Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Terry Blanton]

Copies of Magonia are difficult to find and expensive.  Mine is lost in one
of my moves; but, I have found a copy available online that may be
downloaded:

https://ia800904.us.archive.org/3/items/PassportToMagonia--UFOsFolkloreAndParallelWorldsJacquesVallee1993/Passport%20to%20Magonia%E2%80%94UFOs%2C%20Folklore%2C%20and%20Parallel%20Worlds%2C%20Jacques%20Vall%C3%A9e%20%281993%29.pdf

On Mon, May 24, 2021 at 4:04 PM Terry Blanton  wrote:

>
>
> On Mon, May 24, 2021 at 1:21 PM ROGER ANDERTON <
> r.j.ander...@btinternet.com> wrote:
>
>> Well, aliens supposedly refer to people as containers for souls
>>
>
> Ah, yes.  That reminds me of *Passport to Magonia*, probably Jacques
> Vallee's best work.
>
> https://www.reiters.com/book/9780987422484
>

Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Vibrator !]

> Cars are structurally complex. Just consider rubber balls of equal size and
> use their deformation as a measure of "damage". If the two rubber balls
> move towards each other they will deform an equal amount when they collide.
> If one rubber ball is resting against a massive wall and the other rubber
> ball runs into it will they experience the same deformation?
>


..the point was, which collision would you rather be in - which'll
dissipate the most energy, given that the collision speed is identical
in both cases?

The intention was to prompt one to calculate that the KE's are
calculated relative to the inertial FoR of the ground / planet, not
one another..

..thus colliding one rubber ball with the wall at say 2 m/s dissipates
4x as much energy as either ball colliding head-on at 1 m/s..

..and still twice as much as that of both balls together.  In short,
because energy squares with velocity relative to the ground (not one
another),
2x the absolute speed = 4x the energy.

The intent is to illustrate the dependence of CoE upon CoM and
inertial FoR's tho..

Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[H LV]

On Wed, Jun 2, 2021 at 10:41 AM Vibrator !  wrote:

>
> TL;DR  -  What's worse: crashing a car into an immovable static obstacle
> at some given speed, or else crashing into an identical oncoming car while
> both are at half that speed?  Hood-mounted radar would thus see identical
> closing speeds either way, ie. both cars at 10 mph = closing speed of 20
> mph, so which'll do more damage;  that, or else 20 mph into a concrete
> wall?
>
>
Cars are structurally complex. Just consider rubber balls of equal size and
use their deformation as a measure of "damage". If the two rubber balls
move towards each other they will deform an equal amount when they collide.
If one rubber ball is resting against a massive wall and the other rubber
ball runs into it will they experience the same deformation?

harry

Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Vibrator !]

FWIW momentum is conserved (time-invariant), whereas conservation of energy
is a consequence of CoM..

The real meat and potatoes here is that any 'energy' derivation always has
an equivalent metric comprised of the same components as momentum, just
evolving differently (ie. mV compared to ½mV²) - but if the system is
closed (time-invariant) then only momentum is necessarily conserved;  the
energy may dissipate, but net system momentum is constant wrt time.  Thus
the objective or 'absolute' reference frame is that of the zero-momentum
frame;  it is against this that we plot both energy and momenta, and
relative to which only energy may dissipate.

It's as well to get these fundamentals straight if we're serious about ever
thwarting 'em eh..

..what i'm getting at is that, by definition, any system with
time-dependent momentum exchanges is potentially amenable to thermodynamic
opening..

..and all fundamental force fields are indeed time-constant rates of
exchange of +/- h-bar;  thus with a little guile, time-asymmetric input vs
output phases of a closed-loop trajectory thru an ostensibly static field
(ie. gravity or an H field with zero curl & div) may yield non-zero net
momenta, and thus, potentially, effective auto-acceleration of the zero
momentum frame..  With the FoR itself accelerating a little each cycle, the
accumulating net velocity component adds to that of the 'energy' value in
the stationary (ie. lab) FoR of each cycle's I/O displacements, while each
cycle begins in this pseudo-static rest frame thus always performing the
same work each cycle, gaining the same net momentum for the same input
energy..  net input energy thus sums as the per-cycle input times the
number of elapsed cycles, while net output energy is transposed up by eg.
the square of the velocity component of the FoR divergence.



And yes, this is Bessler's principle, generalised in 1717 - ie. he
accurately predicted it must apply to all OU systems per se.  In his case
however, he was fixing the unit energy cost of momentum from gravity and
time, invariant of some range of system RPM:

 • lifting 1 kg by 1 m always costs 9.81 J, but the amount of momentum it
gains in dropping is a function of the initial speed, and thus the
drop-time * gravity's constant acceleration

 • hence designing a constantly-overbalancing mechanism is trivial;  the
problem is that as RPM's rise, the weights spend less time gravitating each
cycle, so per-cycle momentum yields are naturally inverse to RPM, all else
being equal - at double the speed you spend half as much time being
accelerated each cycle by gravity's constant uniform acceleration..

 • the per-cycle momentum yield thus follows the inverse-square of rising
angular velocity, thus locking the input-energy cost of angular momentum to
its ½Iw² KE value, ie. enforcing I/O or PE:KE symmetry

Mechanical over-unity thus entails some mechanism that does the same work
each cycle to buy the same rise in net momentum for the same input energy,
irrespective of some range of velocity;  if you can gain the same amount of
momentum from gravity and time by lifting and dropping the same amount of
weight 3 times in a row in spite of the net system acceleration, you now
have more KE than PE spent.

There's various techniques that can be employed to manipulate effective
G-times invariant of speed - for instance, the 'ice-skater effect', wherein
changing mass radius changes moment of inertia causing reactionless
accelerations to compensate speed and thus conserve spontaneous net angular
momentum, at the expense of modifying upswing vs downswing periods and thus
net angular momentum per cycle (ie. per swinging / kiiking).  All that is
required to break CoE is that whatever causes these I/O time-asymmetries
relative to whatever the fundamental force field, it must be effectively
reactionless / under conditions of inertial isolation (easier to do in a
rotating plane than a linear one eh)..

..this, because when you get right down to it, CoE in every circumstance we
can think of is being enforced by this constant background of I/O momentum
* time symmetry, via Newton's 3rd law and/or Lenz's law;  the only reason
we observe I/O energy unity is because both the input and output workloads
are usually in the same inertial FoR with constant net momentum.  Thus, the
only way OUT of that FoR is by escape via direct purchases momentum from a
fundamental force constant * time, WITHOUT interaction with any external
inertias or charges.

Divergence of the zero-momentum frame is Bessler's principle, in a nutshell
- if you can pay half a Joule to accelerate 1 kg by 1 m/s 10x on the trot,
you end up with 1 kg @ 10 m/s hence 50 J, for a mere 5 J of net input
work.  Yet it's also a universal axiom that must apply to all OU systems
per se..  so for instance if Rossi's tech is indeed OU, then there's a
divergent input FoR in effect - just because of this fundamental
relationship between the shared components of momentum and energy.  

Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Robin]

In reply to  Jürg Wyttenbach's message of Sat, 29 May 2021 13:39:50 +0200:
Hi,
[snip]
>This needs no drawing as it is basics of basics.
>
>Momenta are vector sums. You can take any body and a duplicate.
>
>You now can argue that any process of momentum conversion also 
>transports the momentum. For this you have to show that this also holds 
>for the final phonons.

Here you talk about "phonons".
>
>But now we face the loop hole of all classic theories including GR. 
>Photons that escape the system change the mass of the system in way that

Here you talk about "Photons". Are you talking about two different things 
deliberately, or is one of the two a typo?
 
>they transport more energy than the central field is expected to hold 
>what leads to an asymmetry.

If some of that energy was kinetic energy of a particle(s), it wouldn't have 
been necessary for the central field to
have held all of it, so I'm not sure what you are trying to say here.

>
>This is why momentum conservation only is valid for a closed system ( no 
>heat radiation).

I fail to see how your blanket statement actually proves anything.

When heat radiation does occur, of course the momentum of the photons should 
also be included.
(Though I suspect that it will be so tiny as to make little difference in most 
macro cases. However it definitely does
make a difference when looking at individual atoms, particularly for gamma-ray 
photons.)


> Also GR is only valid for a closed system but this is a 
>contradiction in the model already. So GR is no valid theory at all. 
>Except you declare the whole universe as a closed system...what ends up 
>in religion...
>
>J.W.
>
>
>On 29.05.2021 02:17, Robin wrote:
>> In reply to  Jürg Wyttenbach's message of Sat, 29 May 2021 00:34:55 +0200:
>> Hi,
>> [snip]
>>> The only conserved quantity is Energy. Momentum always decays into heat
>>> entropy, field energy.

They have different dimensions (momentum and energy are different properties). 
Momentum doesn't decay, it just gets
spread over multiple particles/entities (photons & phonons can also be treated 
as particles). (You see this spreading
out over multiple particles in the game of pool, during a "break".)

>>>
>>> You should not mix up naked mechanics with ideal actions with real
>>> mechanics in a real world.

The "laws" were derived from observations in the real world.

>>>
>>> Just look at two spinning masses with opposite rotation. The momentum
>>> vector sum is "0". 

I think you are referring to angular momentum here, not momentum.

>Now you can produce a current with one of the
>>> spinning masses and charge capacitor. After this you have a net momentum.

Here, it is not at all clear what you are proposing. That's why a drawing 
(circuit schematic?) is needed.
[snip]
Regards,

Robin van Spaandonk 

Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Jürg Wyttenbach]

This needs no drawing as it is basics of basics.

Momenta are vector sums. You can take any body and a duplicate.

You now can argue that any process of momentum conversion also 
transports the momentum. For this you have to show that this also holds 
for the final phonons.


But now we face the loop hole of all classic theories including GR. 
Photons that escape the system change the mass of the system in way that 
they transport more energy than the central field is expected to hold 
what leads to an asymmetry.


This is why momentum conservation only is valid for a closed system ( no 
heat radiation). Also GR is only valid for a closed system but this is a 
contradiction in the model already. So GR is no valid theory at all. 
Except you declare the whole universe as a closed system...what ends up 
in religion...


J.W.


On 29.05.2021 02:17, Robin wrote:

In reply to  Jürg Wyttenbach's message of Sat, 29 May 2021 00:34:55 +0200:
Hi,
[snip]

The only conserved quantity is Energy. Momentum always decays into heat
entropy, field energy.

You should not mix up naked mechanics with ideal actions with real
mechanics in a real world.

Just look at two spinning masses with opposite rotation. The momentum
vector sum is "0". Now you can produce a current with one of the
spinning masses and charge capacitor. After this you have a net momentum.

Where? Relative to what?

Please draw a picture.
Regards,

Robin van Spaandonk 


--
Jürg Wyttenbach
Bifangstr. 22
8910 Affoltern am Albis

+41 44 760 14 18
+41 79 246 36 06

Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Robin]

In reply to  Jürg Wyttenbach's message of Sat, 29 May 2021 00:34:55 +0200:
Hi,
[snip]
>The only conserved quantity is Energy. Momentum always decays into heat 
>entropy, field energy.
>
>You should not mix up naked mechanics with ideal actions with real 
>mechanics in a real world.
>
>Just look at two spinning masses with opposite rotation. The momentum 
>vector sum is "0". Now you can produce a current with one of the 
>spinning masses and charge capacitor. After this you have a net momentum.

Where? Relative to what?

Please draw a picture.
Regards,

Robin van Spaandonk 

Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Jürg Wyttenbach]

The only conserved quantity is Energy. Momentum always decays into heat 
entropy, field energy.


You should not mix up naked mechanics with ideal actions with real 
mechanics in a real world.


Just look at two spinning masses with opposite rotation. The momentum 
vector sum is "0". Now you can produce a current with one of the 
spinning masses and charge capacitor. After this you have a net momentum.


J.W.

On 28.05.2021 22:15, Frank Znidarsic wrote:
Momentum is always conserved.  As inertial mass is destroyed the 
object goes faster to conserve momentum.  It analogous to an 
inductor.  When its inductance is reduced by removing the solenoid the 
current increases.



As you wrote below, do you mean that momentum can disappear?
Or that momentum can be 'created' from other fields storing a
potential energy?
Does this allow a Z-wave, per se, to become an inertial
transformer?  In principle.
Thanks,
DonEM




-Original Message-
From: Chris Zell 
To: don86...@gmail.com ; vortex-l@eskimo.com 


Sent: Fri, May 28, 2021 9:59 am
Subject: RE: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

There was a French physicist ( Vialle?) who built a balance beam with 
a heavy rotor.  Accelerate the rotor and that end of the beam goes up 
as lighter. Deaccelerate and it goes down as heavier.  Perhaps this 
agrees with Kosyrev experiments long ago.

*From:* Don 
*Sent:* Friday, May 28, 2021 8:28 AM
*To:* Vortex People 
*Subject:* Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month
Hi Frank,
As you wrote below, do you mean that momentum can disappear?
Or that momentum can be 'created' from other fields storing a 
potential energy?
Does this allow a Z-wave, per se, to become an inertial transformer?  
In principle.

Thanks,
DonEM
On 5/27/2021 8:34 AM, Frank Znidarsic wrote:

I think something that many are missing in this analysis it that
inertial mass is not a conserved property of the universe.

*CAUTION:*This message was sent from outside the Nexstar organization. 
Please do not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the 
sender.


--
Jürg Wyttenbach
Bifangstr. 22
8910 Affoltern am Albis

+41 44 760 14 18
+41 79 246 36 06

Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Frank Znidarsic]

Momentum is always conserved.  As inertial mass is destroyed the object goes 
faster to conserve momentum.  It analogous to an inductor.  When its inductance 
is reduced by removing the solenoid the current increases.


As you wrote below, do you mean that momentum can disappear?  Or that momentum 
can be 'created' from other fields storing a potential energy? Does this allow 
a Z-wave, per se, to become an inertial transformer?  In principle.    Thanks, 
DonEM



-Original Message-
From: Chris Zell 
To: don86...@gmail.com ; vortex-l@eskimo.com 

Sent: Fri, May 28, 2021 9:59 am
Subject: RE: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

#yiv1898218545 #yiv1898218545 -- _filtered {} _filtered {}#yiv1898218545 
#yiv1898218545 p.yiv1898218545MsoNormal, #yiv1898218545 
li.yiv1898218545MsoNormal, #yiv1898218545 div.yiv1898218545MsoNormal 
{margin:0in;font-size:11.0pt;font-family:sans-serif;}#yiv1898218545 
span.yiv1898218545EmailStyle19 
{font-family:sans-serif;color:windowtext;}#yiv1898218545 
.yiv1898218545MsoChpDefault {font-size:10.0pt;} _filtered {}#yiv1898218545 
div.yiv1898218545WordSection1 {}#yiv1898218545 There was a French physicist ( 
Vialle?) who built a balance beam with a heavy rotor.  Accelerate the rotor and 
that end of the beam goes up as lighter.  Deaccelerate and it goes down as 
heavier.  Perhaps this agrees with Kosyrev experiments long ago.    From: Don 
 
Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 8:28 AM
To: Vortex People 
Subject: Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month    Hi Frank,    As you 
wrote below, do you mean that momentum can disappear?  Or that momentum can be 
'created' from other fields storing a potential energy? Does this allow a 
Z-wave, per se, to become an inertial transformer?  In principle.    Thanks, 
DonEM    On 5/27/2021 8:34 AM, Frank Znidarsic wrote: 
I think something that many are missing in this analysis it that inertial mass 
is not a conserved property of the universe. 
  CAUTION: This message was sent from outside the Nexstar organization. Please 
do not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender. 

RE: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month --> off list

[Chris Zell]

I’m afraid I truly don’t understand your ideas. I have read about Wallace but 
the tolerances and speeds look way beyond what I can build.

My ideas try to exploit simple empiricism.

First, investigate all anomalies and crazy inventions.

Discard the 99.9% that are crap.

Build and iterate the remaining .01% that actually is something.

Save the world single handedly thereby.

I have a working hypothesis to support this.  The stock market is the most 
analyzed to death field in our culture – yet, strangely, anomalies pop up in 
which profits get made because simple facts get lost in the shuffle.

Thus, I nearly doubled my money on a stock called Continental Homes years ago.  
Afterward, one pundit asked, “why didn’t somebody see this?” ( as to how nobody 
saw they were almost ‘printing money’ in profits)  I did.  I think Wall Street 
was misled because housing stocks were not popular, the company was obscure and 
their P/E ratio of less than 4 made people think they were in distress, rather 
than rolling in cash.

BUT   !!! if such may apply to vital money making, could small blind spots 
exist in science – that might be exploited?  I suspect so.  It’s all within the 
context of human reasoning and attention.

And what gets said automatically about centrifugal force?  “Oh, it’s just a 
pseudo-force”.

Sounds dismissive to me.  Worth looking at.


CAUTION: This message was sent from outside the Nexstar organization. Please do 
not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender.


CAUTION: This message was sent from outside the Nexstar organization. Please do 
not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender.

RE: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Chris Zell]

There was a French physicist ( Vialle?) who built a balance beam with a heavy 
rotor.  Accelerate the rotor and that end of the beam goes up as lighter.  
Deaccelerate and it goes down as heavier.  Perhaps this agrees with Kosyrev 
experiments long ago.

From: Don 
Sent: Friday, May 28, 2021 8:28 AM
To: Vortex People 
Subject: Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month


Hi Frank,



As you wrote below, do you mean that momentum can disappear?

Or that momentum can be 'created' from other fields storing a potential energy?

Does this allow a Z-wave, per se, to become an inertial transformer?  In 
principle.



Thanks,

DonEM


On 5/27/2021 8:34 AM, Frank Znidarsic wrote:
I think something that many are missing in this analysis it that inertial mass 
is not a conserved property of the universe.


CAUTION: This message was sent from outside the Nexstar organization. Please do 
not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender.

Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Don]

Hi Frank,


As you wrote below, do you mean that momentum can disappear?

Or that momentum can be 'created' from other fields storing a potential 
energy?


Does this allow a Z-wave, per se, to become an inertial transformer?  In 
principle.



Thanks,

DonEM


On 5/27/2021 8:34 AM, Frank Znidarsic wrote:
I think something that many are missing in this analysis it that 
inertial mass is not a conserved property of the universe.

RE: EXTERNAL: Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Roarty, Francis X]

On 5/24/ Jones Beene said “there is no valid reason to deny that what we may 
denote s a "UFO" event is in fact both real but also completely non-physical in 
our 3-space"
I agree and would include Lorentzian navigation under that moniker since it 
dispels arguments over impossible speeds, changes in vector, lack of sonic 
booms and spotty radar returns. It also would align with methods like Navy 
engineer Paris proposed in his patents, the lethal G forces and seemingly 
impossible displacement of tic tacs are actually indications of Lorentzian 
effect but not based on near C velocity – a space craft with a field that 
shields it from normal spacetime can experience time faster than we on a 
relatively stationary planet experience it, like we perceive the near C paradox 
twin as being in stasis so would an observer inside one of these Paris fields 
see his own twin on earth as in stasis. The difference is that the Paris field 
doesn’t have to fight for a significant trig portion of C but has the much 
easier task of resisting the flow of VP thru a small enclosure of 3 space, and 
navigation could be as simple as shaping that resistance to VP flow like a sail 
– always forward on time axis but perpendicular to 3 space.

From: Jones Beene 
Sent: Monday, May 24, 2021 9:14 AM
To: vortex-l 
Subject: EXTERNAL: Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a 
month

Coincidentally - this turned up in the morning's news feed...

https://getpocket.com/explore/item/when-lab-experiments-carry-theological-implications

Looking beyond so-called 'common sense' and/or 'scientific proof' - in the 
broader debate over the reality of ET phenomena - there is no valid reason to 
deny that what we may denote s a "UFO" event is in fact both real but also 
completely non-physical in our 3-space ... which echoes an earlier observation 
in this thread.

RE: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Chris Zell]

Yes, this definitely

This is discussed in Millennial Hospitality.  It claims their craft uses an 
internal surrounding of fiber optics in which gyroscopic precession takes 
place.  I think there is also a claim that the US military provided fiber of 
extreme length to help them repair a damaged craft.

From: Frank Znidarsic 
Sent: Thursday, May 27, 2021 10:35 AM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

I think something that many are missing in this analysis it that inertial mass 
is not a conserved property of the universe.


CAUTION: This message was sent from outside the Nexstar organization. Please do 
not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender.

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Don]

Dear Vortex People,


Thank you for sharing!   Zoom zoom!

Tweak my psycho-glandular index!  Make me leak personal thoughts!  I 
love the topic of alien mind assisting humanity as a finger of sentient 
universal intelligence.


--floating away--

Perhaps the universe is more-way-very-far advanced than human 
comprehension at our level of nascent intelligence, latent as an 
accessible Akashic record, per se, of everything harmonic ever realized 
by the universe of mind.  That is to say, our inner mind is based on 
cosmic goose sense.


Perhaps the advanced-index of the human perceptive envelop is little 
more than a mud-worm's reckoning in comparison to a universe that is 
intelligent enough to produce the error-checking machinery at the 
molecular-level of a biological agency of genetic code that persists as 
a specie --human, animal, virus; in spite of entropy.  Intelligent 
enough to flood a planet with every conceivable, and inconceivable, 
genetic coding that persists indefinitely within a world of chaos at all 
levels.  Intelligent enough for this place to be here.  Float with me.


Leap with me.  Perhaps 'mind' is the technology of a sentient universe 
with a memory.  Mind is then defined as a functioning image of the 
cross-time dynamics of universal sentience --in this discussion.   Your 
mind is my definition of mind to you.  We are sentience of mind with a 
lot of abstraction ability and time-line event-memory.



To offer one explanation from an primitive viewpoint of apparent ET 
encounters:  (in all manor of mixed metaphor) <-- and as touched upon 
also by other Vortex People...


Perhaps the intelligence of the universe manifests an agency-of-mind 
locally within this material universe at the will and purpose of the 
universe.


Perhaps 'ET-s' (etc.) are manifestations of the universal mind; enacting 
events that were otherwise unobtainable to the will of the universe save 
through the intervention of local minds-in-a-material-body (or sentient 
space craft, or light ship, or wheel in a wheel, or intelligent ball 
lightning).  Local manifestation of universal mind.  Personality; a 
divine expression in timing-space. 'Made in His image' per some humans.  
We are produced within the time-line to tune-in THE image, per some 
hybrid ways of thinking.  We are nature's hand mirror.


So, perhaps we really are the universe, as flower-children told us 
decades back.  We may really be a nexus of universal mind, as an 
experience of the universe within itself, while 'we,' proper, are 
exactly each a unique experience of the mind of THE universe. All of 
us.  Uniquely.



The human brain ...

If Sir Roger Penrose, Ph.D (knighted mathematician) is correct in 
asserting that 'mind' is not a product of 'brain,' but a brain is a 
transceiver for mind that is somewhere else, then entertain this twist...


Are we all then bio-aetheric tuners into the same 'mind of the 
galaxy?'   Note: universal mind is here termed mind of the local 
galaxy.  That's maybe human of me.


"Not all stars are alive." --the first prepared statement of a 
self-claimed remote viewer having claimed assistance to human-alien 
cooperatives as a trans-agency interpreter (An ambassador for 
military-humans to the orbs.)  Post-coma, nearing-death disclosure.  
June, 2013, day one.


Are we all neurologically-tuned into the same galactic mind that thrums 
entropy-defeating-future-sense upon the material universe until 'life' 
evolves to a level to support a hosting environment of the universal mind?


Are the gear-works of the universe spinning the hands of time to produce 
the ultimate biological host of universal mind?


--

Engineering challenge:  Locate the superluminal signal of the universal 
mind, and amplify this still, small voice that our neuro-quantum biology 
communicates socially to be the creator god <-- so that us biologics 
can  better perceive what the hell is going on.



DonEM

2021.05.26

   p.hybrid-speak.s

   Just say "No!" to cognitive dissonance.  Stop thinking that shifts
   the psychosomatic index into darker places of mind.  To stop thought
   listen.

   Be the universal harmonic-mind-coupling. Perceive yourself within
   your host mind/body.  And harmonize with this source.  Speak aloud
   your urgent whisper within. The angels (ET-s, intelligent orbs,
   visitations, knowings) will hear the amplification of intent and
   respond within the time-line in proportion of your passion.  Then,
   in concert with these same
   nexi-of-reckoning-against-sentience-of-knowing, life begins to make
   sense in a magnitude of context that bespeaks divinity lurks the
   shadow of mankind.  Harmony deepens.  Joy bubbles through happiness.

   Fan a spark of divinity to create a light of mind. Shine for your
   gene pool.

   Enjoy life and pass without regret by continuity of action through
   waking days.

   Then the engineering challenge of genetic fulfillment is anticipated
   to occur when the universe moves within 

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Don]

Dear Vortex People,


Thank you for sharing!   Zoom zoom!

Tweak my psycho-glandular index!  Make me leak personal thoughts!  I 
love the topic of alien mind assisting humanity as a finger of sentient 
universal intelligence.


--floating away--

Perhaps the universe is more-way-very-far advanced than human 
comprehension at our level of nascent intelligence, latent as an 
accessible Akashic record, per se, of everything harmonic ever realized 
by the universe of mind.  That is to say, our inner mind is based on 
cosmic goose sense.


Perhaps the advanced-index of the human perceptive envelop is little 
more than a mud-worm's reckoning in comparison to a universe that is 
intelligent enough to produce the error-checking machinery at the 
molecular-level of a biological agency of genetic code that persists as 
a specie --human, animal, virus; in spite of entropy.  Intelligent 
enough to flood a planet with every conceivable, and inconceivable, 
genetic coding that persists indefinitely within a world of chaos at all 
levels.  Intelligent enough for this place to be here.  Float with me.


Leap with me.  Perhaps 'mind' is the technology of a sentient universe 
with a memory.  Mind is then defined as a functioning image of the 
cross-time dynamics of universal sentience --in this discussion.   Your 
mind is my definition of mind to you.  We are sentience of mind with a 
lot of abstraction ability and time-line event-memory.



To offer one explanation from an primitive viewpoint of apparent ET 
encounters:  (in all manor of mixed metaphor) <-- and as touched upon 
also by other Vortex People...


Perhaps the intelligence of the universe manifests an agency-of-mind 
locally within this material universe at the will and purpose of the 
universe.


Perhaps 'ET-s' (etc.) are manifestations of the universal mind; enacting 
events that were otherwise unobtainable to the will of the universe save 
through the intervention of local minds-in-a-material-body (or sentient 
space craft, or light ship, or wheel in a wheel, or intelligent ball 
lightning).  Local manifestation of universal mind.  Personality; a 
divine expression in timing-space. 'Made in His image' per some humans.  
We are produced within the time-line to tune-in THE image, per some 
hybrid ways of thinking.  We are nature's hand mirror.


So, perhaps we really are the universe, as flower-children told us 
decades back.  We may really be a nexus of universal mind, as an 
experience of the universe within itself, while 'we,' proper, are 
exactly each a unique experience of the mind of THE universe. All of 
us.  Uniquely.



The human brain ...

If Sir Roger Penrose, Ph.D (knighted mathematician) is correct in 
asserting that 'mind' is not a product of 'brain,' but a brain is a 
transceiver for mind that is somewhere else, then entertain this twist...


Are we all then bio-aetheric tuners into the same 'mind of the 
galaxy?'   Note: universal mind is here termed mind of the local 
galaxy.  That's maybe human of me.


"Not all stars are alive." --the first prepared statement of a 
self-claimed remote viewer having claimed assistance to human-alien 
cooperatives as a trans-agency interpreter (An ambassador for 
military-humans to the orbs.)  Post-coma, nearing-death disclosure.  
June, 2013, day one.


Are we all neurologically-tuned into the same galactic mind that thrums 
entropy-defeating-future-sense upon the material universe until 'life' 
evolves to a level to support a hosting environment of the universal mind?


Are the gear-works of the universe spinning the hands of time to produce 
the ultimate biological host of universal mind?


--

Engineering challenge:  Locate the superluminal signal of the universal 
mind, and amplify this still, small voice that our neuro-quantum biology 
communicates socially to be the creator god <-- so that us biologics 
can  better perceive what the hell is going on.



DonEM

2021.05.26

   p.hybrid-speak.s

   Just say "No!" to cognitive dissonance.  Stop thinking that shifts
   the psychosomatic index into darker places of mind.  To stop thought
   listen.

   Be the universal harmonic-mind-coupling. Perceive yourself within
   your host mind/body.  And harmonize with this source.  Speak aloud
   your urgent whisper within. The angels (ET-s, intelligent orbs,
   visitations, knowings) will hear the amplification of intent and
   respond within the time-line in proportion of your passion.  Then,
   in concert with these same
   nexi-of-reckoning-against-sentience-of-knowing, life begins to make
   sense in a magnitude of context that bespeaks divinity lurks the
   shadow of mankind.  Harmony deepens.  Joy bubbles through happiness.

   Fan a spark of divinity to create a light of mind. Shine for your
   gene pool.

   Enjoy life and pass without regret by continuity of action through
   waking days.

   Then the engineering challenge of genetic fulfillment is anticipated
   to occur when the universe moves within 

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Terry Blanton]

On Mon, May 24, 2021 at 1:21 PM ROGER ANDERTON 
wrote:

> Well, aliens supposedly refer to people as containers for souls
>

Ah, yes.  That reminds me of *Passport to Magonia*, probably Jacques
Vallee's best work.

https://www.reiters.com/book/9780987422484

RE: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[ROGER ANDERTON]

Well, aliens supposedly refer to people as containers for souls


Robert Lazar mentioned a book that contained the history of earth and 
that it said that humans were referred to as ..containers for souls" and 
that souls could be traded in something like a barter system.

The aliens are doing it all the time.
They're trading in souls?
Yes. They were shuffling us around like we were cattle to them.
http://www.hiddenmysteries.org/themagazine/vol6/orion3.shtml

which makes them demonic-> because supposedly Devil trades in souls-> 
ask the Devil for what you want in exchnage for selling your soul etc.







-- Original Message --
From: "Chris Zell" 
To: "vortex-l@eskimo.com" 
Sent: Monday, 24 May, 21 At 17:36
Subject: RE: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month




As for Aliens getting marooned here, I wonder about a similar idea.

Both “Communion” and Linda Howe claim Aliens have something to do with 
an afterlife.  I wonder if we are undesirable as to reincarnation 
elsewhere so they set things up to keep us here.  Not on my planet, 
Monkey-Boy.





CAUTION: This message was sent from outside the Nexstar organization. 
Please do not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the 
sender.

RE: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Chris Zell]

As for Aliens getting marooned here, I wonder about a similar idea.

Both "Communion" and Linda Howe claim Aliens have something to do with an 
afterlife.  I wonder if we are undesirable as to reincarnation elsewhere so 
they set things up to keep us here.  Not on my planet, Monkey-Boy.


CAUTION: This message was sent from outside the Nexstar organization. Please do 
not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender.

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[H LV]

"So what are they?" From Fran Blanche
 Part 1
https://youtu.be/a6tDHZj5q5Q
Part 2
https://youtu.be/FTermh1w_0A

Harry

On Mon., May 24, 2021, 10:06 a.m. H LV,  wrote:

> Perhaps Earth is used as the interstellar equivalent of the island of
> St Helena for undesirable aliens.
>
> Or maybe aliens are marooned here by accident because they ventured
> too close to some sort of cosmic vortex which hurls them to our solar
> system.
>
> Harry
>
> On Mon, May 24, 2021 at 9:47 AM Chris Zell  wrote:
> >
> > A few thoughts about UFO’s:
> >
> >
> >
> > If I was an Alien, I’d think twice about eating humans or anything else
> on this planet.  Pollution, toxic metals, plastic residue and God knows
> what else is in the meat.  Like eating seafood with potential mercury in
> it.   Don’t touch that human, you don’t know where he’s been.
> >
> >
> >
> > There have been claims after Roswell that an Alien said they use bodies
> as ‘dolls’ or remote units – so they can experience things but stay safe –
> wherever home is.
> >
> >
> >
> > There have been claims that Earth is unique in its wild abundance of
> life and different species. Steven Greer talked about some ET’s picking
> wild flowers.  The Tall Whites seem to use Earth as a way station or
> interesting place to visit –  with one female visiting here since Monroe
> was President.
> >
> >
> >
> > I also speculate that a telepathic or collective consciousness might be
> critical in these ET’s because otherwise, they might blow themselves up as
> that which humans are headed towards.  If they really can immobilize nukes,
> God speed.  Clinton once said, “I feel your pain” but that needs to be more
> than metaphorical.
> >
> >
> >
> > There is recent speculation that UFO disclosure is being done to give
> the Military Industrial Complex a new expensive enemy to fight – in
> building space weapons.  I hope it’s because of the Chinese putting
> pressure on the Pentagon in a disclosure competition.
> >
> >
> >
> > CAUTION: This message was sent from outside the Nexstar organization.
> Please do not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the
> sender.
>

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[H LV]

Perhaps Earth is used as the interstellar equivalent of the island of
St Helena for undesirable aliens.

Or maybe aliens are marooned here by accident because they ventured
too close to some sort of cosmic vortex which hurls them to our solar
system.

Harry

On Mon, May 24, 2021 at 9:47 AM Chris Zell  wrote:
>
> A few thoughts about UFO’s:
>
>
>
> If I was an Alien, I’d think twice about eating humans or anything else on 
> this planet.  Pollution, toxic metals, plastic residue and God knows what 
> else is in the meat.  Like eating seafood with potential mercury in it.   
> Don’t touch that human, you don’t know where he’s been.
>
>
>
> There have been claims after Roswell that an Alien said they use bodies as 
> ‘dolls’ or remote units – so they can experience things but stay safe – 
> wherever home is.
>
>
>
> There have been claims that Earth is unique in its wild abundance of life and 
> different species. Steven Greer talked about some ET’s picking wild flowers.  
> The Tall Whites seem to use Earth as a way station or interesting place to 
> visit –  with one female visiting here since Monroe was President.
>
>
>
> I also speculate that a telepathic or collective consciousness might be 
> critical in these ET’s because otherwise, they might blow themselves up as 
> that which humans are headed towards.  If they really can immobilize nukes, 
> God speed.  Clinton once said, “I feel your pain” but that needs to be more 
> than metaphorical.
>
>
>
> There is recent speculation that UFO disclosure is being done to give the 
> Military Industrial Complex a new expensive enemy to fight – in building 
> space weapons.  I hope it’s because of the Chinese putting pressure on the 
> Pentagon in a disclosure competition.
>
>
>
> CAUTION: This message was sent from outside the Nexstar organization. Please 
> do not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender.

RE: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Chris Zell]

A few thoughts about UFO’s:

If I was an Alien, I’d think twice about eating humans or anything else on this 
planet.  Pollution, toxic metals, plastic residue and God knows what else is in 
the meat.  Like eating seafood with potential mercury in it.   Don’t touch that 
human, you don’t know where he’s been.

There have been claims after Roswell that an Alien said they use bodies as 
‘dolls’ or remote units – so they can experience things but stay safe – 
wherever home is.

There have been claims that Earth is unique in its wild abundance of life and 
different species. Steven Greer talked about some ET’s picking wild flowers.  
The Tall Whites seem to use Earth as a way station or interesting place to 
visit –  with one female visiting here since Monroe was President.

I also speculate that a telepathic or collective consciousness might be 
critical in these ET’s because otherwise, they might blow themselves up as that 
which humans are headed towards.  If they really can immobilize nukes, God 
speed.  Clinton once said, “I feel your pain” but that needs to be more than 
metaphorical.

There is recent speculation that UFO disclosure is being done to give the 
Military Industrial Complex a new expensive enemy to fight – in building space 
weapons.  I hope it’s because of the Chinese putting pressure on the Pentagon 
in a disclosure competition.


CAUTION: This message was sent from outside the Nexstar organization. Please do 
not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender.

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Jones Beene]

Coincidentally - this turned up in the morning's news feed...

https://getpocket.com/explore/item/when-lab-experiments-carry-theological-implications

Looking beyond so-called 'common sense' and/or 'scientific proof' - in the 
broader debate over the reality of ET phenomena - there is no valid reason to 
deny that what we may denote s a "UFO" event is in fact both real but also 
completely non-physical in our 3-space ... which echoes an earlier observation 
in this thread.

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Axil Axil]

I suggest to the US defense department that they assume a more proactive
posture to analyze the nature of the UFO by probing the physical nature of
the UFOs that are intruding into US restricted airspace as follows:


I suggest that one of the most intelligent and capable Super Hornet
missiles: the AIM-120 AMRAAM air-to-air missile undergoes warhead
replacement with a custom UFO sensor characterization package to probe the
internal structure of the UFO. These sensors might include magnetic field
characterization, UFO real time flight data location recording, time
dilation detection, field energy power level measurement, inertial movement
measurement and recording, and sundry environmental measurements and
recording which might include temperature, pressure, electric polarization,
and the like.


The Super Hornet warhead sensor replacement package might include package
recovery signaling similar to a black box air crash recorder.


The AIM-120 AMRAAM air-to-air missile already has the necessary targeting,
pursuit and penetration capabilities necessary to localize the UFO,
intercept it and proceed to penetrate the UFO's interior so that data can
be recorded and saved for later analysis.


By following an after action sensor package signaling beacon, the Navy can
locate and retrieve the sensor package either on land or under the ocean
anywhere on earth.



On Sun, May 23, 2021 at 6:47 PM Robin 
wrote:

> In reply to  Axil Axil's message of Sun, 23 May 2021 15:36:43 -0400:
> Hi,
>
> Perhaps the piezoelectric effect caused by pressure on the geological
> strata creates localized high voltages that ionize
> the air.
>
>
> >What if UFOs are actually Weakly interacting massive particles (WIMP).
> >Maybe the common conception of what a particle can be is too limited at
> >least in terms of size. What if UFOs are the appearance of dark matter on
> >earth. I have a number of reasons in support of this conjecture.
> >
> >A case in point, the The Hessdalen lights.
> >
> >The Hessdalen lights are unexplained lights observed in a
> 12-kilometre-long
> >(7.5 mi) stretch of the Hessdalen valley in rural central Norway.
> >
> >The bus-sized Hessdalen lights are of unknown origin. They appear both by
> >day and by night, and seem to float through and above the valley. They are
> >usually bright white, yellow or red and can appear above and below the
> >horizon. The duration of the phenomenon may be a few seconds to well over
> >an hour. Sometimes the lights move with enormous speed; at other times
> they
> >seem to sway slowly back and forth. On yet other occasions, they hover in
> >mid?air.Unusual lights have been reported in the region since at least the
> >1930s. High activity occurred between December 1981 and mid-1984, during
> >which the lights were being observed 15–20 times per week, attracting many
> >overnight tourists who arrived in for a sighting. As of 2010, the number
> of
> >observations has dwindled, with only 10 to 20 sightings made yearly.
> >
> >Many attempts at trying to get to the bottom of these lights have centered
> >on the local geology to explain their casation. The one that I like the
> >best is the explanation that attributes the phenomenon to an incompletely
> >understood reaction involving hydrogen, oxygen and sodium, which occurs in
> >Hessdalen because of the large deposits of scandium there. This
> explanation
> >seems to support the catalytic formation of a metallic hydrogen based
> >polariton condensate. But how can  this condensate grow so large, the size
> >of a bus. A clue comes from research observations about how the Hessdalen
> >lights are initiated:
> >
> >"The light phenomenon is always preceded by very short-lasting (on the
> >order of a fraction of second) flashes of light which appear everywhere in
> >the valley and which emit power ranging from 10 to 300 W. Sometimes such
> >flashes are recorded at a very short distance (up to 5 m) from the
> >observer."
> >
> >This indicates that the large bus-sized condensate waveform condenses
> from
> >the entanglement of many smaller sub clusters. There is no
> >alien civilization origin story involved here.
> >
> >There are many such areas around the world that have seen these lights
> >produced on a regular basis including the Marfa lights in Texas.
> >
> >But there are other clues that can lend support to the assignation of
> WIMPs
> >status to UFO sightings.
> >
> >I have mentioned the polygon structure of the UFO which is a result of the
> >supersolid nature of polariton lattice formation.
> >
> >There is mention by Navy pilots to the roiling of the surface of the sea
> >that is occurring on the surface of the ocean directly under the ocean
> >hugging  UFO.
> >
> >I have seen this appear in cavitation based polariton condensation
> >formation where the anopole spin circulation induces massive vortex
> >formation behavior in water.
> >
> >Next, polariton condensation is a surface localized reaction where the
> >condensate is attracted 

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Robin]

In reply to  Axil Axil's message of Sun, 23 May 2021 15:36:43 -0400:
Hi,

Perhaps the piezoelectric effect caused by pressure on the geological strata 
creates localized high voltages that ionize
the air.


>What if UFOs are actually Weakly interacting massive particles (WIMP).
>Maybe the common conception of what a particle can be is too limited at
>least in terms of size. What if UFOs are the appearance of dark matter on
>earth. I have a number of reasons in support of this conjecture.
>
>A case in point, the The Hessdalen lights.
>
>The Hessdalen lights are unexplained lights observed in a 12-kilometre-long
>(7.5 mi) stretch of the Hessdalen valley in rural central Norway.
>
>The bus-sized Hessdalen lights are of unknown origin. They appear both by
>day and by night, and seem to float through and above the valley. They are
>usually bright white, yellow or red and can appear above and below the
>horizon. The duration of the phenomenon may be a few seconds to well over
>an hour. Sometimes the lights move with enormous speed; at other times they
>seem to sway slowly back and forth. On yet other occasions, they hover in
>mid?air.Unusual lights have been reported in the region since at least the
>1930s. High activity occurred between December 1981 and mid-1984, during
>which the lights were being observed 15–20 times per week, attracting many
>overnight tourists who arrived in for a sighting. As of 2010, the number of
>observations has dwindled, with only 10 to 20 sightings made yearly.
>
>Many attempts at trying to get to the bottom of these lights have centered
>on the local geology to explain their casation. The one that I like the
>best is the explanation that attributes the phenomenon to an incompletely
>understood reaction involving hydrogen, oxygen and sodium, which occurs in
>Hessdalen because of the large deposits of scandium there. This explanation
>seems to support the catalytic formation of a metallic hydrogen based
>polariton condensate. But how can  this condensate grow so large, the size
>of a bus. A clue comes from research observations about how the Hessdalen
>lights are initiated:
>
>"The light phenomenon is always preceded by very short-lasting (on the
>order of a fraction of second) flashes of light which appear everywhere in
>the valley and which emit power ranging from 10 to 300 W. Sometimes such
>flashes are recorded at a very short distance (up to 5 m) from the
>observer."
>
>This indicates that the large bus-sized condensate waveform condenses  from
>the entanglement of many smaller sub clusters. There is no
>alien civilization origin story involved here.
>
>There are many such areas around the world that have seen these lights
>produced on a regular basis including the Marfa lights in Texas.
>
>But there are other clues that can lend support to the assignation of WIMPs
>status to UFO sightings.
>
>I have mentioned the polygon structure of the UFO which is a result of the
>supersolid nature of polariton lattice formation.
>
>There is mention by Navy pilots to the roiling of the surface of the sea
>that is occurring on the surface of the ocean directly under the ocean
>hugging  UFO.
>
>I have seen this appear in cavitation based polariton condensation
>formation where the anopole spin circulation induces massive vortex
>formation behavior in water.
>
>Next, polariton condensation is a surface localized reaction where the
>condensate is attracted to metal surfaces. This could be why the UFOs
>attempt to approach ships and jet aircraft.
>
>If the UFO based condensate does ever contact the surface of a ship or
>plane, that surface may dematerialize. That would set the defence
>department into an alien attack based panic. These bus sized WIMPs could be
>dangerous and not to be toyed with.
>
>As far as an application of UFO WIMP technology goes... if an aircraft
>could be encased in a dark matter field, the aircraft might  demonstrate
>the performance behavior that the UFOs are currently showing the US Navy.
>This includes MOND based antigravity, no control surfaces, no restraint by
>air resistance,  zero inertial maneuvering,  instant acceleration,
>deceleration, and change of direction, and point to point quantum
>teleportation.
>
>The WIMP hunters now searching in those multi million dollar holes in the
>ground might be better served to get their eyes directed toward the skys.
>
>When Ed Witten set down his mathematical description of a
>tachyon condensate, no one would ever imagine that these equations could
>ever actually be realized.
[snip]
Regards,

Robin van Spaandonk 

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Axil Axil]

What if UFOs are actually Weakly interacting massive particles (WIMP).
Maybe the common conception of what a particle can be is too limited at
least in terms of size. What if UFOs are the appearance of dark matter on
earth. I have a number of reasons in support of this conjecture.

A case in point, the The Hessdalen lights.

The Hessdalen lights are unexplained lights observed in a 12-kilometre-long
(7.5 mi) stretch of the Hessdalen valley in rural central Norway.

The bus-sized Hessdalen lights are of unknown origin. They appear both by
day and by night, and seem to float through and above the valley. They are
usually bright white, yellow or red and can appear above and below the
horizon. The duration of the phenomenon may be a few seconds to well over
an hour. Sometimes the lights move with enormous speed; at other times they
seem to sway slowly back and forth. On yet other occasions, they hover in
mid‑air.Unusual lights have been reported in the region since at least the
1930s. High activity occurred between December 1981 and mid-1984, during
which the lights were being observed 15–20 times per week, attracting many
overnight tourists who arrived in for a sighting. As of 2010, the number of
observations has dwindled, with only 10 to 20 sightings made yearly.

Many attempts at trying to get to the bottom of these lights have centered
on the local geology to explain their casation. The one that I like the
best is the explanation that attributes the phenomenon to an incompletely
understood reaction involving hydrogen, oxygen and sodium, which occurs in
Hessdalen because of the large deposits of scandium there. This explanation
seems to support the catalytic formation of a metallic hydrogen based
polariton condensate. But how can  this condensate grow so large, the size
of a bus. A clue comes from research observations about how the Hessdalen
lights are initiated:

"The light phenomenon is always preceded by very short-lasting (on the
order of a fraction of second) flashes of light which appear everywhere in
the valley and which emit power ranging from 10 to 300 W. Sometimes such
flashes are recorded at a very short distance (up to 5 m) from the
observer."

This indicates that the large bus-sized condensate waveform condenses  from
the entanglement of many smaller sub clusters. There is no
alien civilization origin story involved here.

There are many such areas around the world that have seen these lights
produced on a regular basis including the Marfa lights in Texas.

But there are other clues that can lend support to the assignation of WIMPs
status to UFO sightings.

I have mentioned the polygon structure of the UFO which is a result of the
supersolid nature of polariton lattice formation.

There is mention by Navy pilots to the roiling of the surface of the sea
that is occurring on the surface of the ocean directly under the ocean
hugging  UFO.

I have seen this appear in cavitation based polariton condensation
formation where the anopole spin circulation induces massive vortex
formation behavior in water.

Next, polariton condensation is a surface localized reaction where the
condensate is attracted to metal surfaces. This could be why the UFOs
attempt to approach ships and jet aircraft.

If the UFO based condensate does ever contact the surface of a ship or
plane, that surface may dematerialize. That would set the defence
department into an alien attack based panic. These bus sized WIMPs could be
dangerous and not to be toyed with.

As far as an application of UFO WIMP technology goes... if an aircraft
could be encased in a dark matter field, the aircraft might  demonstrate
the performance behavior that the UFOs are currently showing the US Navy.
This includes MOND based antigravity, no control surfaces, no restraint by
air resistance,  zero inertial maneuvering,  instant acceleration,
deceleration, and change of direction, and point to point quantum
teleportation.

The WIMP hunters now searching in those multi million dollar holes in the
ground might be better served to get their eyes directed toward the skys.

When Ed Witten set down his mathematical description of a
tachyon condensate, no one would ever imagine that these equations could
ever actually be realized.


On Sat, May 22, 2021 at 10:12 PM Axil Axil  wrote:

> If UFOs are actually visitors from other civilizations, they must have a
> technology that is far more advanced than ours is. But don't be concerned,
> there are no other civilizations involved with UFOs... these fearful
> objects are but a dimly seen preview of a new epoch in science and
> technology that could be available to humankind if only we can embrace it
> without fear.
>
> The laws of nature in their full expanse are just now becoming visible.
> But even at this very early juncture, the specifications of this new
> technology are truly awesome. What is to come in the very near future is
> beyond the dreams of the most imaginative Sci Fi authors but new military
> sensors 

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Axil Axil]

If UFOs are actually visitors from other civilizations, they must have a
technology that is far more advanced than ours is. But don't be concerned,
there are no other civilizations involved with UFOs... these fearful
objects are but a dimly seen preview of a new epoch in science and
technology that could be available to humankind if only we can embrace it
without fear.

The laws of nature in their full expanse are just now becoming visible. But
even at this very early juncture, the specifications of this new technology
are truly awesome. What is to come in the very near future is beyond the
dreams of the most imaginative Sci Fi authors but new military sensors can
now preview the dance moves of these flying profits of the future.

The AN/APG-79, and other AESA radars like it on fighter aircraft, offer
a huge leap in capability in virtually every respect. This includes a
massive improvement in reliability as a steerable radar dish is no longer
needed with electronically scanned arrays.

Mechanically scanned arrays have to quickly sweep in all directions
physically and even under heavy G forces and buffeting, and they have to
survive crashing down on a carrier deck after missions over and over. So,
migrating to a system with few moving parts was a massive coup in terms of
reliability for Navy fighters. he AN/APG-79's resolution, range, speed of
scan, simultaneous tracking, and target discrimination abilities are
drastically improved over its predecessor. Even the ability to operate in
air-to-air and air-to-ground modes at the same time has been introduced. In
addition, advanced software and processing that interprets what the more
sensitive radar 'sees' provides a higher quality end product to Super
Hornet crews, resulting in dramatically improved situational awareness.

All this means that AESA equipped fighters can see farther, better
understand what was being detected, and have a hugely enhanced ability to
detect objects flying low over surface clutter. Even small or low
observable (stealthy), or slow-moving targets, or those that attempt
to hide in the 'doppler notch' of a threatening fighter's radar by flying
perpendicular to it, have a tougher time eluding detection and engagement
when facing opposition fighters packing AESA radar sets.

With all that being said, apparently, this same leap in sensor technology
also lifted the curtain, so to speak, when it came to detecting UFOs flying
near Navy fighters while on training missions.

The pilots began noticing the objects after their 1980s-era radar was
upgraded to a more advanced system. As one fighter jet after another got
the new radar, pilots began picking up the objects, but ignoring what they
thought were false radar tracks.

As with any advancement is scientific sensing, new discoveries
immediately follow.

Lt. Ryan Graves, an F/A-18 Super Hornet pilot who has been in the Navy for
a decade has come forward after talking to the Navy and Congress about the
events he and his squadron mates witnessed between 2014 and 2015.

This navy pilot and his wingman were flying in tandem about 100 feet apart
over the Atlantic east of Virginia Beach when something flew between them,
right past the cockpit. It looked to the pilot, Lieutenant Graves said,
like a sphere encasing a cube.

When I see these polygon shapes, I know what ballpark that the game is
being played in. These are the classic supersolid shapes. I see the marks
that these shapes impress in material corrosion all the time in
micrographs. Triangles, hexagons,  pyramids,  and  even saucer-shapes are
also seen.

There may be an instance of fear involved in the interpretation of this
new reality like a bushman seeing his picture on a smartphone for the
first time.  When a nanoscale object described in a math paper is just an
exercise in logic, but when that same object, now  the size of a bus, is
pacing your jet airliner at 30,000 feet, the culture shock is beyond most
of us and that is when  the fear sets in.

On Sat, May 22, 2021 at 8:09 PM Jed Rothwell  wrote:

> Michael Foster  wrote:
>
>
>> Everyone just assumes that these visitors must be from civilizations far
>> advanced from our own. That may or may not be true.
>>
>
> If they are actually visitors from other civilizations, they have to be
> far advanced. They cannot be from anywhere in the solar system. Our robot
> probes have now visited every planet and most large moons. There is no sign
> of intelligent life anywhere in the solar system. So if there are non-human
> visitors they must have crossed interstellar space. To do that, they have
> to be far advanced over us. We could not begin to do that, except -- as I
> noted -- with tiny spacecraft that cannot be controlled when they arrive.
>
>

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Michael Foster]

 
I can't blame anyone for staying away from the UFO "community". Real 
information is really difficult to weed out of the profusion of BS that 
pervades. There is so much fakery and pseudo-religion associated with what are 
probably real phenomena, that it is wise not to become involved.

But besides the "Pets or Meat?" question, there might be an alternative 
explanation for these visits. Given the wide variety of craft observed, 
saucers, triangles, tic-tacs, pyramids and so on, it appears that these are 
different groups. Everyone just assumes that these visitors must be from 
civilizations far advanced from our own. That may or may not be true.

My speculation is that it is possible that these visitors may have discovered 
reactionless propulsion, space warping methods and other physics unknown to us 
before all the things we consider to be the advanced technology we have now. 
Perhaps they simply evolved their science and technology along entirely 
different lines. Maybe they never had steam engines, winged aircraft, and 
complex digital electronics because they never needed them. They might just be 
a bunch of goofy guys briefly curious about what goes on with our strange 
species and all the overly complicated devices we make.

There are examples of this sort of thing in human history. My favorite example 
is the very advanced agricultural technology of the meso-Americans. The world 
benefits from their accomplishments today. These were civilizations that never 
invented the wheel, but yet created foods by the selective breeding of plants 
that were either inedible or poisonous. We eat potatoes, yams, sweet potatoes, 
tomatoes, and corn (maize), all brought into existence by civilizations 
isolated from Europe and Asia.

So who knows? I certainly don't.  

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Jed Rothwell]

Michael Foster  wrote:


> Everyone just assumes that these visitors must be from civilizations far
> advanced from our own. That may or may not be true.
>

If they are actually visitors from other civilizations, they have to be far
advanced. They cannot be from anywhere in the solar system. Our robot
probes have now visited every planet and most large moons. There is no sign
of intelligent life anywhere in the solar system. So if there are non-human
visitors they must have crossed interstellar space. To do that, they have
to be far advanced over us. We could not begin to do that, except -- as I
noted -- with tiny spacecraft that cannot be controlled when they arrive.

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Frank Znidarsic]

I sent my book to the people doing this study research at the Pentagon.  As 
usual I have heard noting.  Not even the the, It Was Interesting put down.



Frank

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[William Beaty]

On Thu, May 20, 2021 at 5:08 PM William Beaty  wrote:

  Me, I stay away from the UFO community.

Wise move.  Thanks, Bill.


Back in the day, my website was only for FE/OU, antigravity, CF.

I was constantly having to tell people, if you want UFOs, just freakin' go 
to the HUUUGE number of flying-saucer websites!  Sheesh.  But those groups 
never build hardware, or even START to perhaps consider any experiments. 
For them, actual science seems to be completely taboo.



 ( (  (   ((O))   )  ) ) 
William J. Beatyhttp://staff.washington.edu/wbeaty/
beaty, chem washington edu  Research Engineer
billb, amasci com   UW Chem Dept,  Bagley Hall RM74
x3-6195 Box 351700, Seattle, WA 98195-1700

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Jed Rothwell]

I wrote:


> I think there is no likelihood aliens would need help from us, and no
> likelihood they crashed or their equipment failed. A technology capable of
> crossing interstellar space with devices as large as this would be
> "indistinguishable from magic" (Clarke) and it would be hundreds or
> thousands of years ahead of anything we could understand -- or make. It
> would be so reliable there is no chance it would fail catastrophically.
>

Having said that, let me add that I have no earthly idea what might be
causing these UFO reports. I have no hypothesis. I think I can rule out
some hypotheses. It seems unlikely that a civilization can send
macroscopic, controlled vehicles across interstellar space, yet these
vehicles might crash on earth. I suppose I cannot rule it out, but it is
like suggesting that a modern desktop computer which performs 3 billion
operations per second might slow down and take 10 minutes to add 2 + 2 = 4.
Or that a pickax might shatter when you use it to make a hole in a
styrofoam block. Technology does not fail that drastically. Things are more
reliable than that.

I am not interested in UFOs because as far as I know, there is not enough
data to form a reasonable hypothesis. We'll just have to wait until we know
more, which may be never. I am not interested in questions with no
near-term potential answers. I don't care about the so-called Big Questions
such as "how did the universe begin?" Honestly, I am not much interested in
any question that is not likely to lead to making money soon, or making
life better, or fixing problems such as pollution, global warming, or cheap
access to outer space, or better food. I admit I am a philistine!

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Jed Rothwell]

Jones Beene  wrote:

In that case, the most likely thing ET would need to continue their mission
> is replacement of advanced chips and electronics. To get these parts,
> however, they might first need to intervene somehow in the normal process
> of R on earth by influencing progress and directing it in a certain way
> to meet their needs, not ours.
>

Every breakthrough in semiconductors was made by people without help from
extraterrestrials. The people who made these breakthroughs documented their
work very carefully, for patent purposes. The history has been preserved in
detail. There is no doubt the people came up with the ideas themselves.
There is no mystery or gaps in the development process. Individual
discoveries were not great leaps of imagination. They were not extremely
surprising or unthinkable, especially compared to cold fusion. If Shockly,
Brattain and Bardeen had not discovered transistors, someone else soon
would have. Arguably, Lilienfeld did discover transistors in 1925. The Bell
Labs patent lawyers thought he did, and they wrote the patent so as not to
infringe on his patent. It is not likely Lilienfeld ever demonstrated the
effect, and his device might not have worked, but it was similar to first
devices from Bell Labs.

I think there is no likelihood aliens would need help from us, and no
likelihood they crashed or their equipment failed. A technology capable of
crossing interstellar space with devices as large as this would be
"indistinguishable from magic" (Clarke) and it would be hundreds or
thousands of years ahead of anything we could understand -- or make. It
would be so reliable there is no chance it would fail catastrophically.

That is not to say we could not send probes to other stars. There are
already laser, solar wind and other proposed devices that might do that.
But the payload would be measured in grams. Hundreds would be sent, and it
would take ~30 years to reach the nearest stars.

http://spaceref.com/interstellar/relaying-swarms-of-low-mass-interstellar-probes.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breakthrough_Starshot

If these aliens wanted to make some equipment, they could do it themselves,
easily. They would have universal replicators. That is, machines that can
make anything -- another idea Clarke was one of the first to describe.
Don't leave Alpha Centauri without one! We are quickly developing such
tools. 3-D printers are the first generation. Primitive, of course, and
only capable of using one material. Far more advanced ones that can use any
element are likely to be available in a few hundred years. A thousand years
at most, I expect.

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Terry Blanton]

One of the more interesting possibilities is that the Visitors do not
travel in space but in time.  They could be humans from the future who have
manipulated their genome to attempt to eradicate the unwanted faults of
human nature.  But they have discovered that they also eliminated some of
the desirable human traits.  They are visiting their ancestors who existed
prior to the genetic changes to extract DNA to restore those desirable
traits.

RE: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Chris Zell]

What I wonder about is:

What could we possibly have that they would want, that they can’t freely 
provide for themselves?

And

How can they have any sort of unified command or enforcement of a Prime 
Directive since any one of them could reveal their existence in such an obvious 
fashion as to achieve full disclosure?
Think about a single Alien deciding “Disclosure be happenin’ today, bitches”.  
It doesn’t happen that way.


CAUTION: This message was sent from outside the Nexstar organization. Please do 
not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender.

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Jones Beene]

 Even for those of us seriously doubt (that any ET visitation has occurred in 
the past history of mankind) - we can nevertheless enjoy speculation about what 
exactly - such a visitation would look like, if or when it actually happened. 
This exercise has significant entertainment value, if nothing else.
Start with this question - "can ET spell "Poughkeepsie" ? ... and who cares if 
they can't.

Basically, the situation which would logically be the "ET default" - is that 
alien contact would be "one way" and  planned to be unobtrusive to all. Unless 
we dig much deeper and look along the fringes we find nothing. IOW we should 
never notice ET contact at all, especially in the form that Hollywood has 
suggested - but might find it, especially if things (for them) had NOT gone as 
planned. 

This reasoning is based on the logic and expectation of of what we earthlings 
will most likely do in the far future, when we are technologically capable to 
reach out to the stars. Logic should be the defining issue - not drama. 

Furthermore, that surely means that an expected need of any putative ET 
mission, having traversed hundreds of light years of space/time to get here - 
would logically be to refuel - right? Well this refueling process should be 
unobtrusive as well - especially if it consists of hydrogen or deuterium. Such 
a fuel deficit would be able to be met from one of the "gas giants" and 
earthing would be unaware. Maybe a little palladium, who knows?

However if contact with us has occurred - and this is a huge "if" - the 
situation could be that the ET recon mission would have suffered repairable 
damage in transit. 

In that case, the most likely thing ET would need to continue their mission is 
replacement of advanced chips and electronics. To get these parts, however, 
they might first need to intervene somehow in the normal process of R on 
earth by influencing progress and directing it in a certain way to meet their 
needs, not ours.

That would be one way to look at the rapid rise of quantum computing in recent 
years. In some ways, this progress in an arcane pursuit, with little market 
incentive, seems to have been "out of the normal context" of historical trends. 
Thank you IBM.

In short, if there was to be a bounty to be offered to "find ET" based on the 
logic of what they would need from us humans - my bet would be that the best 
place to look would be in the field of quantum computing and AI, and a good 
start would be either at IBM or (even more alarming from the US perspective) at 
the Chinese effort to advance quantum computing... or possibly at the 
interaction between the two.
"Food" for thought?

Jones

H LV wrote: Terry Blanton wrote:





ARE WE FOOD OR ARE WE PETS?


Food for their pets.
Harry  

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[H LV]

On Thu, May 20, 2021 at 5:54 PM Terry Blanton  wrote:

>
>>
> ARE WE FOOD OR ARE WE PETS?
>
>
Food for their pets.

Harry

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Frank Grimer]

They are taking the piss. :-)

On Thu, 20 May 2021 at 23:59, Robin 
wrote:

> In reply to  Terry Blanton's message of Thu, 20 May 2021 18:53:24 -0400:
> Hi Terry,
> [snip]
> >I hope you are right; however, my research tells me that they are taking
> >something from us.  And I really don't think they give a hoot about the
> >Prime Directive.
>
> What research, and what do you think they are taking?
>
> Regards,
>
> Robin van Spaandonk 
>
>

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[ROGER ANDERTON]

Probably Social Darwnists -> where think they can do whatever they like 
to inferior species


-- Original Message --
From: "Terry Blanton" 
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Thursday, 20 May, 21 At 23:53
Subject: Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month




On Thu, May 20, 2021 at 6:22 PM Robin  > wrote:

In reply to  Terry Blanton's message of Thu, 20 May 2021 17:54:44 -0400:
 Hi,
 [snip]
 >The one question that remains in
 >my mind is:
 >
 >ARE WE FOOD OR ARE WE PETS?

 They know we are intelligent, and we are not food. They guide us in 
our development somewhat, and occasionally lend a
 hand when needed, but are largely non-interventionist. A species (us) 
mostly has to discover things for themselves,

 otherwise the shock to their development can lead to catastrophe.

I hope you are right; however, my research tells me that they are taking 
something from us.  And I really don't think they give a hoot about the 
Prime Directive.

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Robin]

In reply to  Terry Blanton's message of Thu, 20 May 2021 18:53:24 -0400:
Hi Terry,
[snip]
>I hope you are right; however, my research tells me that they are taking
>something from us.  And I really don't think they give a hoot about the
>Prime Directive.

What research, and what do you think they are taking?

Regards,

Robin van Spaandonk 

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Terry Blanton]

On Thu, May 20, 2021 at 6:22 PM Robin 
wrote:

> In reply to  Terry Blanton's message of Thu, 20 May 2021 17:54:44 -0400:
> Hi,
> [snip]
> >The one question that remains in
> >my mind is:
> >
> >ARE WE FOOD OR ARE WE PETS?
>
> They know we are intelligent, and we are not food. They guide us in our
> development somewhat, and occasionally lend a
> hand when needed, but are largely non-interventionist. A species (us)
> mostly has to discover things for themselves,
> otherwise the shock to their development can lead to catastrophe.


I hope you are right; however, my research tells me that they are taking
something from us.  And I really don't think they give a hoot about the
Prime Directive.

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Robin]

In reply to  Terry Blanton's message of Thu, 20 May 2021 17:54:44 -0400:
Hi,
[snip]
>The one question that remains in
>my mind is:
>
>ARE WE FOOD OR ARE WE PETS?

They know we are intelligent, and we are not food. They guide us in our 
development somewhat, and occasionally lend a
hand when needed, but are largely non-interventionist. A species (us) mostly 
has to discover things for themselves,
otherwise the shock to their development can lead to catastrophe.

[snip]
Regards,

Robin van Spaandonk 

Re: Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[Terry Blanton]

On Thu, May 20, 2021 at 5:08 PM William Beaty  wrote:

>
> Me, I stay away from the UFO community.
>

Wise move.  Thanks, Bill.

In the late 80s, before the Internet, I was a Moderator on the CompuServe
Encounters forum for the MUFON section.  I had been a Saucer Seeker since
reading *Incident at Exeter* as a kid in the 60s.  On that forum, I was
fortunate to meet many of the "Experts".  The forum was hot into the early
90s when the Alien Autopsy film was "found".

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alien_autopsy

Around that time, I left MUFON and CompuServe but not before meeting Chris
Tinsley who invited me to join Vortex-L and discuss Cold Fusion.  I had
become so frustrated with the UFO community and the lack of real knowledge
that I gave it up, frustrated that we will never learn who is piloting
those ships until THEY want us to know.  The one question that remains in
my mind is:

ARE WE FOOD OR ARE WE PETS?

Evidence is that they have been around for a long time.  They likely don't
consider us intelligent creatures.  After 2020, I tend to agree.

Cheers!

Dave Beaty Re: [Vo]:ufo report to be coming out in a month

[William Beaty]

Me, I stay away from the UFO community.

But my brother Dave in Ft. Myers sure doesn't!  For years he's been 
running a private facebook group for... USN pilots who commonly 
eyewitnessed weird hypervelocity aircraft, those now called "Tic-tac" 
events. All the pilots are meeting privately on facebook AATIP group. 
Dave has been taking them around to give talks at UFO conferences.


That's old news.

Now the screaming starts, because it just hit the big time, with pilot 
interviews on Sixty Minutes.   Skeptics are freaking out.


  60MIN may 16   Navy pilots' UAP encounters
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZBtMbBPzqHY



See one of Dave Beaty's youtube channels, with older pilot interviews:

  https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC6i-se5IU8hRbPov5-ON1tw

Also, he's a designer/cameraman/CGI person for a small video contract 
house in Florida, and years ago created an entire half-hour movie from 
found footage and hand-made CGI, called...


   The Nimitz Encounters   32min
   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRgoisHRmUE

   updated, USO submerged version
   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-e9NoKp8EnE

If you watch TV, you've probably seen his CGI footage, because all sorts 
of UFO programs and even broadcast news shows have been stealing it from 
his youtube video, without attribution!






On Tue, 18 May 2021, Frank Znidarsic wrote:


https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/may/17/ufo-report-marco-rubio-urges-us-take-seriously-uap





 ( (  (   ((O))   )  ) ) 
William J. Beatyhttp://staff.washington.edu/wbeaty/
beaty, chem washington edu  Research Engineer
billb, amasci com   UW Chem Dept,  Bagley Hall RM74
x3-6195 Box 351700, Seattle, WA 98195-1700