murdoch wrote: > > > Stopped at a 76 station on route 5 today midway between LA and San > > > Francisco and noticed a sign on the pump reading that the fuel "may" > > > contain ethanol. Can't recall but it may have been phrased almost as > > > though it were a warning, though not as harsh as the MTBE warnings you > > > see. Anyway, I don't see these signs yet in So.Cal. but I'll keep > > > looking. Re-examination of the ethanol stories shows Philips as one > > > of the companies going somewhat ethanol, so that makes sense. Don't > > > know the reason for the ambivalent "may contain" though. I wonder if > > > they'd just be using it as an octane enhancer or something.
James wrote: > > A few stations over here in Australia are trying the same thing....beware > > ethanol contains water and water it down they do. > > Honestly it is very bad for any vehicle and should only be used in > > emergencies with octane boosters. > > By the way has anyone seen or collected any info on structure and > > build-designs of ceramic engines? murdoch wrote: > As it happens, I filled up with 91 Octane instead of 87 or 89. Really > a 1 in 100 choice on my part. Usually I choose 87 without thinking. > But I once read a discussion of the Midwest U.S. that said that even > there sometimes the only ethanol is in the 91. So, maybe mine did > contain ethanol. If so, it's hard to pronounce if there were problems > associated with it, as my car is experiencing a problem with > over-heating in traffic. > > I'm sure I'm misinformed on a couple of points, but it sure was nice > to see that it might be in my tank, given the battle that has occurred > to get it in there. Now, what's this about it being bad for my car? > Are you saying generally bad, or only when there's too much water, or what? MH wrote: Alcohol tends to cool engine combustion so I've read. It may also clean fuel systems requiring fuel filter replacement. Its my hope your radiator fan is running properly and coolant level is adequate unless your thermostat is going. The only times I've experienced trouble with E-10 ethanol blended gasoline rated at 89 octane was several years ago when a notorious large chain of gasoline stations lost credibility with it clientele offering discounts per gallon to makeup market share only to change their marquee. Their was also a French chain that left me weary of their formulations. This was just before Minnesota was talking about transitioning to ethanol blends state wide 8-( My vehicle experienced hesitant power loses when excelerating and on occasion difficulty starting engine which required more alcohol in the tank and me jumping on the rear bumper to agitate mixture. Ten, fifteen minutes later my Stanley steamer headed down the road over the hills with the fuel sloshing about continuing where I left off. Other service station chains in Minnesota and Iowa had provided reliable service using E-10 ethanol blends and I haven't needed HEAT (methanol) or Isopropyl alcohols. ============ Fast Facts About Ethanol Below-zero wind chills and fluctuating temperatures make ethanol-blended fuels the best choice for motorists during the winter months. When temperature varies, it causes moisture in the air to condense on the inside of fuel tanks and lines. Water in the fuel tank and lines can freeze, causing cars and trucks to stall or not start. These conditions can be avoided by using fuels containing ethanol. Ethanol attracts water in the fuel system, mixes with it, and carries it through the system with the fuel. This makes ethanol an excellent gas line antifreeze, eliminating the need to pay extra for an expensive over-the-counter product. Most small engine manufacturers have recognized the value of ethanol for years. Ethanol is safe for use in snowmobiles. Ethanol is safe for use in motorboats. http://www.iowacorn.org/cip_fastfacts.htm ============ Questions and Answers about Water Contamination and Gasoline/Ethanol Blends Minnesota, USA - Weights & Measures Petroleum Q: Is water contamination in gasoline a big problem in Minnesota? Q: How do you know if there is water in a station's gasoline? Q. If water might not be detected, what prevents station owners from "watering down" their gasoline/ethanol blends? Q: If station operators do not intentionally water down their product, how does water get into a station's storage tank? Q: If ethanol absorbs water, how can you have water contamination in a gasoline/ethanol blend? Q: What happens if people buy phase-separated gasoline? Q: Will everyone who buys phase-separated gasoline experience car problems? Q: How does a station operator remove the water from a phase-separated blend? Q: What should I do if I suspect I have purchased water contaminated gas? http://www.commerce.state.mn.us/pages/WeightMeasure/WMGasContam.htm ============ Gas/Ethanol Fuels: Tank Up! by Bob Hoffmann, from the March 2001 Newsletter Moscow Food Co-op Moscow, Idaho It irked me immediately when I saw it. Perhaps youāve seen it as well: The sign in front of a local Chevron station that read "Prevent expensive engine repairs; buy ethanol-free fuels here." When I lived in Ohio, I usually filled my gas tank with 10% ethanol blends, and had never had a problem with them. I also liked the fact that my fuel dollars helped feed the farmers who grew the corn from which ethanol was distilled. Gasoline mixed with ethanol produces less carbon monoxide and smog compared to straight gas. Finally, since ethanol is produced domestically, and much of our petroleum supply comes from abroad, I was buying locally, so to speak, reducing the trade deficit, and keeping oil rigs out of environmentally sensitive areas. So when I saw the ethanol-disparaging sign, I stopped my petroleum-consuming means of conveyance at the nearest parking spot and walked in to see Marc, the station owner. Yes, he was responsible for the sign. Yes, he claimed, ethanol-blended fuels could damage vehicle engines. -----snip----- I then contacted the American Coalition for Ethanol (http://www.ethanol.org/) and spoke with Trevor Guthmiller. He said that ethanol, besides being an alcohol, could be characterized as a detergent. It can loosen carbon deposits, particularly in older vehicles, but since many fuels now contain detergents, this effect is not unique to ethanol. He was very firm that this would not damage engines. "The fuel filter will capture any loose carbon deposits, so if you switch from leaded gasoline to a detergent fuel, you will eventually have to change your fuel filter." What about ethanolās water-absorbing capabilities? Continued @ http://www.moscowfoodcoop.com/archive/ethanol.html ============ Ethanol NEWTON'S APPLE In addition to being a renewable fuel, ethanol helps to reduce air pollution. When anything burns in air, molecules of that substance combine with oxygen. Gasoline is a substance made of carbon and hydrogen. When it burns, some, but not all, of the carbon atoms combine with oxygen to make carbon dioxide(CO2). Hydrogen in the gasoline combines with more of the air's oxygen to make water (H2O). There isn't enough oxygen left to combine with the remaining carbon atoms. Deadly carbon monoxide gas (CO) is the result. Like gasoline, ethanol is made of carbon and hydrogen, but in addition it contains its own supply of oxygen. When ethanol burns with gasoline, its "extra" oxygen atoms combine with the "extra" carbon atoms to reduce or even eliminate CO in the exhaust gases. http://www.pbs.org/ktca/newtons/14/ethanol12.html ============ National Ethanol Vehicle Coalition Updated E85 Guidebook Release "Handbook for Handling, Storing, and Dispensing E85" April 2002 http://www.e85fuel.com/news/guidebook_release.htm ============ Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send "unsubscribe" messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
