycerine Brief discussion of advanced topics: -Acid-base two-stage method/pretreatment of free fatty acids -Methanol recovery -Additives -Ethanol biodiesel Conclusion: -The commercial biodiesel industry, the NBB, and biodiesel consumer activism -Decentralized energy production -Where to go from here? -Co-ops and homebrew 'cells' Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Weapons of Mass Deception
At 04:50 AM 2/25/04 +0900, Keith wrote: Politicians, right and left, lie. That's hardly news, and hardly likely to change unless conditions render them irrelevant. That's why I'm here on this list, to glean information which might help further that goal. It's becoming quite evident that other would rather pursue their paritsan agenda regardless of how many people it drives off-list. I'd like you to amplify that please. Please be specific, you've intimated something like this previously - who and what exactly are you talking about? And why do you think people are been driven off-list? Which people? Are you sure I'm the one you're thinking of? I believe that this is the first time I've raised the issue, but others have heretofore protested the abuse of the list and been essentially told point blank to shut up or leave. I can assure you that I've thought about unsubscribing more than once in the last few weeks due to the level of partisan hatred that's dominated the list of late. I come here to learn about biofuel, not to hear rants from folks who hate Bush but somehow fail to remember the thirty to forty thousand men, women and children who were infected with HIV and Hep-C by tainted blood drawn from Arkansas prisons and illegally sold in Canada in order to fund Clinton's run for the White House. I can't conceive how anyone could not be totally outraged over that. I think you're falling into your own trap of seeing things according to a partisan agenda, but in a different, much broader, and much more important sense, that goes much further than the national concerns of some among the minority American contingent here. Us and them, and you're not considering them, but them is the majority here, non-Americans of every ilk. You think your election only concerns Americans? It's not my election. I'm not a citizen. The actions of your current administration See above comment. have been the cause of the biggest protests worldwide and the most vocal and united opposition the world has ever seen, by a very long way, quite unprecedented. Not according to my reading of history, but even if it were true, I'm not particularly impressed by volume and quantity. You think it has nothing to do with biofuels and localising power sources? If so you're not thinking very clearly. Please don't mistake my focused interest in biofuel for a lack of interest in other matters, but meaning no offense, there are other lists which cover those topics with less vitriol and more insight than I've seen displayed here. Now please tell us just who and what you're pointing the finger at. Since you asked . You're the list owner, so I guess that would be you. I would invite you to give some thought to just what mission you want this list to serve, and whether you want to impose a requirement that in order to participate folk most be (1) interested in the development of biofuels and (2) hate Bush's guts. I believe that there are lots of people who can advance the first criteria without having to pass the litmus test of the second. As list owner, you can do what you want, but it's important to ask yourself whether you bear something of a host's obligation to insure that any guest who comes to your list and posts in good faith is treated with civility. I'm not a troll. I've posted numerous times about issues having to do with the synthesis of methanol, a process which we're steadily working towards bringing on line here. I'm also not partisan; I don't care who wins and my personal feeling is that it's a damn shame they can't both lose. Talk which focuses on how the current administration is affecting biofuel issues is certainly a good topic of discussion for this list, but the list has of late gone way beyond that. When the ugliness gets so deep in here that even neutral fellow travelers are being attacked as enemies, it's time to do some soul searching. Perhaps you feel that this Bush-bashing truly does advance the cause of biofuels. I don't, and would really like to see the bandwidth focused more on biofuels. Ultimately, it's your list, and it's your call. Walt Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/biofuel/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
