Dear Keith, I«d find it very interesting (so as to update my thesis), to get the specifications of ASTM«s new D6751.
Please let me know if you have them, and if so, please pass them on. They«d really come in handy. Best wishes, Christian ----- Original Message ----- From: "Keith Addison" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <biofuel@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sunday, June 09, 2002 8:42 AM Subject: Re: [biofuel] water > Hi Christian > > >Hi Keith, > > > >I«m answering this letter separate from Ken«s answer. > >Regarding "I'm really not sure at this stage whether that's good advice or > >not though.", my intention is not to freak everyone out. > > Oh, I meant my advice might not be good, not yours. > > >I simply wouldn«t > >want anybody to ruin a 2,5lt Grand Cherokee motor by fooling around. > > No, nor any motor. > > >Water, as you«ve mentioned, can bring some benefits in combustion, and often > >in chimeneys in industries (for example, when burning hydrocarbons) steam is > >injected into the flame area to produce a cleaner combustion. I don«t quite > >understand how, but it supposedly does. > > > >In a motor, excess water is said to be a probable cause of rust, and > >water-traps do exist in diesel engines for some reason. > > Free water in dinodiesel is one thing, an emulsified water-dino blend > seems to be another, and dissolved water in biod should be more like > the blend (with its advantages). At least I think so. More in my > other message on this. > > >I«m not quite > >familiar wth the related problems, and I«ve found Camillo Holecek«s quote > >most interesting. I«ll try to dig into the subject a bit more. > > Why not ask Camillo? He's head of Energea in Austria. Here's his address: > "Camillo Holecek" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >LAB RESULTS were as followed: > > > >Flash Point: Above 118¼C (ASTM PS121 specifies higher than 100¼C, so I > >didn«t go much further) > > The new ASTM D-6751 standard specifies 130 deg C, I don't know why. > Germany and Czech specify 110, all others 100. Maybe it's all just > politics, the rapeseed vs soy game. > > >Kinematic Viscosity @ 40¼C: 3.654 cSt > >Density: 0.8797 g/cm3 > >Corrosion: (heating to 100¼C over half an hour with inmersed metal strips) > > Aluminum Strip: Slight change in opacity, barely noticeable. > > Copper strip: No observed change > > Tin strip: No observed change > > Iron strip: No observed change > >Cloud Point: 9¼C to 10¼C > >Pour Point: -4.7¼C > >Carbon Residue: 0.0711% (ASTM D189) > >Water & Sediment: 1000-2000 ppm > > Cloud point and pour point a bit high, everything else is just fine. > And the water probably fits in with what Camillo says. > > Well done Christian. It's great we can make good fuel like this eh? > No need to be Exxon-Mobil! > > >IR Spectrometry: I sent it in attached to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Thankyou, received. > > All best > > Keith > > >Best wishes, > > > >Christian > > > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Keith Addison" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >To: <biofuel@yahoogroups.com> > >Sent: Saturday, June 08, 2002 7:00 AM > >Subject: Re: [biofuel] water > > > > > > > Hi Christian > > > > > > Well, it's interesting. Do those maximums for water content in the > > > standards make any sense? Will water in the fuel damage the engine? > > > > > > First, this is what Camillo Holecek said about it recently: > > > > > > "The Austrian Standard ONORM C 1191 said only: "No water should > > > settle out" (i.e. about 1200ppm water would stay in solution in our > > > FAME.) All others bother about 500 and even 300 ppm (DIN), which is > > > nonsense IMO, as FAME is hygroscopic and will attract humidity from > > > air until it is back to 1200ppm. Means, in your car you will have > > > anything but 300ppm." (FAME being Fatty Acid Methyl Esters, ie > > > biodiesel.) > > > > > > Meanwhile quite a lot of people are trying to figure ways of getting > > > MORE water into the fuel. See this, for instance: > > > http://archive.nnytech.net/index.php?view=835&list=BIOFUELS-BIZ > > > > > > Also this: > > > http://www.epa.gov/otaq/models/analysis/emulsion/emulbibl.pdf > > > > > > And this: > > > http://www.aquamist.co.uk/dc/reference/refer.html > > > > > > There seem to be combustion efficiency gains (with misters into the > > > air intake) and emissions reductions (with fuel emulsions), but I > > > can't figure which is better and why you wouldn't get both effects > > > either way. What's the difference between a water mist injected with > > > the air vs water in the fuel that gets misted anyway when it's > > > injected with the rest of the fuel? > > > > > > Anway, until we settle it one way or the other, if ever, maybe don't > > > worry too much about a little excess water. I'm really not sure at > > > this stage whether that's good advice or not though. What d you think? > > > > > > Christian, what were your lab results, if you don't mind telling us? > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > Keith > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Hi all. > > > > > > > >I ran some lab tests on my BD (from M. Pelly«s recipe), including IR > > > >spectrometry, Flash point, Pour point, Cloud point, Density, > > > >Viscosity, Residual Carbon and free water & sediment. > > > > > > > >My findings showed quite a good BD, except for the water. > > > > > > > >ASTM requires 0,05 % vol max of water. I bubble washed my BD, > > > >following the Univ. of Idaho«s method, and it seems that my level of > > > >fre water whent up to a value of roughly 0.2% (4 times more than > > > >required by ASTM). > > > > > > > >I will further treat the BD with anhydrous CaCl2 (calcium chloride), > > > >though the lab technician also suggested I should use a saturated > > > >solution of sodium chloride (tablesalt... i.e., brine) to wash the > > > >BD. He said that this would reduce the presence of water in the > > > >washed BD. > > > > > > > >The point is: take care with the bubble washes and water washes in > > > >general. Maybe I was just unlucky, but you should try to check the > > > >content of water in your BD as the presence of it could be harmful > > > >to the motor. I«ve heard some people use pure methanol directly to > > > >get a BD pure enough to use without washing... (I don«t know how > > > >good this might be). My BD was very transparent. Even more > > > >crystaline than diesel fuel bought from my near by gas station. > > > > > > > >Comments welcome. > > > > > > > >Regards, > > > > > > > >Christian > > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > > Biofuels list archives: > http://archive.nnytech.net/ > > Please do NOT send "unsubscribe" messages to the list address. > To unsubscribe, send an email to: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > ______________________________________________________________________________ mensaje enviado desde http://www.iespana.es emails (pop)-paginas web (espacio ilimitado)-agenda-favoritos (bookmarks)-foros -Chat Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send "unsubscribe" messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! 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