I suppose I use the word "aesthetics" in the broadest all inclusive
sense,
not just as applied to art, but every way we sense anything. Is'nt that
what this is all about?
mando
On Feb 28, 2010, at 5:15 PM, Boris Shoshensky wrote:
I have few problems with clarity of some points in this post,
required in
philosophical exchange of thoughts.
Pleasures coming from nonart sex or eating ice cream have nothing
to do with
aesthetic, because it has no beauty elements present in sensed
nature of
nonart or any productive design of Man - art.
Regarding C.J. Ducasse's in his book "The Philosophy of Art"
assertion that
the experience occasioned by witnessing a drama is not aesthetic at
all. The
problem with this statement is that there is no
clarification if drama is from regular life event or presented in
the work of
art. We can see, even in many life dramas, some elements used in
potential
artwork developed by aesthetically inclined imagination.
Boris Shoshensky
---------- Original Message ----------
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: "What is happening during an 'a.e.'?"
Date: Sun, 28 Feb 2010 16:25:19 EST
William writes:
"Cheerskep's quest for a reductive description of the aesthetic
experience
that always applies, both to him and all others, is a vain one
since it
excludes the subjective and is, in fact, a search for that which he
denies, a
mind independent phenomena."
I wouldn't describe my quest that way. The phrase "the description
of the
aesthetic experience that always applies, both to him and all others "
suggests things I don't believe.
Much of what I've said in the past few days has been intended to
convey
that I see immense variations in the sorts of experiences that I
and others
would call "aesthetic". They vary in several ways.
For one, many objects and events occasion a.e.'s in others but not
in me,
and vice versa.
For another, there is great variety in those experiences of mine
that I
have, perhaps too loosely, called "aesthetic". They vary so greatly
- by
genre,
for example - it's questionable how long I could defend calling
them all by
the same name. For example, I mentioned earlier on the forum that C.J.
Ducasse in his book "The Philosophy of Art" asserts that the
experience
occasioned by witnessing a drama is not aesthetic at all; it's
vicarious.
And in the past week I've been pondering the degrees of difference
in what
I've called the cerebral and the visceral character of an a.e.. I
grant the
distinction there may be questioned, but I entertain it because,
say, when I
get a back rub or have an orgasm, the experience feels generically
different from when I do a mathematical problem or construct a
syntactically
tricky
sentence.
Somewhat similarly, the a.e. that I get from DeBussy and the a.e. from
reading a Shakespeare sonnet differ -- though (so far) not so much
that I
shrink
from calling them both a.e.'s. Perhaps the distinction most of us
entertain
between a passive and an active experience applies.
This has always been one of the values of the forum: It gives us a
chance
to put forth an inchoate, far-from-thought-out idea to see if it
can survive
the pressures of criticism at all, and if so how it can be improved.
Ideally, though, we who criticize should keep this in mind: Most
ideas are
multiplex; we should try to discern not just their fatal flaws but the
aspects, if
any, that are worthy. There's a part of me that wishes Obama in his
meeting
with the Republicans about the health care bill had started out by
asking the
others in the room what in the proposed bill they approve of. I
became
suspicious before the meeting when I heard opponents insist that
the whole
thing be thrown out.
An entirely different reason why I'm not looking for "the
description of
the aesthetic experience that always applies, both to him and all
others " is
touched on by my earlier postings on the forum about the IIMT
nature of
notion: all notion is indeterminate, indefinite, multiplex and
transitory.
Not
only are the chances nil of my perfectly replicating in my mind the
experience in anyone else's mind, it's doubtful that I could ever
summon a
perfect
replica of a notion that I myself had at some time in the past.
For all that, there seem to be sui generis elements common to many of
experiences we call "aesthetic". What? What's going on?
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