Re: Apple-Crop: ladders in pick your own
I am a customer of pyo orchards, not a grower. But I've picked at a lot of places, some allow climbing, some allow (and provide) ladders, and some that provide picking poles - just a long pole with a sack at the end. Climbing is wonderful for children, but in addition to the liability issues it's bad for your trees. (It pains me to say that, as I've called around specifically to find places that allow it, but it's true.) Ladders are a bit of a nuisance to carry around, and it ends up feeling more like work. I suggest you provide poles, which work pretty well, are easy to carry, and probably won't increase your liability much (if at all). Oh, and I work in insurance. 'falling from height' claims can be very expensive, because they can involve serious but non-fatal head and spinal cord injuries. That can cost more than a fatality. ___ Ginda ... Original Message ... On Sun, 6 Jul 2008 01:59:48 -0400 Tommy and Sandy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We are allowing people to pick their own apples for the last couple of years. We didn't start out as a pick your own orchard and we have larger trees, 111, 7, and some larger 26's. In the past we have not allowed ladders or climbing trees. I was wondering if any other pick your own orchards allowed ladders either supplying them to people or allowing them to bring their own. Also if ladders are allowed how much more insurance do you have to carry. Has anyone had any bad claims because of ladders. Thanks for responding. Tommy Bruguiere Dickie Bros. Orchard Roseland, Va -- The 'Apple-Crop' LISTSERV is sponsored by the Virtual Orchard http://www.virtualorchard.net and managed by Win Cowgill and Jon Clements [EMAIL PROTECTED]. Apple-Crop is not moderated. Therefore, the statements do not represent official opinions and the Virtual Orchard takes no responsibility for the content.
Re: [apple-crop] Food Cartel Imports Shrink Another U.S. Crop’s Production: Apple Orchards
Do you know where apples used for sauce are produced? thanks, Ginda Fisher apple consumer On Jan 28, 2012, at 11:48 AM, Jon Clements wrote: Something a little more serious to chew on after the last post: http://www.larouchepub.com/eiw/public/2005/2005_30-39/2005_30-39/2005-31/pdf/31-33_31_ecoapple.pdf -- JMCEXTMAN Jon Clements cleme...@umext.umass.edu aka 'Mr Liberty' aka 'Mr Honeycrisp' IM mrhoneycrisp 413.478.7219 ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] Rotten to the Core: What pick-your-own apple orchards tell us about the American economy.
Speaking as a pick-your-own customer: Please do wait until the trees are a little riper. Rope off the ones that aren't ready if you have some types ripen before others. Most of your customers have no clue at all whether an apple is ripe, or how to pick them, and will pry under-ripe apples off the tree, taking the whole spur with them. If the apples are really ripe, many of them will fall into the hands of the children, and you and they will both be happy. I've never been to a pyo place with heavy supervision, though, and I think that would diminish the experience for your customers. Ginda Fisher On Sep 14, 2012, at 7:19 AM, Con.Traas wrote: Hello Hugh, I would say it is worth the hassle, if the price you get is good. Making sure the apples are really ripe so they come off easily lessens the damage. Perhaps waiting until the trees are a little more sturdy would be an option. In our own case we over-pick about 10 days earlier, and then do the U-pick in the apples we have left behind. Con I'm going to reply to this, mainly to see if it works, as I'm new on here. I have a question for anyone with a u-pick orchard. Do the kids do a lot damage to the trees and fruit, making heavy supervision necessary? I just planted a small high density orchard of about an acre and a half. Would a small u-pick operation be worth the hassles? Thanks for any input, Hugh ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] Wall Street Journal Market Watch
On Sep 17, 2012, at 3:34 PM, Kushad, Mosbah M wrote: Here is an article that appeared in today's Wall Street Market Watch Website. Interesting observations.. Does it matter to your customers if a certain percentage, large or small, of what you sell either at the farm or elsewhere is not grown at your farm? Do they know, should they know, and does it make a difference? .. Hope to hear any experiences or questions that you may have been asked by your customers related to this subject. http://www.marketwatch.com/story/10-things-farm-stands-wont-tell-you-2012-09-17 Mosbah Kushad, University of Illinois ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop Speaking as a consumer who often shops at farmstands and such: But stand operators counter that consumers are voting with their dollars—if they didn’t like what was happening, they wouldn’t be buying. If you are in Massachusetts, and you are selling oranges, any customer who cares will assume you didn't grow it yourself. And if you are selling your apples and some from the farmer next door, maybe I don't care. But it can get complicated, and in my opinion, the better farm stands label food with its source. If you do that, I will consider the maple syrup from NH and the honey from cape cod, and the peaches from an orchard 30 miles west to be added value in expanding your selection. Ginda Fisher apple consumer___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] native pollinators
I'm surprised. In my suburban-boston backyard, I have seen more bumblebees and other pollinators than in recent years. Maybe that's just because one of my neighbors sprayed less this year, or some similar very local effect. But just this weekend I was pleased by the number and variety of pollinators in my garden. -- Ginda Typed with Swype. Who knows what I intended to say? Peter J. Jentsch p...@cornell.edu wrote: In the Hudson Valley of NY we are also finding very few native pollinators on dandelions as of late morning into the mid-afternoon. Carpenter bees are plentiful but few honeybees or orchard bees. By the end of the day we will be at 50% bloom on Ginger Gold with 1st bloom observed only yesterday. Blossoms opening on Golden Delicious and McIntosh today. Peter J. Jentsch Senior Extension Associate - Entomology Department of Entomology Cornell University¹s Hudson Valley Lab P.O. Box 727, 3357 Rt. 9W Highland, NY 12528 Office: 845-691-7151 Cell: 845-417-7465 FAX: 845-691-2719 On 5/2/13 2:03 PM, David Doud david_d...@me.com wrote: indeed - the dandelions are empty - few bumblebees - I have a half dozen hives of honeybees on the property, managed by mediocre bee keeper, but they are flying - I have about 20 acres of tree fruit and have always considered the native pollinators to be adequate to the job, this year may be different - on the other hand, I don't know that I want a complete pollination job this year - I have been vacillating for the last 36 hours whether to call in some more honeybees - my current thinking is that I'll just ride what I have and count on it being enough - I'm in north central Indiana - D On May 2, 2013, at 1:06 PM, Frank Carlson wrote: David: I forgot where you are located. Here in Harvard, MA, we have just been commenting on the lack of wild bees as we are about to open on McIntosh. There also are less bumble bees visible . Frank Carlson Franklyn W. Carlson, Pres. Carlson Orchards, Inc. 115 Oak Hill Road P.O.Box 359 Harvard, MA. 01451 617-968-4180 cell 978-456-3916 office -Original Message- From: apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net [mailto:apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net] On Behalf Of David Doud Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 11:02 AM To: Apple-Crop Subject: [apple-crop] native pollinators Another casualty of last year's freak weather is the population of native pollinators - my asian pears entered full bloom over the last 48 hours - other years they are surrounded by a cloud of several species of solitary pollinators, this year that activity is roughly 10% of what I am accustomed to observing - The first apple bloom opened yesterday - 72 hours ago at tight cluster I considered the amount of bloom as 'full' but not particularly remarkable, now bloom has seemingly spontaneously generated to an amount that I cannot remember observing in the past - it's going to be spectacular, but has upped my anxiety about the potential 'big crop of little green apples' - hope thinners are effective ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] Peach question
fwiw, as a consumer of peaches, it never occurred to me that the callus tissue was dangerous (or even the mold that is sometimes in split peaches) but I avoid eating it anyway. It has almost no flavor, and a somewhat unpleasant texture. But I suppose it never hurts to reassure customers that something that is harmless is, in fact, harmless. Ginda Fisher On Feb 20, 2014, at 12:53 PM, dmnor...@royaloakfarmorchard.com dmnor...@royaloakfarmorchard.com wrote: From what I have experienced, Mark, sounds like you are talking about callus tissue that can appear around the pit. The tissue is not mold, fungus, bacteria or the result of any type of disease. It is naturally occurring as you say, and is entirely safe to eat along with the rest of the peaches that they appear in. But, there are times when peaches that have split pits will mold on the inside because air is available to the inside of the peach. Split pits are usually caused by too much rain. A little molding around split pit fruit is usually okay. The difference between callus tissue and split pit mold is that the mold generally occurs in conjunction with the split pit and is actually mold. I understand that the mold is harmless as well. Hope this helps! Dennis Norton IPM Specialist/Certified Nurseryman Royal Oak Farm Orchard 15908 Hebron Rd. Harvard, IL 60033-9357 Office (815) 648-4467 Mobile (815) 228-2174 Fax (609) 228-2174 http://www.royaloakfarmorchard.com http://www.theorchardkeeper.blogspot.com - Original Message - From: Mark Angermayer To: Apple-crop discussion list Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 10:55 AM Subject: [apple-crop] Peach question I had a guy ask a question yesterday for which I didn't have a good answer. He had purchased peaches from another orchard and complained the peaches had mold next to the pit. What he described was a white substance next to the pit, not unusual in freestone peaches. At one time I read an article which described in specifics what the white substance was, but I can't remember now. I told him it probably wasn't mold, and that it was natural. I'd like to have a more specific response for my own customers. Anyone know what the white spots are next to the pit, sometimes seen when breaking open a freestone peach? Mark Angermayer Tubby Fruits Bucyrus KS ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] apples and chemicals
Can anyone summarize what this chemical is, why and how it is used, and what the risks might be to farmers and consumers from its use? I feel like I walked into the middle of a conversation. Thanks, -- Typed with Swype. Who knows what I meant to say? On April 28, 2014 4:03:51 AM EDT, Con.Traas con.tr...@ul.ie wrote: Hello Evan and everybody, Coming from my perspective, where we are now having to cope without DPA for storing Bramley (culinary) apples, I must say that is it proving tricky, but we are managing, through use of 1-MCP combined with more complex (and expensive and risky) storage regimes. So I would say it is technically possible to keep apples without DPA or ethoxyquin, which we also can’t use, but ironically it mitigates against the smaller grower, and in favour of the larger ones (big ag?) who can afford the higher tech gear. It is ironic that scaring people about pesticide residues on fresh foods (especially fruits) actually causes people to eat more processed foods (as though their ingredients do not also get pesticide treatments), as the studies linking better health with fruit consumption are studies conducted with conventionally grown fruits with their pesticide residues (if they are not residue free). In other words, the benefits of eating fruits and vegetables are there in black and white, even if those fruits and vegetables have residues. It is far less healthy to switch to a candy bar from an apple, even if that apple has some residue (so long as that is below permitted levels). However, this is not a message we can send out, so we are left grappling when emails like this from EWG are circulated. The joke of what EWG seems to be doing is producing a dirty dozen or clean fifteen list is that those lists say nothing at all about the risk of a pesticide residue on the particular apple in your fruit-bowl. You could be eating a residue-free fruit from among the “dirty dozen”, or one covered in pesticide from among the “clean fifteen”. Despite the differences in regulations between Europe and the US (and I favour in general the less permissive, more cautious European standards, despite having to work within their restrictions), our agriculture here is constantly increasing in scale, and resembles more and more what would be our stereotyped image of US industrial agriculture. That is because the regulations have more in common than what separates them, and farming is becoming more and more like a business, and less like a passion. I am personally not a fan of industrial agriculture, although I employ mostly similar methods. However, motivation is a key factor, and for me, the motivation is not profit maximisation. For the industrial model is about profit before all else, and that is not a suitable way for the World to produce its food. However, as long as Joe public takes the attitude that 7% of their disposable income is what they will spend on food (that is the Irish %), then agriculture will continue to become more industrial, as for me that is not a percentage that can support the production of produce and foods that consumers might feel more comfortable buying, and might be able to have more confidence in. So, instead of sending 45 bucks to Ken Cook, I would suggest that Joe public either sends it to a principled (and hopefully small-scale) farmer someplace near them, or better still, buys a few fruit trees or invests in a few packets of seeds, and grows their own pesticide-free produce. Con Traas European (Irish) Apple Grower T: @theapplefarmer From: apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net [mailto:apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net] On Behalf Of Evan B. Milburn Sent: 28 April 2014 02:32 To: Apple-Crop Subject: Re: [apple-crop] apples and chemicals This was sent to me from a friend of mine by the name of George. It was send to him from one of his co-workers. Evan Milburn www.milburnorchards.comhttp://www.milburnorchards.com Hey Evan what’s this all about? Hi George, Thought you might want to send this to your buddy, Mr. Milburn. Dawn Reserve your 2014 Shopper's Guide to Pesticides in Produce bag tag and get a sneak peek of this year's guide! [EWG Logo]http://action.ewg.org/salsa/track.jsp?v=2c=5r2YvGNi7PfOCCjuGLCaqB6LrHTgr0Yo [Donate today. Help EWG stand up against Big Ag's attacks and we'll send you a sneak peek of our 2014 Shoppers Guide to say thank you]http://action.ewg.org/salsa/track.jsp?v=2c=5caNRqnNvAQTKKdAymouQh6LrHTgr0Yo Dear Dawn, Is that apple slathered with a chemical banned in Europe? Earlier this week, EWG told you about apples and diphenylamine (DPA). This chemical used to help preserve stored apples is banned in Europe because of safety concerns, yet it’s widely used on conventionally grown apples in the United States. Not surprisingly, the pro-pesticide Alliance for Food and Farming isn’t too happy about this. As the public relations arm of big, industrial agriculture, this
Re: [apple-crop] apples and chemicals
Sorry, I got this email chain on my cell phone, and thought it was from a different mailing list. (One for amateur fruit growers, and one that is much more prone to getting scares about various chemicals.) Ginda Fisher apple consumer On Apr 28, 2014, at 8:08 AM, Ginda Fisher wrote: Can anyone summarize what this chemical is, why and how it is used, and what the risks might be to farmers and consumers from its use? I feel like I walked into the middle of a conversation. Thanks, -- Typed with Swype. Who knows what I meant to say? On April 28, 2014 4:03:51 AM EDT, Con.Traas con.tr...@ul.ie wrote: Hello Evan and everybody, Coming from my perspective, where we are now having to cope without DPA for storing Bramley (culinary) apples, I must say that is it proving tricky, but we are managing, through use of 1-MCP combined with more complex (and expensive and risky) storage regimes. So I would say it is technically possible to keep apples without DPA or ethoxyquin, which we also can’t use, but ironically it mitigates against the smaller grower, and in favour of the larger ones (big ag?) who can afford the higher tech gear. It is ironic that scaring people about pesticide residues on fresh foods (especially fruits) actually causes people to eat more processed foods (as though their ingredients do not also get pesticide treatments), as the studies linking better health with fruit consumption are studies conducted with conventionally grown fruits with their pesticide residues (if they are not residue free). In other words, the benefits of eating fruits and vegetables are there in black and white, even if those fruits and vegetables have residues. It is far less healthy to switch to a candy bar from an apple, even if that apple has some residue (so long as that is below permitted levels). However, this is not a message we can send out, so we are left grappling when emails like this from EWG are circulated. The joke of what EWG seems to be doing is producing a dirty dozen or clean fifteen list is that those lists say nothing at all about the risk of a pesticide residue on the particular apple in your fruit-bowl. You could be eating a residue-free fruit from among the “dirty dozen”, or one covered in pesticide from among the “clean fifteen”. Despite the differences in regulations between Europe and the US (and I favour in general the less permissive, more cautious European standards, despite having to work within their restrictions), our agriculture here is constantly increasing in scale, and resembles more and more what would be our stereotyped image of US industrial agriculture. That is because the regulations have more in common than what separates them, and farming is becoming more and more like a business, and less like a passion. I am personally not a fan of industrial agriculture, although I employ mostly similar methods. However, motivation is a key factor, and for me, the motivation is not profit maximisation. For the industrial model is about profit before all else, and that is not a suitable way for the World to produce its food. However, as long as Joe public takes the attitude that 7% of their disposable income is what they will spend on food (that is the Irish %), then agriculture will continue to become more industrial, as for me that is not a percentage that can support the production of produce and foods that consumers might feel more comfortable buying, and might be able to have more confidence in. So, instead of sending 45 bucks to Ken Cook, I would suggest that Joe public either sends it to a principled (and hopefully small-scale) farmer someplace near them, or better still, buys a few fruit trees or invests in a few packets of seeds, and grows their own pesticide-free produce. Con Traas European (Irish) Apple Grower T: @theapplefarmer From: apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net [mailto:apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net] On Behalf Of Evan B. Milburn Sent: 28 April 2014 02:32 To: Apple-Crop Subject: Re: [apple-crop] apples and chemicals This was sent to me from a friend of mine by the name of George. It was send to him from one of his co-workers. Evan Milburn www.milburnorchards.com Hey Evan what’s this all about? ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] apple as art
This is a work of art, however odd. It is not a science project. So that fact that the fruit of knowledge of good and evil wasn't literally an apple doesn't matter any more for this project than it does for any of the paintings of the Garden of Eden you might see. As with those paintings, the artist is using the fruit that is most commonly associated with the story. I don't think anything important was left out of the article. A decade or two ago I read a science fiction story of a guy who designed a custom virus that inserted the text of the Koran into human blood cells (or really, into the stem cells that made new white cells, if I remember correctly.) The story, being science fiction, dealt with the interplay of religion and science, and some of the social consequences of technology. But the technique described was something not-quite-acheivable then that would clearly be achievable in future. And I guess that future is today. Most living creatures have large quantities of junk DNA that doesn't do anything. This guy just wants to add a lot more junk that can be read as a cipher to encode chunks of wikipedia. As someone who enjoys science fiction and modern art, I have to confess this project tickles my fancy. Of course, even if it works perfectly, you will have to trust the artist. There will be no way, walking among the wikipedia grove, to tell that the trees are any different than any other apple trees. Ginda Fisher apple consumer On May 14, 2014, at 2:43 PM, Steven Bibula wrote: The fruit if the tree of the knowledge of good and evil could not have been an apple, because there was only one such tree, and it was in the garden of Eden (the site of which, along with its contents, having been destroyed by the flood of Noah’s day). The association between ‘Malus’ and ‘evil’ seems to derive from a misunderstanding of the Latin translation of Genesis; apart from that error, there is no connection between apples and that Tree. The idea of inserting Wikipedia info into apples additionally reveals how misguided this project really is, as well as the deep misunderstanding of the Bible exhibited by the scientist and the writer. The Tree was associated with the prospect of the acquisition of personal moral depravity as well as an irresistible inclination toward evil; it had nothing to do with quantitative accumulation of values-neutral facts. The Bible teaches that you shall know the tree by its fruit. The tree in question was the ‘Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil’: to eat of it would bring certain Spiritual death to the eater and to all his offspring, and those offspring would evidence their Spiritually dead condition by their evil thoughts, words and deeds. Adam ate, and now all have sinned (Romans 3:23) and the wages of sin is death (Romans 6:23). Every natural-born human is hence already encoded with the entire moral code of the Tree. This explains the evil that we in fact see all around us: all Adam’s offspring (unregenerate mankind) have become the figurative ‘trees’ bearing the fruit of evil. So the men involved in this project are too late. The project has been underway for ~6,000 years, led by natural man’s representative Head- the project’s chief researcher and pilot subject, Adam. And now, back to the field. I have Malus Domestica to plant. Steven Bibula Plowshares Community Farm 236 Sebago Lake Road Gorham ME 04038 207.239.0442 www.plowsharesmaine.com From: apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net [mailto:apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net] On Behalf Of David Doud Sent: Tuesday, May 13, 2014 10:49 PM To: Apple-Crop Subject: [apple-crop] apple as art I don't know quite what to make of this 'New Yorker' article - http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/elements/2014/05/object-of-interest-the-twice-forbidden-fruit.html - I think some things were lost/confused in the relating and retelling of the story. He (Joe Davis) plans to use synthetic biology to insert a DNA-encoded version of Wikipedia into the apple and create a living, literal tree of knowledge... Anybody know what the four thousand year old strain of apple might be? Nice picture of Cox Orange Pippin at the top... David Doud grower, IN - petal fall - ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] Apple Bloom and Crop Potential
If you are interested in data from a backyard gardener in a suburb about 10 miles west of Boston... Lots of winter damage to the ornamentals, but the fruits look good. Unusually, the crab-apples may have been damaged more than the eating apples, which bloom a little later. My Jonathan was nicely covered in blooms. I had more deer and rabbit damage to the apples than weather damage. Strawberries and raspberries are looking good. A young apricot and a young dwarf cherry (spring 2011, Carmine Jewel, from U Saskatchewan) bloomed for the first time. To my surprise, the cherry set abundant fruit. Ginda On May 18, 2014, at 12:58 PM, Win Cowgill wrote: Hello Apple Croppers- This winter was a tough one for growers in New England, New York and the Mid Atlantic (New Jersey). I am wondering what the apple crop potential is in your states, provinces, countries this season? How was your bloom? Good pollination? Winter injury to trees. I know growers in Virginia had winter injury to apple tree trunks. Massachusetts and Vermont light on bloom? How did Western New York fair? How did my friends in Quebec make out? Look foreword to your responses. Best Win Win Cowgill Apple-Crop Co-Founder Editor Horticultural News Professor and Area Fruit Agent New Jersey Agricultural Experiment Station Rutgers Cooperative Extension PO Box 2900 314 State Route 12, Bldg. 2 Flemington, NJ 08822-2900provinces Office 908-788-1339 Fax- 908-806-4735 Email: cowg...@njaes.rutgers.edu www.horticulturalnews.org/ www.virtualorchard.net/ http://virtualorchard.net/njfruitfocus/index.html www.appletesters.net hortnewscover50percent.jpg ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] theft deterrence
I'd like to reply as an apple consumer, and as someone who ate a lot of fruit in u-pick orchards as a kid, and as someone who thinks of herself as an honest person. If your customers are eating fruit as they talk to you, they don't think they are stealing. And perhaps you shouldn't think they are, either. There are different types of pick-your-own places, but in most cases, they are selling an experience more than they selling fruit. Eating fruit transforms a u-pick experience into something much more enjoyable than a trip to the market to buy fruit. I would suggest you seriously consider building a charge for fruit consumed on-site into your fees, and allowing your customers to do it. Think of it as similar to providing a salad bar at a restaurant rather than as theft. As an adult, I go both to places that tell me prominently not to eat the fruit (or put tight limits on what is allowed) and to places that don't do that. As an honest person, I follow the rules. But I only go to the places with restrictions if they offer a product I can't buy at a store. I would never bother to bring my kids to those places. What would be the point? I understand that in some parts of the country there are u-pick places where the extra they offer is lower prices than a store. That's a different market, and if that is why your customer comes, it's not unreasonable to restrict their grazing. But think about what experience you want to sell. Consider a charge per head, or by the hour, or require a minimum purchase per person in the field so that you get enough revenue. But consider ways to make your customer want to come back and repeat an enjoyable experience. Ginda Fisher Apple consumer -- Typed with Swype. Who knows what I meant to say? On October 6, 2014 10:08:22 AM EDT, Mark Helen Angermayer angermay...@gmail.com wrote: Steven, I think your sign is a tasteful way to do it, and will probably work for most people. Just as different perspective, I've got a very small orchard (only about 300 peach trees and a few plums and apples) and I give away a lot fruit. I charge enough to be able to give away some to each customer. I sell them #1s at a fair price and throw in some seconds for free. It makes my customers feel like they are being treated special (which is what I try to do) and makes me feel good too. I also cut up lots of free samples for my customers. It makes for good experience for the customer. When they have a good experience, they come back. Many years ago (before I knew anything about fruit) my wife took me to a U-pick strawberry. I didn't want to go, but she told me (or showed me) you eat strawberries, while you pick. I guess you might say she taught me theft. I never viewed it as theft, but assumed the grower charged enough to compensate for my eating. I thought it was just part of the experience. Had I thought the grower considered it theft, I wouldn't have eaten any berries while picking, but also may not have ever gone to the U-pick in the first place, since part of the experience of U-pick is eating some fruit while picking. I'll also mention I consider myself a fairly honest person (I don't cheat people, don't cheat on my taxes, try to treat others like I'd like to be treated, etc). You can take what I say w/ a grain of salt, since I haven't offered U-pick. But I don't think it would bother me if people ate their lunch from my trees while picking their fruit for purchase. They are probably not going to eat more than a couple pounds of fruit, which is about the average amount I give away anyway. If they brought their family in and fed their family from the fruit, then left without buying anything (or much of anything) that would upset me. In that case, they are not treating others like they would want to be treated. Mark Angermayer Tubby Fruits On 10/6/14, Steven Bibula sbib...@maine.rr.com wrote: A few U-Pick customers are so brazen about their theft that they eat berries and apples freely in front of me while coming out of the field toward the register. I also see them positively gorging in the field, as if this were an AUCE establishment (we charge by the picked pound). I am also troubled that the most visible offenders are adults with children, teaching those children that theft is okay. What do you do to deter theft and improve moral conduct? As a part of our effort to awaken the conscience of our customers without offending or implicating those who are already self controlled, we are considering posting the following text on a tasteful sign at appropriate an location or two. Feedback from you is welcome. Other ideas are welcome too. TO OUR VALUED CUSTOMERS: Please feel free to taste the fruit so you can pick with confidence. Because our fruit is also our livelihood, we ask that you please limit yourselves and members of your party to a small sample, and enjoy the rest after payment. Thank you for your
Re: [apple-crop] More GMO fears
And I just ran into a Facebook petition against arctic apples. They sound very scary and evil from the headline. I decided I didn't have the energy to engage whatever friend linked to it, but you should be aware it is making the rounds. Ginda Fisher, Apple consumer -- Typed with Swype. Who knows what I meant to say? On March 15, 2015 8:58:31 PM EDT, maurice tougas appleman.maur...@gmail.com wrote: Why am I not at all surprised? Maurice Tougas Tougas Farm Northborough, MA On Sun, Mar 15, 2015 at 7:06 PM, David A. Rosenberger da...@cornell.edu wrote: In case you missed it, you may want to read the following article which was forwarded thousands of times last week by folks concerned about GMOs, including some of my extended family. http://worldnewsdailyreport.com/doctors-confirm-first-human-death-officially-caused-by-gmos/ The report didn’t sound credible to me, and it was not as you will learn by reading the follow-up by a fact-checking website: http://www.inquisitr.com/1899679/did-gmo-tomatoes-kill-juan-pedro-ramos/ Nevertheless, given the recent discussion about GMO apples, some of you will probably encounter apple customers with questions about why GMO tomatoes were reported to have killed someone in Spain. Dave Rosenberger, Professor Emeritus Dept. of Plant Pathology and Plant-Microbe Biology Cornell’s Hudson Valley Lab, P.O. Box 727, Highland, NY 12528 Office: 845-691-7231Cell: 845-594-3060 http://blogs.cornell.edu/plantpathhvl/blog-2014/ ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop -- Maurice Tougas Tougas Family Farm Northborough,MA 01532 508-450-0844 ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] Arctic Apples again -
If it makes you feel any better, that number is likely significantly overstated. I have two Facebook accounts. Dead people and pets have Facebook accounts. Many people created a Facebook account but never use it. Also, Facebook is a big place, and nobody reads all of it. Saying there is misinformation on Facebook is sort of like saying there is misinformation in newspapers. Ginda Fisher Apple consumer -- Typed with Swype. Who knows what I meant to say? On March 30, 2015 5:52:00 PM EDT, dmnor...@royaloakfarmorchard.com wrote: I jsut read the last data from Facebook that indicates they have over 1.3 billion users! When I see the erroneous information that gets posted to the news feed on Facebook about GMO's, Monsanto and the Arctic apple, and the number of people that believe this stuff.it scares me to think what the future of growers and farmers is going to become!! Dennis Norton IPM Specialist/Certified Nurseryman/IT Specialist Royal Oak Farm Orchard 15908 Hebron Rd. Harvard, IL 60033-9357 Office (815) 648-4467 Mobile (815) 228-2174 Fax (609) 228-2174 http://www.royaloakfarmorchard.com http://www.royaloakfarmorchard.blogspot.com https://www.facebook.com/royaloakfarmorchard/ - Original Message - From: Craig Tanner To: 'Apple-crop discussion list' Sent: Monday, March 30, 2015 3:25 PM Subject: Re: [apple-crop] Arctic Apples again - GMO apples may contaminate nearby organic and conventional apple orchards and could potentially cause valuable export markets to reject U.S. apples as happened in past when wheat and rice crops were found to be contaminated by GMOs. A - See more at: http://www.foe.org/projects/food-and-technology/genetic-engineering/no-gmo-apples#sthash.FRll2V3z.dpuf what? how? this statement makes my head spin Craig Tanner Tanners Orchard, Ltd. Speer, IL 309-493-5442 309-493-5741 fax 306-360-5610 cell -- From: apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net [mailto:apple-crop-boun...@virtualorchard.net] On Behalf Of David Doud Sent: Monday, March 30, 2015 11:28 AM To: Apple-Crop Subject: [apple-crop] Arctic Apples again - Sorry to beat this, but I think it's in our interest to stay informed - if the powers that be want me to give it a rest, I will - I copy and paste an email that went out to subscribers to Well.org - it was forwarded to me - I am unfamiliar with this organization and a peek at their website doesn't impress and the website itself doesn't have any content about Arctic Apples - I've been made aware of at least one other organization promoting anti-Arctic Apple sentiment - http://www.foe.org/projects/food-and-technology/genetic-engineering/no-gmo-apples I investigated the claim that McDonald's and Gerber... and it's not as presented - they have 'no plans' because there is no product available to buy, but they have not rejected and Gerber specifically admits and defends using GMO products - Looks like battle lines are being drawn and strategies arctic-ulated - David Doud peach leaf curl spray this week - 2012 on this date was apple full bloom - not at silver tip yet this year, but soon - You're hearing from us because you subscribed via Well.org. Last year, we released the Origins documentary for free to over 700,000 people across the world. If you want to unsubscribe, click here. On Friday the 13th, the USDA approved the unnecessary, unlabeled, and poorly tested GMO apple. It was an unlucky day indeed for the apple growers, food companies, and people like us who want to protect our families from GMO foods. But it's not all bad news. Thanks to pressure from thousands of people like you, McDonald's and Gerber -- two of the biggest purchasers of apples -- have already confirmed that they have no plans to sell GMO apples. Their commitments will help keep this risky product off the market. Now, we need to get other fast food companies to join them. If we can get the top 10 fast food companies, including Burger King, Wendy's, Subway and Dunkin' Donuts, to commit to not sell the GMO apple, we may be able to prevent it from ending up on our plates! Tell these fast food restaurants to say NO to GMO apples! The apple in question - known as the Arctic Apple® -- was designed for purely cosmetic purposes. It was genetically engineered to not turn brown when cut. Of course, browning in apples can be prevented naturally by applying lemon juice or another source of vitamin C -- making this risky apple completely unnecessary. What's more, without natural browning, apples may look fresh when they are actually decaying. In fact, scientists believe apples' natural browning enzyme may help fight diseases and pests. In other words, if farmers grow these new apples, they may have to increase their pesticide use. And since they won't be labeled, we won't even know
Re: [apple-crop] arctic apples
On Feb 26, 2015, at 10:34 PM, Jon Clements wrote: ... 6.) What ever happened to BST/BGH push-back and labeling? Ginda, I will let you look that one up. ... Jon I don't need to look that one up, because I've followed it. The differences between the milk and meat of BST/BGH-treated cows is too small to be conclusively measured (higher levels of this and that, but within the normal range) HOWEVER, the incidence of mastitis and other maladies is significantly higher in cows treated with BST than in untreated cows. So, just as the roundup ready gene doesn't affect how your body interacts with food, but the greater residue of roundup might be a concern, the hormonal changes in the milk are probably unimportant, but you are probably exposed to more antibiotic residue (and anti-biotic-resistant bacterial contamination) from the milk (and meat) of treated cows. It's been outlawed in Canada, the EU, and several other first-world countries, mostly on animal welfare grounds. It remains legal in the US, but most of the milk in my supermarket says our farmers pledged not to use BST. Checking with wikipedia, this isn't just a yuppie phenomenon, a large number of major brands of milk, including Costco's Kirkland brand, Walmart's Great Value brand, and many more. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bovine_somatotropin The wikipedia article doesn't have any recent data on how commonly it is used, but says: From 2000-2005 the USDA National Agricultural Statistics Service (NASS) survey of dairy producers found that about 17% of producers used rBST.[23] The 2010 USDA National Agricultural Statistics Service survey of Wisconsin farms found that about 18% of dairy farms used rBST.[24] So it's still out there, but most of our milk supply is from untreated cows. ... John, your first link in both intriguing and scary. 1.) I would be a lot more worried about this http://www.the-open-mind.com/mit-estimates-half-of-all-children-autistic-in-10-years-due-to-monsanto-1/#fsWKjef2oeh3k4OW.01 ... Do you know anything about how reliable the author is? She uses a lot of graphs of correlations, that I find very unconvincing. There are all manner of things that correlate, and most of them aren't causal. Some are both causally related to a third factor, and some are completely random. If you want to see some fun, random correlations, check out this link. http://www.tylervigen.com/ Ginda Fisher___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
Re: [apple-crop] arctic apples
On Feb 26, 2015, at 9:53 AM, David Doud wrote: Well, I have been to two social events since the GMO 'Arctic apples' have been in the news - and that is what people want to talk to me about - and pretty much only that... How are you all handling this? My personal opinions aside, I don't want to 'carry water' for these guys - they aren't going to let me grow them even if I wanted to and I don't feel inclined to spend my time and credibility providing them cover and fighting their marketing struggle for them - This is going to be a frequently reoccurring issue this season - I've got an event to go to this afternoon and I am dreading this aspect of it - David Doud grower, IN below 0*F, way behind on pruning I am just a consumer, and don't have to sell apples. But my guess is, if you are fielding this question at parties, that people are just asking you because they are curious, and perceive you as an expert on the subject. If it comes up at parties, I think you can say whatever you want -- between talking about how wonderful the arctic apples will be, or whining about how you aren't going to be able to get them, and then talking about the economics of apple growing, or bemoaning the lack of regulation, or, you know, pretty much anything. If you are asked by a potential customer, I would advise replying something non-commital, like those aren't available to grow, yet, so I haven't researched it, or none of the apples I am selling are GMO. You might want to grow GMO apples a few years down the line, and you might not want to box yourself into an anti-GMO stance. And of course, you don't want to waste your time arguing in favor of a product you don't have. Again, I'm just a consumer. But I don't think you need to engage at all with consumers on the topic if you don't want to. Ginda Fisher buried in snow in eastern MA ___ apple-crop mailing list apple-crop@virtualorchard.net http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
