Re: Re: Maquiladoras not beneficial

2002-12-03 Thread Doug Henwood
Sabri Oncu wrote: I don't know what troll means but I happen to have some ideas about right wingers. I hold that a necessary, but not sufficient, condition for being a leftist is the recognition that the US is an imperialist state screwing most of the rest of the world. Don't forget the U.S.'s

RE: Re: Maquiladoras not beneficial

2002-12-03 Thread Devine, James
Title: RE: [PEN-L:32701] Re: Maquiladoras not beneficial to me, it doesn't matter that much whether deLong is a right-winger or not. I can filter out his right-wing opinions, just as I do with the New York TIMES or U.S. National Public Radio. Just as I filter out a lot of the crap that some

Re: Re: Maquiladoras not beneficial

2002-12-03 Thread Louis Proyect
A little while ago I discovered that Brad Delong has an article defending neoliberalism in Mexico on his website that originally appeared in Foreign Affairs: http://www.j-bradford-delong.net/Econ_Articles/themexicanpesocrisis.html It is very useful, even if totally wrong--especially when read

Re: Re: Re: Maquiladoras not beneficial

2002-12-03 Thread Michael Perelman
Lou is correct on several points. Brad typically supports neo-liberal policies abroad and, at least to my mind, he is more often than not wrong. Also, the 3 people he mentioned did leave in disgust about Brad's behavior. I thought that it would have been healthier to have dialogued with Brad,

Re: Re: Re: Re: Maquiladoras not beneficial

2002-12-03 Thread Doug Henwood
Michael Perelman wrote: Lou is correct on several points. Brad typically supports neo-liberal policies abroad and, at least to my mind, he is more often than not wrong. Also, the 3 people he mentioned did leave in disgust about Brad's behavior. I thought that it would have been healthier to

Re: Re: Re: Maquiladoras not beneficial

2002-12-03 Thread Ian Murray
- Original Message - From: Doug Henwood [EMAIL PROTECTED] Don't forget the U.S.'s junior partners, like Canada, the EU, and Japan, who sometimes act as if they're above the imperial screwing even as they benefit from it. Doug Not long after 9-11 there was a

RE: Re: Maquiladoras not beneficial

2002-12-03 Thread Devine, James
Title: RE: [PEN-L:32721] Re: Maquiladoras not beneficial I described: the standard way that the US imperialists see it: the US provides international public goods from which the other countries -- including the totally dominated ones -- benefit. The countries that don't go along (e.g

Re: RE: Re: Maquiladoras not beneficial

2002-12-03 Thread Ian Murray
- Original Message - From: Devine, James [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ian, Ian, Ian! you're getting too close to reality! the efforts by individual parts of the military-industrial complex (or the whole shebang) to gain advantage for themselves is part of the reality of imperialism. It's not

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Maquiladoras not beneficial

2002-12-03 Thread Michael Perelman
Dialogue requires a certain degree of courtesy that was often absent from his posts. On Tue, Dec 03, 2002 at 02:22:32PM -0500, Doug Henwood wrote: Michael Perelman wrote: Lou is correct on several points. Brad typically supports neo-liberal policies abroad and, at least to my mind, he is

RE: Re: RE: Re: Maquiladoras not beneficial

2002-12-03 Thread Devine, James
Title: RE: [PEN-L:32724] Re: RE: Re: Maquiladoras not beneficial I said: It's not the same as the self-perception and self-justification of imperialists that I described. Ian writes: Right, except that I think they're no longer worried about the fables of international public goods

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Maquiladoras not beneficial

2002-12-03 Thread Carrol Cox
Doug Henwood wrote: Michael Perelman wrote: True enough, but it's an odd model of dialogue that will admit only people in fundamental agreement with each other. I guess it's the left version of Richard Feinberg's wonderful comment that democracy only works when there's fundamental

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Maquiladoras not beneficial

2002-12-03 Thread Louis Proyect
Carrol Cox: Brad is an enemy, but one can talk to him just as Chou tried to talk to Dulles one morning during the Geneva Conference. (They both arrived early one morning; Chou offered to shake hands, Dulles snubbed him.) In the present case Lou is playing a marxist version of Dulles's style,

Re: Re: Maquiladoras not beneficial

2002-12-02 Thread Louis Proyect
Bill Burgess wrote: At 01:04 PM 12/2/2002 -0500, Louis quoted: Maquiladora workers receive wages considerably below those paid to non-maquiladora manufacturing workers. What is it about the stats I've seen quoted by bourgeois economists that makes it possible for them to represent the

Re: Re: Maquiladoras not beneficial

2002-12-02 Thread Michael Perelman
What Louis quoted is true. What you may have seen is that the maq. wages are higher than the prevailing wage, since manufacturing jobs are scarce relative to the total job market. On Mon, Dec 02, 2002 at 10:22:17AM -0800, Bill Burgess wrote: At 01:04 PM 12/2/2002 -0500, Louis quoted: