Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-31 Thread John Harris
30, 2008 10:05 PM Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query John Kasunich wrote: This subject seems to come up every month or two. The answer is and will probably always be the same. Yes, it is possible to make a box that lives outside the PC and can queue up enough

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-31 Thread Jon Elson
Jon Elson wrote: Dave Caroline wrote: The amount of data one could put in a USB microframe, may allow for more loops per frame so make it easier I can see some ways that one could export the software step generation to a USB parallel port. Umm, I obviously didn't say what I

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-31 Thread Dave Caroline
I have a feeling if we learn enough about USB2 a fixed bi directional micro frame protocol could be deterministic for EMC I need a second and third read of the spec Dave Caroline - This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-31 Thread Jon Elson
tomp wrote: maybe this is of interest RT-Firewire on Linux, using Xenomai (RTAI ) used for robotics, for realtime control of positioning systems it also enables RTnet over firewire several nice papers at http://www.rtfirewire.org Practically all PCs have USB and Ethernet. The hardware

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-31 Thread Dave Caroline
I think some of us need to pick up and even help or fork those dead projects and see where we can go Dave Caroline - This SF.Net email is sponsored by the Moblin Your Move Developer's challenge Build the coolest Linux based

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-31 Thread Jack Coats
I was just reading SERVO, and a guy is using one of the PicoITX boards. Low power consumption, small, and could do well, but I would like a board with 3 or 4 parallel ports available, even using a 'plug in board'. That would give all the expansion I could ever think of. But building a parallel

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-31 Thread Kirk Wallace
On Fri, 2008-10-31 at 17:57 +, Dave Caroline wrote: I have a feeling if we learn enough about USB2 a fixed bi directional micro frame protocol could be deterministic for EMC I need a second and third read of the spec Dave Caroline Wasn't there some talk, last year, about real-time

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-31 Thread tomp
Jon Elson wrote: tomp wrote: maybe this is of interest RT-Firewire on Linux, using Xenomai (RTAI ) used for robotics, for realtime control of positioning systems it also enables RTnet over firewire several nice papers at http://www.rtfirewire.org Practically all PCs have USB

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-31 Thread alan
On Thu, 2008-10-30 at 20:30 -0500, Jim Coleman wrote: alan, have you considered replacing the fan? this seems like the cheapest solution to me :-D and you could probably find a complete heatsink with fan for your laptop on ebay, people part out laptops alot on there. I took it to a local

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-31 Thread Matt Shaver
On Thu, 2008-10-30 at 08:00 -0500, Jeff Epler wrote: It can go to pci and post-pci internal busses using intelligent cards like the mesa 5i20. (this is the path I personally favor) I'm kind of hoping for pci express over cable: http://www.onestopsystems.com/pcie_over_cable.html

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-31 Thread Peter C. Wallace
On Fri, 31 Oct 2008, Matt Shaver wrote: Date: Fri, 31 Oct 2008 14:39:47 -0400 From: Matt Shaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query On Thu, 2008-10-30 at 08:00 -0500, Jeff Epler

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-31 Thread tomp
Kirk Wallace wrote: On Fri, 2008-10-31 at 17:57 +, Dave Caroline wrote: I have a feeling if we learn enough about USB2 a fixed bi directional micro frame protocol could be deterministic for EMC I need a second and third read of the spec Dave Caroline Wasn't there some talk,

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-31 Thread Jon Elson
Kirk Wallace wrote: Wasn't there some talk, last year, about real-time Ethernet? Ethernet, to my uneducated brain, seems much more appealing than USB. Jan Kiszka did this for RT Linux (its called rtnet), and it is apparently a complete project, and is being maintained. BUT, the slave side

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-31 Thread Jon Elson
tomp wrote: i dont think firewire card is rare or expensive siig syba other mfctrs tiger direct 20$ mirco center 20$ newegg 12.99$ so not rare and not expensive more important, it already works realtime linux rtai for motion control OK, they have REALLY come down, I haven't looked

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-31 Thread Jon Elson
alan wrote: On Thu, 2008-10-30 at 20:30 -0500, Jim Coleman wrote: alan, have you considered replacing the fan? this seems like the cheapest solution to me :-D and you could probably find a complete heatsink with fan for your laptop on ebay, people part out laptops alot on there. I

[Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-30 Thread alan
The fan on my laptop quit the other day so I started looking around for a replacement computer. Looking on the Ebuyer website here in the UK it seems that most new laptops (especially the smaller ones) now only have usb outputs. There is a wonderful little acer computer just released very small,

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-30 Thread Jeff Epler
On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 12:34:36PM +, alan wrote: So really my query is also about the future. Where will emc go if parallel ports become a thing of the past? It can go to systems that still have parallel ports, even after they become unusual in new consumer PCs. It can go to systems where

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-30 Thread Emory Smith
On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 08:00, Jeff Epler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 12:34:36PM +, alan wrote: So really my query is also about the future. Where will emc go if parallel ports become a thing of the past? It can go to systems that still have parallel ports, even after

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-30 Thread Jack Coats
As others have said, laptops have issues. Dumpster diving and using discards from offices is probably the cheapest way to support this habit :) Eventually, I see EMC2 going to a 'client server' model, taking the real time portion and putting it in an external controller, like a pc/104 or even

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-30 Thread Chris Radek
On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 02:10:59PM +, alan wrote: I have built an ornamental turning lathe with stepper control, on a moveable stand and I am really looking for something that sits on a narrow shelf under the lathe next to my stepper controller box. So I am looking for a eorocard or

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-30 Thread Jack Coats
If you get a little brave, design a smaller case that is more appropriate. Wood is good! Put a good fan or two in it with filters, and keep a 'positive pressure' in the case. This will keep much of the dust/dirt/chips out. Story warning In the OLD days before the IBM PC was a dream in Boca

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-30 Thread John Kasunich
Jack Coats wrote: If you get a little brave, design a smaller case that is more appropriate. Wood is good! Put a good fan or two in it with filters, and keep a 'positive pressure' in the case. This will keep much of the dust/dirt/chips out. Personally I wouldn't go for wood - metal

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-30 Thread tomp
fan alan wrote: The fan on my laptop quit the other day so I started looking around for a replacement computer. Looking on the Ebuyer website here in the UK it seems that most new laptops (especially the smaller ones) now only have usb outputs. There is a wonderful little acer computer just

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-30 Thread Sebastian Kuzminsky
Jeff Epler wrote: On Thu, Oct 30, 2008 at 12:34:36PM +, alan wrote: So really my query is also about the future. Where will emc go if parallel ports become a thing of the past? snip It can go into embedded systems that are as powerful as today's desktop PCs, but with appropriate I/O

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-30 Thread Jon Elson
alan wrote: So any suggestions for a cheap replacement computer. What is the smallest, cheapest desktop or laptop with a parallel port? I thought about using a pc/104 card but again here in the UK they seem to be quite expensive? Has anyone got experience using pc/104 ? Stuart Stevenson

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-30 Thread Jim Combs
BUT, USB is a shared resource. Up to 127 devices can be on the bus and there is no guarantee of timed delivery. You could identify the device a as a video interface and the USB bus would allocate specific bandwidth to an interface. Making a USB based IO EMC2 hardware controller would be the way

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-30 Thread Jim Combs
Guess it would do well for me to sign my message! BUT, USB is a shared resource. Up to 127 devices can be on the bus and there is no guarantee of timed delivery. You could identify the device a as a video interface and the USB bus would allocate specific bandwidth to an interface. Making a USB

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-30 Thread John Harris
Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2008 11:04 AM Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query Guess it would do well for me to sign my message! BUT, USB is a shared resource. Up to 127 devices can be on the bus

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-30 Thread John Kasunich
John Harris wrote: Hi Jim, I'm very interested in your proposed project, of moving the 'Real Time' out of the box and into a USB replacement for the parallel port breakout board. I design motorized microscope XY stages and focus knob drives for Z, with a 3-axis controller

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-30 Thread tomp
Jim Combs wrote: BUT, USB is a shared resource. Up to 127 devices can be on the bus and there is no guarantee of timed delivery. You could identify the device a as a video interface and the USB bus would allocate specific bandwidth to an interface. Making a USB based IO EMC2 hardware

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-30 Thread Jon Elson
Dave Caroline wrote: The amount of data one could put in a USB microframe, may allow for more loops per frame so make it easier I can see some ways that one could export the software step generation to a USB parallel port. Both the FTDI2232 and the Cypress 7C68013 (EZ-USB FX2 chip) can

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-30 Thread Jon Elson
John Kasunich wrote: This subject seems to come up every month or two. The answer is and will probably always be the same. Yes, it is possible to make a box that lives outside the PC and can queue up enough motion in advance that it doesn't require realtime performance from the PC.

Re: [Emc-users] Parallel port in the future - query

2008-10-30 Thread tomp
Jon, Jon Elson wrote: John Kasunich wrote: This subject seems to come up every month or two. The answer is and will probably always be the same. Yes, it is possible to make a box that lives outside the PC and can queue up enough motion in advance that it doesn't require realtime