Re: Planning to create a new distro of Ubuntu.
On Wed, Nov 06, 2013 at 02:13:21PM +0800, Ben Tinner wrote: On Mon Nov 4 12:41:29 UTC 2013, Daniel Holbach wrote: Are you planning to get the necessary packages into Ubuntu itself? That might help make maintenance a lot easier. The guys at MATE are currently attempting to upload the packages to Debian but as of now there is little progress into it. The MATE repository have MATE packages for Ubuntu available, so I included the MATE repo for the packages. Shall we pull all the MATE packages into the Ubuntu repo directly or we build the sources ourselves? It would be far superior to fix the problem with uploading to Debian rather than working around it by uploading directly to Ubuntu or by maintaining a separate repository. Unless there is a *lot* of effort available to deal with Ubuntu-local packaging, having the packages in Debian as well generally yields better results. -- Colin Watson [cjwat...@ubuntu.com] -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Planning to create a new distro of Ubuntu.
On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 6:21 AM, Colin Watson cjwat...@ubuntu.com wrote: On Wed, Nov 06, 2013 at 02:13:21PM +0800, Ben Tinner wrote: On Mon Nov 4 12:41:29 UTC 2013, Daniel Holbach wrote: Are you planning to get the necessary packages into Ubuntu itself? That might help make maintenance a lot easier. The guys at MATE are currently attempting to upload the packages to Debian but as of now there is little progress into it. The MATE repository have MATE packages for Ubuntu available, so I included the MATE repo for the packages. Shall we pull all the MATE packages into the Ubuntu repo directly or we build the sources ourselves? It would be far superior to fix the problem with uploading to Debian rather than working around it by uploading directly to Ubuntu or by maintaining a separate repository. Unless there is a *lot* of effort available to deal with Ubuntu-local packaging, having the packages in Debian as well generally yields better results. And there is in fact a team working on packaging MATE for Debian: pkg-mate-t...@lists.alioth.debian.org -- Andrew Starr-Bochicchio Ubuntu Developer https://launchpad.net/~andrewsomething Debian Developer http://qa.debian.org/developer.php?login=asb PGP/GPG Key ID: D53FDCB1 -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Planning to create a new distro of Ubuntu
On Sat, Nov 2, 2013 at 1:22 PM, Ben Tinner bentin...@yahoo.com.sg wrote: Hello I am planning to create a new distro of Ubuntu which will have the GNOME 2 look and feel. For those of you who are subscribed to ubuntu-users, you would have heard about my plans to create this (Anyone interested in a GNOME 2 look and feel remix?). Officially called Ubuntu MATE Remix, this will integrate the MATE Desktop Environment to the power and stability of Ubuntu. In fact, I already had a working prototype based on Saucy Salamander. You can download the prototype at https://shared.com/unqjauvtrj Currently, there are a few issues with the prototype. 1. I do not know how to implement a GUI bootmenu in the Live CD (like the one used in the Ubuntu Live CD). 2. I do not know how to make the system to autostart the GUI, so the only way to start the GUI is to type 'startx' on the command line. Have a look at /etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf.d/ which determines which environment to load. Apparently the default is still configured there (user-session=ubuntu ?), and since those packages are not available, you get the CLI prompt. I will be generating another prototype based on Trusty Tahr soon. After testing out my prototype, can you give me a few suggestions to improve the distro? I hope that this will be officially recognised and supported by the Ubuntu community. I am totally new to MATE; I notice that the MATE packages exist in a separate repository. Do you know of any effort to get them to 'universe'? I think that would help tremendously. Simos -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Planning to create a new distro of Ubuntu
On Tue, Nov 5, 2013 at 1:50 AM, Benjamin Kerensa bkere...@ubuntu.com wrote: It is unclear why Linux Mint disables all of their security updates although to some degree they have tried to justify their disabling of kernel updates by suggesting that such updates could make a system unstable and that normal users shouldn't get these kinds of updates. Sounds like bad maintainers justifying being bad if you ask me. -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Planning to create a new distro of Ubuntu
On Tue, Nov 05, 2013 at 02:11:45AM -0600, Jordon Bedwell wrote: Sounds like bad maintainers justifying being bad if you ask me. Please be respectful. The Ubuntu Code of Conduct applies on this list. It's fine to call out their security policy. That appears to be based on fact. But I don't think it's reasonable to speculate by attacking them, especially in their absence and without having an understanding of their rationale. Please can we keep this thread constructive? -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Planning to create a new distro of Ubuntu
On Tue, Nov 5, 2013 at 2:40 AM, Robie Basak robie.ba...@ubuntu.com wrote: It's fine to call out their security policy. That appears to be based on fact. But I don't think it's reasonable to speculate by attacking them, especially in their absence and without having an understanding of their rationale. In no way did I personally attack anybody, I stated an opinion and an opinion that will be iterated by anybody who cares about security. And in no way could that ever be considered speculation because it is not theoretical that the policy is bad, it is well known that any policy that leaves a user in a state of bad security is bad. -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Planning to create a new distro of Ubuntu
hi, Am Dienstag, den 05.11.2013, 07:32 +0200 schrieb Nik Th: I'm don't watch the conversation from the beginning , but I assume (in your distro) you will keep the original repositories and official packages , correct ? I'm not a developer, thus I cannot help you with coding, but if you decide to release this distro of yours, I would like to participate as a tester. Drop a note in this list or my e-mail when you are ready. i am not the person wanting to build a new distro, but as ubuntu developer i would be happy to give a hand with the few harder steps it takes (creating seeds and metapackages, making regular image builds on cdimage work etc) to create a proper derivative... before this can happen the mate packages need to go into the ubuntu archive proper though ... (or even into debian so we can just sync them from there and they can benefit too) ciao oli signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Planning to create a new distro of Ubuntu
Do you think that Linux Mint is a vulnerable system ? Really ? https://github.com/linuxmint/mintupdate/blob/master/usr/lib/linuxmint/mintUpdate/rules this is the list of packages it will never update, instead of just integrating changes properly with the packagaes in the ubuntu archive they instead suppress doing (security) updates at all for them. It looks like that is not quite the case. Packages that are marked as 4 and 5 are not updated by default, whereas 1-3 are. This is a setting which can be changed: http://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?f=47t=111929 Still probably insecure, but I understand they are trying to balance between security and regressions. -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Planning to create a new distro of Ubuntu
02.11.2013, 20:00, Oliver Grawert o...@ubuntu.com: It might for exmaple allow security updates (which are explicitly hacked out of Linux Mint for Xorg, the kernel, Firefox, the bootloader and various other packages) so that you dont have to go online with a vulnerable system ;) ciao oli , -- Do you think that Linux Mint is a vulnerable system ? Really ? -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Planning to create a new distro of Ubuntu
Am Montag, den 04.11.2013, 13:19 +0200 schrieb Nik Th: 02.11.2013, 20:00, Oliver Grawert o...@ubuntu.com: It might for exmaple allow security updates (which are explicitly hacked out of Linux Mint for Xorg, the kernel, Firefox, the bootloader and various other packages) so that you dont have to go online with a vulnerable system ;) ciao oli , -- Do you think that Linux Mint is a vulnerable system ? Really ? https://github.com/linuxmint/mintupdate/blob/master/usr/lib/linuxmint/mintUpdate/rules this is the list of packages it will never update, instead of just integrating changes properly with the packagaes in the ubuntu archive they instead suppress doing (security) updates at all for them. i would say forcefully keeping a vulnerable kernel browser or xorg in place instead of allowing the provided security updates to be installer makes it a vulnerable system, yes i personally wouldn't do online banking with it ;) ciao oli signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Planning to create a new distro of Ubuntu
Hello, On 02.11.2013 16:52, Ben Tinner wrote: I am planning to create a new distro of Ubuntu which will have the GNOME 2 look and feel. For those of you who are subscribed to ubuntu-users, you would have heard about my plans to create this (Anyone interested in a GNOME 2 look and feel remix?). Officially called Ubuntu MATE Remix, this will integrate the MATE Desktop Environment to the power and stability of Ubuntu. In fact, I already had a working prototype based on Saucy Salamander. You can download the prototype at https://shared.com/unqjauvtrj Currently, there are a few issues with the prototype. 1. I do not know how to implement a GUI bootmenu in the Live CD (like the one used in the Ubuntu Live CD). 2. I do not know how to make the system to autostart the GUI, so the only way to start the GUI is to type 'startx' on the command line. I will be generating another prototype based on Trusty Tahr soon. After testing out my prototype, can you give me a few suggestions to improve the distro? I hope that this will be officially recognised and supported by the Ubuntu community. Are you planning to get the necessary packages into Ubuntu itself? That might help make maintenance a lot easier. People from the other Ubuntu flavours might be able to help out with some of the issues you mention above. Have a great day, Daniel -- Get involved in Ubuntu development! developer.ubuntu.com/packaging Follow @ubuntudev on identi.ca/twitter.com/facebook.com/G+ -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Planning to create a new distro of Ubuntu
04.11.2013, 13:45, Oliver Grawert o...@ubuntu.com: Am Montag, den 04.11.2013, 13:19 +0200 schrieb Nik Th: Do you think that Linux Mint is a vulnerable system ? Really ? https://github.com/linuxmint/mintupdate/blob/master/usr/lib/linuxmint/mintUpdate/rules this is the list of packages it will never update, instead of just integrating changes properly with the packagaes in the ubuntu archive they instead suppress doing (security) updates at all for them. i would say forcefully keeping a vulnerable kernel browser or xorg in place instead of allowing the provided security updates to be installer makes it a vulnerable system, yes i personally wouldn't do online banking with it ;) ciao oli , -- Thank you for clarifying this. Do you know the reason ? Why they don't update those packages ? I'm don't watch the conversation from the beginning , but I assume (in your distro) you will keep the original repositories and official packages , correct ? I'm not a developer, thus I cannot help you with coding, but if you decide to release this distro of yours, I would like to participate as a tester. Drop a note in this list or my e-mail when you are ready. Good Luck. -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Planning to create a new distro of Ubuntu
It is unclear why Linux Mint disables all of their security updates although to some degree they have tried to justify their disabling of kernel updates by suggesting that such updates could make a system unstable and that normal users shouldn't get these kinds of updates. Anyways it is something that might be better researched on their forums since people have asked a few times over the past couple years, and they probably have a better idea than us. I can say that it took them many months to get a fixed version of Firefox packaged while Ubuntu and Debian had already had security fixes in their package. This puts Linux Mint users at risk and is one of the key reasons I never suggest Linux Mint to anyone as an alternative to Ubuntu. On Mon, Nov 4, 2013 at 9:32 PM, Nik Th nikt...@yandex.com wrote: 04.11.2013, 13:45, Oliver Grawert o...@ubuntu.com: Am Montag, den 04.11.2013, 13:19 +0200 schrieb Nik Th: Do you think that Linux Mint is a vulnerable system ? Really ? https://github.com/linuxmint/mintupdate/blob/master/usr/lib/linuxmint/mintUpdate/rules this is the list of packages it will never update, instead of just integrating changes properly with the packagaes in the ubuntu archive they instead suppress doing (security) updates at all for them. i would say forcefully keeping a vulnerable kernel browser or xorg in place instead of allowing the provided security updates to be installer makes it a vulnerable system, yes i personally wouldn't do online banking with it ;) ciao oli , -- Thank you for clarifying this. Do you know the reason ? Why they don't update those packages ? I'm don't watch the conversation from the beginning , but I assume (in your distro) you will keep the original repositories and official packages , correct ? I'm not a developer, thus I cannot help you with coding, but if you decide to release this distro of yours, I would like to participate as a tester. Drop a note in this list or my e-mail when you are ready. Good Luck. -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss -- *Benjamin Kerensa* *http://benjaminkerensa.com http://benjaminkerensa.com* *I am what I am because of who we all are - Ubuntu* -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
Re: Planning to create a new distro of Ubuntu
hi, On Sat, 2 Nov 2013 13:28:32 -0400 Daniel Hollocher danielholloc...@gmail.com wrote: Officially called Ubuntu MATE Remix, this will integrate the MATE Desktop Environment to the power and stability of Ubuntu. In fact, I already had a working prototype based on Saucy Salamander. You can download the prototype at https://shared.com/unqjauvtrj What's the difference between this and Linux Mint MATE? It might for exmaple allow security updates (which are explicitly hacked out of Linux Mint for Xorg, the kernel, Firefox, the bootloader and various other packages) so that you dont have to go online with a vulnerable system ;) ciao oli pgpFMNtmDenlW.pgp Description: PGP signature -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list Ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
