[WSG] Font size and arrogance - ADMIN THREAD CLOSED
I don't think you understand the issue of accessibility at all. In many countries, laws have been needed to force people like you to catch up. THREAD CLOSED I have been watching this thread for a while, concerned that it would move from healthy discussion into abuse. It has. This list is supposed to be about supporting each other. No more font size discussions! Russ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Font size ADMIN - THREAD CLOSED
THREAD CLOSED ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] Font size ADMIN - THREAD CLOSED
Here here. Bout 30 emails wasting everyones time. More about standards less about egos! -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of russ - maxdesign Sent: Friday, 19 November 2004 9:21 PM To: Web Standards Group Subject: Re: [WSG] Font size ADMIN - THREAD CLOSED THREAD CLOSED ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Font size ADMIN - THREAD CLOSED
On 11/19/04 4:02 AM Brett Walsh [EMAIL PROTECTED] sent this out: Here here. Make that hear, hear and you're on! :-) Best, Rick Faaberg ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Help With IE Jog Bug...
Chris
Now for plan B
I had a play around with the page and this is the most concise solution so
far:
#nav {
position: absolute;
left: 15px; top: 95px;
width: 120px;
margin: 15px 0;
}
That works in IE6, Firefox 1.0 and Opera 7.54 on PC. The original and new
versions both break in IE5 and IE5.5 PC due to the width:100%; - answer to
that one coming next.
Also, instead of the extraneous br / tags in the page can I recommend:
p.show_time
{
text-align: right;
margin: 0 0 1em;
padding: 0;
}
and wrapping the number of days at the bottom in a p.
Hope that helps,
Bryan
- Original Message -
From: Chris Stratford [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 12:00 AM
Subject: Re: [WSG] Help With IE Jog Bug...
Hey Bryan,
Sorry but that didn't help??
I added position: relavite; and line-height: 100% to both the #content,
and to the table...
Neither worked on its own, or both together...
:(
Any other advice??
Bryan Davis wrote:
Chris
The usual way to bypass these kind of bugs is either declare
position:relative; or a line-height for the containing div. That
tends to kick IE into line.
Hope that helps,
Bryan
- Original Message - From: Chris Stratford
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WSG [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 2:35 PM
Subject: [WSG] Help With IE Jog Bug...
Hey List.
I have whipped up this calendar today.
http://www.neester.com/beta/calendar.html
Took me a while to get the PHP right, but yeah, an hour or two of code
crunching and I got it right!
Just perfect!
Then I skinned it with CSS...
All PERFECT again!
Then... I took a look with IE...
Checked validation...
All good... IE didnt like it.
realised i was the jog bug - any help?
The table automatically sits below my navigtaion bar!!!
What the hay!!
How can this be fixed?
Thanks in advance to you all!
--
Chris Stratford
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.neester.com
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
--
Chris Stratford
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.neester.com
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
Fw: [WSG] Help With IE Jog Bug...
...and of course, the way to fix the table overflow in IE5 is to set
width:auto; and then Voice Family Hack to width:100% for everyone else.
That should make it work for the PC browsers - any Mac users still having
trouble?
Cheers,
Bryan
- Original Message -
From: Bryan Davis [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 1:18 PM
Subject: Re: [WSG] Help With IE Jog Bug...
Chris
Now for plan B
I had a play around with the page and this is the most concise solution so
far:
#nav {
position: absolute;
left: 15px; top: 95px;
width: 120px;
margin: 15px 0;
}
That works in IE6, Firefox 1.0 and Opera 7.54 on PC. The original and new
versions both break in IE5 and IE5.5 PC due to the width:100%; - answer
to that one coming next.
Also, instead of the extraneous br / tags in the page can I recommend:
p.show_time
{
text-align: right;
margin: 0 0 1em;
padding: 0;
}
and wrapping the number of days at the bottom in a p.
Hope that helps,
Bryan
- Original Message -
From: Chris Stratford [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 12:00 AM
Subject: Re: [WSG] Help With IE Jog Bug...
Hey Bryan,
Sorry but that didn't help??
I added position: relavite; and line-height: 100% to both the #content,
and to the table...
Neither worked on its own, or both together...
:(
Any other advice??
Bryan Davis wrote:
Chris
The usual way to bypass these kind of bugs is either declare
position:relative; or a line-height for the containing div. That
tends to kick IE into line.
Hope that helps,
Bryan
- Original Message - From: Chris Stratford
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WSG [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 2:35 PM
Subject: [WSG] Help With IE Jog Bug...
Hey List.
I have whipped up this calendar today.
http://www.neester.com/beta/calendar.html
Took me a while to get the PHP right, but yeah, an hour or two of code
crunching and I got it right!
Just perfect!
Then I skinned it with CSS...
All PERFECT again!
Then... I took a look with IE...
Checked validation...
All good... IE didnt like it.
realised i was the jog bug - any help?
The table automatically sits below my navigtaion bar!!!
What the hay!!
How can this be fixed?
Thanks in advance to you all!
--
Chris Stratford
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.neester.com
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
--
Chris Stratford
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.neester.com
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
RE: Re[2]: [WSG] Font size and arrogance
Be nice Iain! Final warning. Peter -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Iain Harrison Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 7:53 PM To: Lothar B. Baier Subject: Re[2]: [WSG] Font size and arrogance Hello Lothar, Thursday, November 18, 2004, 8:06:50 PM, you wrote: On every computer I know, it is possible to reduce the screenresolution to get bigger text to the screen. You've never used an LCD screen that only works well at one resolution? You've never used a PDA? I don't think you understand the issue of accessibility at all. In many countries, laws have been needed to force people like you to catch up. So, when sobody with a handicap on his eyesight uses to set the screenresolution to the max. possible, he should not blame a webdesigner for no longer being able to read the text on a website. I design all my websites on a computer with the screenresolution set appropriate to the size of the screen I use. If the user does the same, he will be able to read, what is written there. If not, it's not my fault. If I build a road for you, don't you worry about the six-inch-high jagged rocks sticking out of the surface, or the eight-inch-deep potholes in the road, or the 1:2 gradients. They don't matter. I drive a big 4x4 and that drives along the road with no trouble at all. I build the road for my car with a surface appropriate for the vehicle I use. If the user does the same, he will be able to travel, along that road. If not, it's not my fault. -- Best regards, Iainmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Font size
Henry Tapia wrote: Points about allowing the user as much text size control as possible are well made and I agree, however I don't think I'd have a job as a designer if I relied upon the average user to change their browser's default text-size manually. In my several years working on the web, and as a user prior to that, I've never witnessed that behaviour, even amongst savvy users (text-zooming yes, adjusting browser default text-size, no). hank Hi, I don't believe I have either Hank. I would go so far as to suggest that the average user does not realize the default font size *can* be changed. Additionally, while some users are aware that text can be zoomed using the mouse or keyboard, they are still a minor portion of Web users. Someone who has poor eye sight has likely researched their options, and adjusted their font size accordingly. -- Best regards, Michael Wilson ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] web essentials 04 - zeldman video keynote online
Any way there's a transcript available? I'm deaf and so very interested in what Zeldman had to say. I'd love it if I could read the transcript while watching the video... What would send me to absolute nirvana would be to have the video contain captioning (subtitling) right IN the video - ohhh, just the very thought of it thrills me... thud Ugh, that was me coming back to terra firma. Leslie Riggs Not sure if it's been mentioned on the list already, but Zeldman's video keynote for WE04 is available online. http://www.happycog.com/mov/ (although crikey, that 9MB file is not optimised for streaming - or whatever pseudo-streaming over http quicktime implements - meaning that you may be better off downloading it to your machine first) Patrick H. Lauke ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] forcing IE6 into quirks mode
Gunlaug Sørtun wrote: Jeroen Visser [ vizi ] wrote: Gunlaug Sørtun wrote: I know of no limitations in IE6 when doing this, and it saves some coding too. The improved box-model isn't reason enough to debug several versions of IE/win. IE/win can be made to almost behave like a good browser should-- in quirks mode. It's really weird. On one side (Robert Scoble's IE wishlist entries) developers are screaming that IE should adhere to standards (box model, XHTML as application/xhtml+xml etc), but when there's actually some progression, you stick to the nineties' quirks approach. ;-? I don't belong to the group of screaming developers. Hi Georg, Sorry for this misunderstanding --I didn't mean to group you in any way. It's just that I was a bit amazed about your view when in general, the web standards 'society' regards IE as the largest obstacle in standards-compliant webdesign. To me it seems that 'we as webdesigners' (pro or amateur doesn't matter) should show some appreciation towards MS for steps they do take, not just complain about what they don't do. I _stick to_ the browsers which are giving me what I want; Opera, Moz/FF, Safari... If Scoble wanna know what I want, he can surf over to W3C and take a look. The rest is just noise-- to me. I only support IE/win because I can, not because it matters to me. IE6 is less of a problem in quirks mode, because it doesn't need so many alterations to a page that works well when developed in Opera and the other good browsers. I don't like to kill browser-bugs in more versions than I have to. Guess I'm lazy. :) I can understand that you want to minimize the number of hacks and time invested in them, but I don't think a designer's opinion on a browser matters. If a majority of visitors to his clients' site use IE/win, then he should cater for that. And in my opinion he should do that in the best possible way (i.e.: use IE6 standards mode whenever possible). Also; it's easier to code for Lynx when I don't have to change things to make IE6 happy. _That_ matters to me. Could you explain this to me? In the end, the website visitor matters. I think we agree on that. But if I were to choose between using an extra hour to improve a design for 80% (or more) of the visitors or using that hour to improve it for a browser like Lynx (or Omniweb, or iCab, for that matter), I'd go for the 80%. Don't get me wrong: I'm all for semantically correct, usable, accessible and standards-compliant sites that look great and degrade gracefully. But practice --as usual-- is far different from such theory, and every designer has a limited supply of time and money for any given project, so you have to choose how and where you invest your resources. I think those resources should go where they have the largest impact on the largest audience. If / when some software are reasonable in line with the standard code I use, it will be supported by me. That includes everything Microsoft launch-- but only if it is up to the job. Can you point to a case where IE is not 'up to the job'? What constitutes 'not up to the job'? Once again; my preference is Opera-- latest stable version available at any one time. Those of you who make a living out of web design may, reasonably enough, have other preferences and priorities. Which browser I use is not that important (other than that developing in Mozilla is faster and more reliable than in IE, for instance). What the people out there use, who visit the site I design, that's important. Thanks for the example. I'll look into it. Maybe I'll use it-- if IE6 will behave on all the rest. For more background information on the exact differences between IE6 in standards mode and IE5+ quirks: http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/en-us/dnie60/html/cssenhancements.asp Jeroen -- vizi fotografie grafisch ontwerp - http://www.vizi.nl/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] web essentials 04 - zeldman video keynote online
Leslie, I'm trying to figure out if you were being serious, or just sarcastic... but interestingly enough, I was actually going to do a quick transcript of it this weekend and nudge Jeffrey to make that available as well. I could also have a stab at SMIL...could be an interesting little exercise, as I've done a bit of it in the past. Watch this space :) Patrick -Original Message- From: Leslie Riggs [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 19 November 2004 15:15 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [WSG] web essentials 04 - zeldman video keynote online Any way there's a transcript available? I'm deaf and so very interested in what Zeldman had to say. I'd love it if I could read the transcript while watching the video... What would send me to absolute nirvana would be to have the video contain captioning (subtitling) right IN the video - ohhh, just the very thought of it thrills me... thud Ugh, that was me coming back to terra firma. Leslie Riggs Not sure if it's been mentioned on the list already, but Zeldman's video keynote for WE04 is available online. http://www.happycog.com/mov/ (although crikey, that 9MB file is not optimised for streaming - or whatever pseudo-streaming over http quicktime implements - meaning that you may be better off downloading it to your machine first) Patrick H. Lauke ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] web essentials 04 - zeldman video keynote online
Patrick, I was definitely serious. I miss out on so many excellent online workshops, streaming audio, and presentations because I can't hear/understand the people who speak during those events. Lipreading over the Internet has its limitations ;) Anyone who provides transcripts or subtitling does an enormous, incalculable service for Deaf and hard of hearing professionals like me. We get to smile, laugh, and ponder right along with everyone else, instead of a few seconds later. Leslie Riggs Leslie, I'm trying to figure out if you were being serious, or just sarcastic... but interestingly enough, I was actually going to do a quick transcript of it this weekend and nudge Jeffrey to make that available as well. I could also have a stab at SMIL...could be an interesting little exercise, as I've done a bit of it in the past. Watch this space :) Patrick -Original Message- From: Leslie Riggs [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 19 November 2004 15:15 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [WSG] web essentials 04 - zeldman video keynote online Any way there's a transcript available? I'm deaf and so very interested in what Zeldman had to say. I'd love it if I could read the transcript while watching the video... What would send me to absolute nirvana would be to have the video contain captioning (subtitling) right IN the video - ohhh, just the very thought of it thrills me... thud Ugh, that was me coming back to terra firma. Leslie Riggs ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] web essentials 04 - zeldman video keynote online
Now you've got me thinking. Is there anything similar to the Talking Newspapers service for internet content? Should there be? A group of fast typing volunteers/proofreaders could provide transcripts to popular non subtitled items. We'd barely be scratching the surface of what needs to be done but is it worth thinking about Leslie? Janet Leslie Riggs wrote: Patrick, I was definitely serious. I miss out on so many excellent online workshops, streaming audio, and presentations because I can't hear/understand the people who speak during those events. Lipreading over the Internet has its limitations ;) Anyone who provides transcripts or subtitling does an enormous, incalculable service for Deaf and hard of hearing professionals like me. We get to smile, laugh, and ponder right along with everyone else, instead of a few seconds later. Leslie Riggs Leslie, I'm trying to figure out if you were being serious, or just sarcastic... but interestingly enough, I was actually going to do a quick transcript of it this weekend and nudge Jeffrey to make that available as well. I could also have a stab at SMIL...could be an interesting little exercise, as I've done a bit of it in the past. Watch this space :) Patrick -Original Message- From: Leslie Riggs [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 19 November 2004 15:15 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [WSG] web essentials 04 - zeldman video keynote online Any way there's a transcript available? I'm deaf and so very interested in what Zeldman had to say. I'd love it if I could read the transcript while watching the video... What would send me to absolute nirvana would be to have the video contain captioning (subtitling) right IN the video - ohhh, just the very thought of it thrills me... thud Ugh, that was me coming back to terra firma. Leslie Riggs ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] web essentials 04 - zeldman video keynote online
I think it's a fantastic idea. While I don't have any (notable) vision or hearing problems, if there is a text transcript availible, I'll choose that 10 times out of 10. ~j On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 16:31:07 +, Daisy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Now you've got me thinking. Is there anything similar to the Talking Newspapers service for internet content? Should there be? A group of fast typing volunteers/proofreaders could provide transcripts to popular non subtitled items. We'd barely be scratching the surface of what needs to be done but is it worth thinking about Leslie? Janet Leslie Riggs wrote: Patrick, I was definitely serious. I miss out on so many excellent online workshops, streaming audio, and presentations because I can't hear/understand the people who speak during those events. Lipreading over the Internet has its limitations ;) Anyone who provides transcripts or subtitling does an enormous, incalculable service for Deaf and hard of hearing professionals like me. We get to smile, laugh, and ponder right along with everyone else, instead of a few seconds later. Leslie Riggs Leslie, I'm trying to figure out if you were being serious, or just sarcastic... but interestingly enough, I was actually going to do a quick transcript of it this weekend and nudge Jeffrey to make that available as well. I could also have a stab at SMIL...could be an interesting little exercise, as I've done a bit of it in the past. Watch this space :) Patrick -Original Message- From: Leslie Riggs [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 19 November 2004 15:15 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [WSG] web essentials 04 - zeldman video keynote online Any way there's a transcript available? I'm deaf and so very interested in what Zeldman had to say. I'd love it if I could read the transcript while watching the video... What would send me to absolute nirvana would be to have the video contain captioning (subtitling) right IN the video - ohhh, just the very thought of it thrills me... thud Ugh, that was me coming back to terra firma. Leslie Riggs ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Jonathan T. Sage Theatrical Lighting / Set Designer Professional Web Design [HTTP://www.JTSage.com] [HTTP://design.JTSage.com] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [See Headers for Contact Info] ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] This is really strange stuff, even for IE
I'm stuck on a strange behavior with IE. For some reason, on only a few of our pages, the title of one of our form inputs will wrap and parts of the title will repeat. Yeah, it's not the greatest description. Here's a sample page, naturally it looks fine in ff. I want to think that it is something in the main body that is throwing it off, but I can't find it yet, I'd appreciate any help. here's a page that is acting up: http://www.csavg40.com/csa/sitemap-cheap-travel-insurance.do Notice the title for initial trip deposit date and how sit date is repeated underneath the original mention. The extra sit date is not in the code. Are there any Poirot's out there that can ferret out the offending code? Thanks Ted Drake www.csatravelprotection.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] simple javascript question
Is this valid language=JavaScript type=text/javascript or should I just have type only. I'm afraid of breaking any functions that might require the language. Ted ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] web essentials 04 - zeldman video keynote online
I just did a search for subtitles in Internet media and found this... http://www.cpcweb.com/Webcasting/webcast_samples.htm I know it costs MONEY to get this - but there's another one called VideoLAN, which is free, open source software but I don't know a whole lot about it: http://www.videolan.org/ - still researching this. I want not only accessibility but also web standards compliance. But, is that asking too much? So, I guess the capabilities are out there. And I'm proud to see a number of people right here in this group who have the skills and knowledge to create things like this with SAMI or SMIL. Two organizations among my clients that are both comprised of and oriented toward the Deaf and hard of hearing community have asked me to look into creating streaming video of their representatives using American Sign Language to include on their websites - and we're looking at voice-overs for site visitors who may not be familiar with ASL, and/or, including text translations (captioning or perhaps just a paragraph next to/beneath the video) because accessibility works both ways. Cost figures into the decision making process quite a bit. Life gets a lot more complicated when we consider all the possible ways to be accessible. I know I may be asking a lot, but I feel like I miss out, when I WANT so much to learn everything everybody else here gets to learn. Talking Newspapers is a great idea - and an excellent solution for people with visual impairments. Captioned/subtitled media on the Web is hugely popular with Deaf and hard of hearing people, because it's real-time information in a visual form. Leslie Riggs Now you've got me thinking. Is there anything similar to the Talking Newspapers service for internet content? Should there be? A group of fast typing volunteers/proofreaders could provide transcripts to popular non subtitled items. We'd barely be scratching the surface of what needs to be done but is it worth thinking about Leslie? Janet ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] This is really strange stuff, even for IE
Hello Ted, Friday, November 19, 2004, 5:16:55 PM, you wrote: I want to think that it is something in the main body that is throwing it off, but I can't find it yet, I'd appreciate any help. here's a page that is acting up: http://www.csavg40.com/csa/sitemap-cheap-travel-insurance.do Notice the title for initial trip deposit date and how sit date is repeated underneath the original mention. The extra sit date is not in the code. Are there any Poirot's out there that can ferret out the offending code? I couldn't see anything obvious, but my first step would be to amend the html and css so that it validates. w3.org reports 20 html errors and three css errors. To be honest, I'm not sure that these are the cause of your problems, but fixing them first makes a lot of sense, and it might make the problem go away! -- Best regards, Iainmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] This is really strange stuff, even for IE
Hi Ted Validating the source sorts out the problem. There's a missing img end tag, several that need to be amp; and some type=text/javascript missing from script elements. Adding those fixes the strange behaviour. Interestingly, the source as it stands causes IE to break if you try resizing text with View | Text Size. Cheers Peter Ted Drake wrote: I'm stuck on a strange behavior with IE. For some reason, on only a few of our pages, the title of one of our form inputs will wrap and parts of the title will repeat. Yeah, it's not the greatest description. Here's a sample page, naturally it looks fine in ff. I want to think that it is something in the main body that is throwing it off, but I can't find it yet, I'd appreciate any help. here's a page that is acting up: http://www.csavg40.com/csa/sitemap-cheap-travel-insurance.do Notice the title for initial trip deposit date and how sit date is repeated underneath the original mention. The extra sit date is not in the code. Are there any Poirot's out there that can ferret out the offending code? Thanks Ted Drake www.csatravelprotection.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] This is really strange stuff, even for IE
Hi guys I have fixed the image tag, that was an easy one. The problem is driving me crazy. I remove them when I can but whenever I get rid of them all it trashes the javascript functions. I wish I know which ones are safe to remove. On the vast majority of the pages, the things are the last hurdles. Has anyone else conqured this? What suggestions do you have? We have spent many hours going back and forth on this issue. Ted -Original Message- From: Peter Asquith [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 10:30 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [WSG] This is really strange stuff, even for IE Hi Ted Validating the source sorts out the problem. There's a missing img end tag, several that need to be amp; and some type=text/javascript missing from script elements. Adding those fixes the strange behaviour. Interestingly, the source as it stands causes IE to break if you try resizing text with View | Text Size. Cheers Peter Ted Drake wrote: I'm stuck on a strange behavior with IE. For some reason, on only a few of our pages, the title of one of our form inputs will wrap and parts of the title will repeat. Yeah, it's not the greatest description. Here's a sample page, naturally it looks fine in ff. I want to think that it is something in the main body that is throwing it off, but I can't find it yet, I'd appreciate any help. here's a page that is acting up: http://www.csavg40.com/csa/sitemap-cheap-travel-insurance.do Notice the title for initial trip deposit date and how sit date is repeated underneath the original mention. The extra sit date is not in the code. Are there any Poirot's out there that can ferret out the offending code? Thanks Ted Drake www.csatravelprotection.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] Need direction with key detection
Todd, no disagreement on leaving the back button to users but at the present
time we needed a quick fix beings our site went live two days ago and it
averages roughly 50,000 hits per day. We will work on a better solution next
month but for now this might do the trick
html
body onload=handleBackButton()
form name=_mine
input name=_a1 value=1 style=visibility:hidden
/form
script language=JavaScript
var x=1;
var isBack;
function handleBackButton()
{
isBack = (x != document._mine._a1.value);
document._mine._a1.value=2;
document._mine._a1.defaultValue=2;
}
function isBackButtonUsed()
{
return isBack;
}
/script
h1Back button testing/h1
form
input type=button value=is back button
onclick=(isBackButtonUsed())? alert('Back button was used'):alert('Page was
loaded normally')
/form
/body
/html
-Original Message-
From: Todd Baker [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 1:52 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [WSG] Need direction with key detection
I think you'll find that ...
A: You can't detect that.
B: Its best left in the users hands.
The back button is the lifeline of many users. Sometimes its the ONLY
click that they know EXACTLY where they will go. To do anything with
script would be a usability disaster.
I think you need to re-architect your system and solve the problem
another way. I have had the same problem when building checkout
systems and the like and there is ALWAYS a way to solve these
problems.
On Thu, 18 Nov 2004 11:01:02 -0800, GALLAGHER Kevin S
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
We built http://www.ormap.org which is a GIS site. Our problem occurs when
a
user clicks the Back button.
What I am looking for is code to detect when the Back button is clicked
(Alt+ is another problem). Any ideas or sites to direct me too.
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
Re: [WSG] Need direction with key detection
not sure if this will help or give a pointer, but we use this code to
keep users from hitting the refresh key and escape keys. Our enviroment
(3rd party web browser-like interface) doesn't have a back button, so
we never dealt with that issue. it might be able to be tweaked for the
back button too.
function document_onkeydown()
{
// keycode for F5 function
// traps F5 key press assign to backspace
// then cancels backspace ;-)
if (window.event window.event.keyCode == 116) {
alert(diabled);
window.event.keyCode = 8;
// keycode for backspace
if (window.event window.event.keyCode == 8) {
// cancel the backspace
window.event.cancelBubble = true;
window.event.returnValue = false;
return false;
}
}
// escape key
if (window.event window.event.keyCode == 27) {
alert(disabled);
window.event.returnValue = false;
}
}
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
[WSG] Measuring default font size
Thanks for the links, Terrence. However, I think I was misunderstood. I mean that for all the designer work I've seen in trying to figure out what browsers do with various settings (such as these links), I haven't seen much in the way of statistics on what users are doing with those settings. Would it be useful, for example, to have stats on your own site that read something like this: Default Font Size #users % users 16px1234 57% 12px 567 23% 18px 89 5% ...and so forth. Javascript can measure this easily, and then dump the measurement into the web logs for later collection. This is how stats are gathered on screen size and plugin distribution. It seems to me that without evidence on how people are using your sites, design choices based on all the other information are merely well-informed stabs in the dark. On Nov 18, 2004, at 5:15 PM, Terrence Wood wrote: Actually, Felix has some interesting studies on his site about font size, pixel, resolution relationships: http://members.ij.net/mrmazda/auth/ ... and added: also look here: http://www.thenoodleincident.com/tutorials/box_lesson/font/ ... On 2004-11-19 1:02 PM, Ben Curtis wrote: This has been an interesting, if heated, thread. I think a large part of it revolves around being unable to measure people's default font size. The arrogance vs. idealist portion of the discussion. So I'm building something to measure the default size of things. Anyone know of someone else that has already done this? I'd hate to duplicate effort. -- Ben Curtis WebSciences International http://www.websciences.org/ v: (310) 478-6648 f: (310) 235-2067 ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Measuring default font size
Hello Ben, Friday, November 19, 2004, 8:18:09 PM, you wrote: Javascript can measure this easily If you can suggest some javascript to do this, I'd love to run it on a few pages. -- Best regards, Iainmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] funky padding
Hi, folks. I'm having a bit of trouble ridding myself of some top and bottom padding inside a box. Can anybody assist, please? http://www.drzeus.net/redesign/cslewis/ The quote of the day box, to be specific. Thanks. -- ~john _ Dr. Zeus Web Development http://www.DrZeus.net content without clutter ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Measuring default font size
Hello Ben, Friday, November 19, 2004, 8:18:09 PM, you wrote: Javascript can measure this easily If you can suggest some javascript to do this, I'd love to run it on a few pages. I'm suspecting this is a new idea. I'd like to make a nice package for people to use. Something simple, a single tag that they can put on their clients' pages without impact (if designers put the sensor on their own pages, they'll be measuring other designers' default sizes!). Gimme a couple weeks and I'll see what I can do. -- Ben Curtis WebSciences International http://www.websciences.org/ v: (310) 478-6648 f: (310) 235-2067 ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] funky padding
Hi, Well at first glance I'd say the division itself has 5 px applied on all sides as per the #qotd rules. The extra white space is most probably a mix of margin and line-heights on the paragraphs you use within the div. Iain -- Iain Gardiner http://www.firelightning.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of john Sent: 19 November 2004 21:46 To: web standards group Subject: [WSG] funky padding Hi, folks. I'm having a bit of trouble ridding myself of some top and bottom padding inside a box. Can anybody assist, please? http://www.drzeus.net/redesign/cslewis/ The quote of the day box, to be specific. Thanks. -- ~john _ Dr. Zeus Web Development http://www.DrZeus.net content without clutter ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] This is really strange stuff, even for IE
Ted Drake wrote: Hi guys I have fixed the image tag, that was an easy one. The problem is driving me crazy. I remove them when I can but whenever I get rid of them all it trashes the javascript functions. I wish I know which ones are safe to remove. On the vast majority of the pages, the things are the last hurdles. Has anyone else conqured this? What suggestions do you have? We have spent many hours going back and forth on this issue. Ted Well, I'd suggest hiding any decision making logic within the external javascript file, and only using clean function calls on your event handlers...if that makes sense (sorry, bit too sozzled at this point to expand on it ;) ) Patrick H. Lauke _ re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.] www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk http://redux.deviantart.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] funky padding
Thanks for the response. The 5px padding is only applied to the left and right (at least, that's what happens when viewing). I have no line heights applied to that div, so I'm still not sure what's causing it. I really just need to remove the extra space, but I can't figure out where it's coming from! ~john _ Dr. Zeus Web Development http://www.DrZeus.net content without clutter on 11/19/2004 10:16 PM Iain Gardiner said the following: Hi, Well at first glance I'd say the division itself has 5 px applied on all sides as per the #qotd rules. The extra white space is most probably a mix of margin and line-heights on the paragraphs you use within the div. Iain -- Iain Gardiner http://www.firelightning.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of john Sent: 19 November 2004 21:46 To: web standards group Subject: [WSG] funky padding Hi, folks. I'm having a bit of trouble ridding myself of some top and bottom padding inside a box. Can anybody assist, please? http://www.drzeus.net/redesign/cslewis/ The quote of the day box, to be specific. Thanks. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] funky padding
No, Ian's right. You have 5px padding all the way around, and then you
have the margins of the paragraphs contained within #qotd. Add
#qotd p { margin:0; padding:0; }
to you CSS.
Patrick H. Lauke
_
re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively
[latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.]
www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk
http://redux.deviantart.com
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
Re: [WSG] simple javascript question
Hi Ted, I'm no javascript expert, but I believe language=javascript is deprecated and no longer really required anyway. I only use 'type' and haven't found any scripts breaking. Cheers Jason. On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 09:34:28 -0800, Ted Drake [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is this valid language=JavaScript type=text/javascript or should I just have type only. I'm afraid of breaking any functions that might require the language. Ted ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Jason Foss Almost Anything Desktop Publishing www.almost-anything.com.au Windows Messenger: [EMAIL PROTECTED] North Rockhampton, Queensland, Australia We can do almost anything! ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] funky padding
Sorry to disagree, but your CSS rules for the division are as follows:
#qotd {
background: #fff;
font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;
text-align: left;
padding: 5px; -- Applies 5px on all sides
border-color: #C60;
border-style: dotted;
border-width: thin;
}
And then after this you don't apply any styles to the first paragraph so it
has the default margin values. Try this:
#qotd p {
margin: 0;
}
And see if it makes a difference.
Iain
--
Iain Gardiner
http://www.firelightning.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of john
Sent: 19 November 2004 22:51
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [WSG] funky padding
Thanks for the response. The 5px padding is only applied to the left
and right (at least, that's what happens when viewing). I have no line
heights applied to that div, so I'm still not sure what's causing it.
I really just need to remove the extra space, but I can't figure out
where it's coming from!
~john
_
Dr. Zeus Web Development
http://www.DrZeus.net
content without clutter
on 11/19/2004 10:16 PM Iain Gardiner said the following:
Hi,
Well at first glance I'd say the division itself has 5 px applied on
all sides as per the #qotd rules. The extra white space is most
probably a mix of margin and line-heights on the paragraphs you use
within the div.
Iain
--
Iain Gardiner
http://www.firelightning.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of john
Sent: 19 November 2004 21:46
To: web standards group
Subject: [WSG] funky padding
Hi, folks.
I'm having a bit of trouble ridding myself of some top and bottom
padding inside a box. Can anybody assist, please?
http://www.drzeus.net/redesign/cslewis/
The quote of the day box, to be specific. Thanks.
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
RE: [WSG] funky padding
In addition to my previous e-mail, I also spotted this rule:
html p {
text-align: left;
line-height: 1.5; -- This is applied to all paragraphs in
your document
}
--
Iain Gardiner
http://www.firelightning.com
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
Re: [WSG] funky padding
The problem is p the p have a margin. You have to set the margin to 0px; Berry Thanks for the response. The 5px padding is only applied to the left and right (at least, that's what happens when viewing). I have no line heights applied to that div, so I'm still not sure what's causing it. I really just need to remove the extra space, but I can't figure out where it's coming from! ~john _ Dr. Zeus Web Development http://www.DrZeus.net content without clutter ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] anchor, classes and IDs
Hello All,
This might be a dumb question but I don't really know how to search
correctly in google for my answer.
Is it possible that any anchor inside a DIV will inherit all the properties
from the DIV?
For example
/***
CSS
**/
#idName {
font-family: Verdana;
}
a.idName:link {
color: FFF;
}
a.idName:visited {
color: #FFF;
}
a.idName:hover {
color: #FFF;
}
a.idName:active {
color: #FFF;
}
!-- HTML --
I would like to declare all id once and be done with it.
div id=idNamea href=index.html Home/aa href=sub1.html
Sub1/a//div
As it is right now I have to declare the class to each anchor usage:
div id=idNamea href=index.html class=footerHome/aa
href=sub1.html class=footerSub1/a /div
I hope anyone can understand my question and let me know if it is possible.
I believe it is but I just don't know how exactly declare my classes.
Thank you!
...helmut
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
Re: [WSG] funky padding
You make me feel like a pudding head, Iain.
~john
on 11/19/2004 11:03 PM Iain Gardiner said the following:
In addition to my previous e-mail, I also spotted this rule:
html p {
text-align: left;
line-height: 1.5; -- This is applied to all paragraphs in
your document
}
--
Iain Gardiner
http://www.firelightning.com
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
Re: [WSG] This is really strange stuff, even for IE
The problem is driving me crazy. I remove them when I can but
whenever I get rid of them all it trashes the javascript functions. I
wish I know which ones are safe to remove. On the vast majority of the
pages, the things are the last hurdles.
Ack! Don't remove the unless you know what they do. CDATA is your
friend.
script type=text/javascript
!-- // ![CDATA[
function matchwo(a,b) {
if (a b a 0) return 1;
else return 0;
}
// ]] --
/script
The XML parser for your XHTML document will ignore anything in a CDATA
block, and a browser that doesn't understand the script tag will ignore
everything between the comments.
--
Ben Curtis
WebSciences International
http://www.websciences.org/
v: (310) 478-6648
f: (310) 235-2067
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
RE: [WSG] funky padding
Hi John, You make me feel like a pudding head, Iain. ~john lol, not my intention at all, sorry. I sould say now that I love the clean and uncluttered design you have made. Your client should be very pleased. And I am pleased as I have been a fan of CS Lewis ever since having his books read to me by my mum as a child. :) Iain -- Iain Gardiner http://www.firelightning.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] anchor, classes and IDs
You have the right idea, but the wrong methodology. The selectors you need
to use are:
#idName {
font-family: Verdana;
}
#idName a:link {
color: #FFF;
}
#idName a:visited {
color: #FFF;
}
#idName a:hover {
color: #FFF;
}
#idName a:active {
color: #FFF;
}
But it's much easier to write it out this way:
#idName a:link, #idName a:hover, #idName a:visited, #idName a:active
{
color: #fff;
}
Iain
--
Iain Gardiner
http://www.firelightning.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of helmut
Sent: 19 November 2004 23:15
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [WSG] anchor, classes and IDs
Hello All,
This might be a dumb question but I don't really know how to search
correctly in google for my answer.
Is it possible that any anchor inside a DIV will inherit all the properties
from the DIV?
For example
/***
CSS
**/
#idName {
font-family: Verdana;
}
a.idName:link {
color: FFF;
}
a.idName:visited {
color: #FFF;
}
a.idName:hover {
color: #FFF;
}
a.idName:active {
color: #FFF;
}
!-- HTML --
I would like to declare all id once and be done with it.
div id=idNamea href=index.html Home/aa href=sub1.html
Sub1/a//div
As it is right now I have to declare the class to each anchor usage:
div id=idNamea href=index.html class=footerHome/aa
href=sub1.html class=footerSub1/a /div
I hope anyone can understand my question and let me know if it is possible.
I believe it is but I just don't know how exactly declare my classes.
Thank you!
...helmut
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
[WSG] Solved-sort of-- This is really strange stuff, even for IE
Hey everyone I've been hacking away at this all day, the strange ghost words. I finally came up with a holly hack to make it a bit better. Here's what I was coming across. I have a series of titles/inputs that are very similar and play well. Then, there is one with a longer title and it wraps. Next, I have one long title (ages of travelers) that should stretch across the left nav. I found that I needed to put an empty div with a class to clear the floating above it. After this longer title, there are a series of ten smaller inputs (ages) that should float against each other to create two rows of five inputs. Unfortunately, the age inputs wanted to skip the age input label and rest against the title above it, which was taller than its input, due to the text wrapping. Does this make sense so far? here's a page to look at: http://www.csavg40.com/csa/sitemap-cheap-travel-insurance.do So, the solution that I found was the holly hack to give the labels a height:1% for IE and to hide it from IE5.5. This made the age boxes stay below the age input title and the text is no longer ghosted. If you look at the above link, you will see the bad text for about an hour and I will probably upload the fixed pages before I leave tonight. Ted -Original Message- From: Patrick H. Lauke [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 2:32 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [WSG] This is really strange stuff, even for IE Ted Drake wrote: Hi guys I have fixed the image tag, that was an easy one. The problem is driving me crazy. I remove them when I can but whenever I get rid of them all it trashes the javascript functions. I wish I know which ones are safe to remove. On the vast majority of the pages, the things are the last hurdles. Has anyone else conqured this? What suggestions do you have? We have spent many hours going back and forth on this issue. Ted Well, I'd suggest hiding any decision making logic within the external javascript file, and only using clean function calls on your event handlers...if that makes sense (sorry, bit too sozzled at this point to expand on it ;) ) Patrick H. Lauke _ re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.] www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk http://redux.deviantart.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] funky padding
hehe...well thanks. In this case, I am my own client. *grin* The site's been up for 10 years, and this is v3.0 to keep up with the times. :) ~john _ Dr. Zeus Web Development http://www.DrZeus.net content without clutter on 11/19/2004 11:23 PM Iain Gardiner said the following: Hi John, You make me feel like a pudding head, Iain. ~john lol, not my intention at all, sorry. I sould say now that I love the clean and uncluttered design you have made. Your client should be very pleased. And I am pleased as I have been a fan of CS Lewis ever since having his books read to me by my mum as a child. :) Iain -- Iain Gardiner http://www.firelightning.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] anchor, classes and IDs
AHH!!
Thank you very much
...helmut
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Iain Gardiner
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 5:27 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [WSG] anchor, classes and IDs
You have the right idea, but the wrong methodology. The selectors you need
to use are:
#idName {
font-family: Verdana;
}
#idName a:link {
color: #FFF;
}
#idName a:visited {
color: #FFF;
}
#idName a:hover {
color: #FFF;
}
#idName a:active {
color: #FFF;
}
But it's much easier to write it out this way:
#idName a:link, #idName a:hover, #idName a:visited, #idName a:active
{
color: #fff;
}
Iain
--
Iain Gardiner
http://www.firelightning.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of helmut
Sent: 19 November 2004 23:15
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [WSG] anchor, classes and IDs
Hello All,
This might be a dumb question but I don't really know how to search
correctly in google for my answer.
Is it possible that any anchor inside a DIV will inherit all the properties
from the DIV?
For example
/***
CSS
**/
#idName {
font-family: Verdana;
}
a.idName:link {
color: FFF;
}
a.idName:visited {
color: #FFF;
}
a.idName:hover {
color: #FFF;
}
a.idName:active {
color: #FFF;
}
!-- HTML --
I would like to declare all id once and be done with it.
div id=idNamea href=index.html Home/aa href=sub1.html
Sub1/a//div
As it is right now I have to declare the class to each anchor usage:
div id=idNamea href=index.html class=footerHome/aa
href=sub1.html class=footerSub1/a /div
I hope anyone can understand my question and let me know if it is possible.
I believe it is but I just don't know how exactly declare my classes.
Thank you!
...helmut
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
RE: [WSG] Solved-sort of-- This is really strange stuff, even for IE
Hi Ted, Sorry to be late with this response, but I'd encountered this problem in the last two weeks at work. I've written some documentation for it at work, but really the best reference is from PiE: http://www.positioniseverything.net/explorer/dup-characters.html This behaviour, dubbed the Explorer 6 duplicate character bug usually appears when a non-floated element wraps around multiple floated elements and seems to be triggered by HTML comments and/or elements set to display: none. Weirdness! Fixes that worked for me are applying the holly hack (height 1%) to non-floated elements and adding margin-right: -3px to left floated elements (the opposite for right-floated elements), for IE6 only. Again, messy hacks galore to make IE play ball. Take it or leave it. Regards, hank -- http://henrytapia.com/ -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Ted Drake Sent: Saturday, 20 November 2004 10:31 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [WSG] Solved-sort of-- This is really strange stuff, even for IE Hey everyone I've been hacking away at this all day, the strange ghost words. I finally came up with a holly hack to make it a bit better. Here's what I was coming across. I have a series of titles/inputs that are very similar and play well. Then, there is one with a longer title and it wraps. Next, I have one long title (ages of travelers) that should stretch across the left nav. I found that I needed to put an empty div with a class to clear the floating above it. After this longer title, there are a series of ten smaller inputs (ages) that should float against each other to create two rows of five inputs. Unfortunately, the age inputs wanted to skip the age input label and rest against the title above it, which was taller than its input, due to the text wrapping. Does this make sense so far? here's a page to look at: http://www.csavg40.com/csa/sitemap-cheap-travel-insurance.do So, the solution that I found was the holly hack to give the labels a height:1% for IE and to hide it from IE5.5. This made the age boxes stay below the age input title and the text is no longer ghosted. If you look at the above link, you will see the bad text for about an hour and I will probably upload the fixed pages before I leave tonight. Ted ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] forcing IE6 into quirks mode
Jeroen Visser [ vizi ] wrote: Gunlaug Sørtun wrote: I don't belong to the group of screaming developers. Hi Georg, Sorry for this misunderstanding --I didn't mean to group you in any way. It's just that I was a bit amazed about your view when in general, the web standards 'society' regards IE as the largest obstacle in standards-compliant webdesign. I'm sure I belong in a group, somewhere. Not sure which one though. :) IE6 should be seen as an obstacle from a users point of view, as well as from a web designer's position. I'm not a user and I don't design for IE6 either. I just whip it into conformance with my wishes, that's all. If it looks too bad in IE/win, well... that's too bad. I can always give it something it _can_ handle-- if I care to spend the extra time. Yes, I am lazy... :) To me it seems that 'we as webdesigners' (pro or amateur doesn't matter) should show some appreciation towards MS for steps they do take, not just complain about what they don't do. I'm not complaining about what MS do or don't do. It's not my problem. I _am_ complaining some about what doesn't work well. IE6 isn't working well, so I throw it back to where it came from: IE5. IE6 still doesn't work well, but it doesn't loose any of its standard functionality when in quirks mode, and it becomes more predictable and is in need of less attention. That's the whole issue in a nutshell-- to me. I can understand that you want to minimize the number of hacks and time invested in them, but I don't think a designer's opinion on a browser matters. If a majority of visitors to his clients' site use IE/win, then he should cater for that. And in my opinion he should do that in the best possible way (i.e.: use IE6 standards mode whenever possible). Standard mode sounds nice, but that doesn't help one single bit on the appearance in IE6. All I see is some extra code and styles, and I don't think visitors care much about what they can't see. What mode a browser is in is caused by doctype-switching. The fact that I switch IE6 into quirks mode doesn't make my use of code and doctype any different. HTML Tidy keeps a close watch on my code and doctype, and the validators are good tools for finding my typing-errors. I recommend both (but I don't like those yellow buttons). Also; it's easier to code for Lynx when I don't have to change things to make IE6 happy. _That_ matters to me. Could you explain this to me? In the end, the website visitor matters. I think we agree on that. But if I were to choose between using an extra hour to improve a design for 80% (or more) of the visitors or using that hour to improve it for a browser like Lynx (or Omniweb, or iCab, for that matter), I'd go for the 80%. Yeah, I'm a demanding personality. :) More on the subject: http://www.gunlaug.no/contents/main_author.html (still testing that design btw.) I can't cover all browsers because I don't have access to them all. But since I don't get a penny for what I'm doing, I might as well have some fun in my attempts to cover as many as I can. It doesn't hurt my bottom-line, you know. Also-- more important-- I have visitors who are in need of accessible web pages, and some who need knowledge about how to improve access on their own sites. That makes it even more fun to try to find the balance between good access and graphical styling / design. I don't have to choose, because I've found that coding for Lynx (or similar) actually provides me with more solid page-structures for all sorts of visual styling. So why make choices when I can have double of both and save some time while I'm at it? I don't need to spend 5 minutes on Lynx in the process of creating a new web design. However, I'm beginning to have serious doubts about the use of time spent on IE/win... but it's more or less routine now so it doesn't take all that long once a web page is up and running in a standard compliant browser. Guess it's the power of standards that's kicking in, and 25 years of software creation and manipulation. Don't get me wrong: I'm all for semantically correct, usable, accessible and standards-compliant sites that look great and degrade gracefully. But practice --as usual-- is far different from such theory, and every designer has a limited supply of time and money for any given project, so you have to choose how and where you invest your resources. I think those resources should go where they have the largest impact on the largest audience. I'm somewhat relaxed on what's semantically correct and valid and all that. It matters, but it isn't ruling my day. However, I won't move or change one single (x)html element to suit _one_ weak browser if it disturbed the sequence in any good browser. I wouldn't misuse html-elements to achieve visual appearance either, if I can find the right element for that particular use. That part is slightly confusing at times, but I do my best. W3 documents and browser-support makes good reading. This is not theory-- it's a
Re: [WSG] funky padding
Hi John, I've found if you delete the paragraph tags containing the first and last sentences that should do the trick. You have the middle paragraph contained within a set of paragraph and blockquote tags, which will retain your layout and formatting. Since div tags are considered block-level elements they automatically generate white space above and below adjacent elements. Kind regards, Mario Hi, folks. I'm having a bit of trouble ridding myself of some top and bottom padding inside a box. Can anybody assist, please? http://www.drzeus.net/redesign/cslewis/ The quote of the day box, to be specific. Thanks. -- ~john _ Dr. Zeus Web Development http://www.DrZeus.net content without clutter ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
