Just so we’re comparing apples to apples, Aviat’s values are typical.
Guaranteed values over time are 2 dB less power and 2 dB less threshold, or
4 dB less system gain.

On Wed, Jan 15, 2020 at 2:05 PM Darin Steffl <darin.ste...@mnwifi.com>
wrote:

> Just to clarify on the aviat advanced replacement, that does not come
> standard? I have access to their pricing tool and a 2 year standard
> warranty is included but it does not include advanced replacement unless
> you upgrade to that option. It's very affordable from what I saw.
>
> We are likely going to deploy 6 links of the wtm4200 this spring.
>
> On Wed, Jan 15, 2020, 12:35 PM Mathew Howard <mhoward...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Yeah, xmt power looks pretty impressive on the Aviat radios. It also
>> looks like the receive sensitivity is a couple db better than the PTP820C
>> at any given modulation.
>>
>> On Wed, Jan 15, 2020 at 12:24 PM Ken Hohhof <af...@kwisp.com> wrote:
>>
>>> 25.5 dBm xmt power at 4096QAM is pretty impressive.  I remember several
>>> years ago some talk of chipsets would use some sort of predistortion
>>> technique to cancel out the distortion in the power amp, is that what is
>>> going on in these radios?  I don’t remember who the chip vendor was.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> *On Behalf Of *Adair Winter
>>> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 15, 2020 12:15 PM
>>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com>
>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Licensed radios
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> and we found that the WTM4200 has 5.5db more system gain then the SIAE
>>> AP2 at 4096QAM which had better system gain then some of the other radios
>>> on the market.
>>>
>>> SIAE questions if Aviat is reporting correct numbers but I don't think
>>> they are incorrect either....
>>>
>>> Even if Aviat's numbers are a bit exaggerated and there was only a 3db
>>> difference that's still a whole antennas size!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Jan 15, 2020 at 12:12 PM Tim Hardy <thardy...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Yes, as I mentioned previously the system gain of the WTM 4200 at 80 MHz
>>> bandwidth, 4096 QAM is 77.5 dBm (threshold is -52.0 dBm and tx power is
>>> 25.5 dBm).  This provides 7.5 dB more fade margin than the AF-11 at 80 MHz
>>> bandwidth, 1024 QAM (system gain 70.5 dBm, threshold -52.5 dBm and tx power
>>> is 18.0 dBm)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jan 15, 2020, at 12:58 PM, Mathew Howard <mhoward...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Based on the required signal levels listed in Aviat's spec sheets, it
>>> shouldn't be that hard to achieve 4096QAM. I don't remember what the
>>> numbers were off hand, but it was well within what I would expect on a real
>>> world link.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Jan 15, 2020 at 9:59 AM Ken Hohhof <af...@kwisp.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Just to be clear, the links are actually running at 4096QAM?  That’s
>>> pretty impressive.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> But is it like saying you own a 250 mph car?  It may be true, but you
>>> also may not be able to verify it from personal experience.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> *On Behalf Of *Adair Winter
>>> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 15, 2020 9:46 AM
>>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com>
>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Licensed radios
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hell ya we do, we have three 4096 QAM links running and about to add one
>>> more.
>>>
>>> It's the only way to go
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Jan 15, 2020 at 9:43 AM Ken Hohhof <af...@kwisp.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> You have actual links running 4096QAM IRL?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I thought it was more like being able to land a quadruple axel.  Once.
>>> In practice.  OK, define “land”.  Walk away?  Able to skate again once the
>>> cast comes off?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> But I have to admit my view of licensed backhaul capacity has evolved as
>>> video streaming has come to dominate the Internet.  Once I thought the only
>>> number that mattered was the 5 nines throughput, or worst case 4 nines.
>>> But customers stream 24x7 and will raise a much bigger fuss over
>>> most-of-the-time speed than over the occasional drop in capacity or even
>>> outage.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Still, even on 2048QAM radios, actually getting 2048QAM seems like
>>> hitting all green lights on the way to work.  It’s nice, but you don’t bet
>>> your life on it, or cry when you see the modulation drop to 1024QAM for no
>>> apparent reason.  Or 256 or 512 during heavy rain.  Maybe if you have all
>>> really short links.  We are rural and don’t have that luxury.  Most of our
>>> links are 6-10 miles.  And given that our climate future seems to look like
>>> Waterworld, rain cannot be ignored.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> *On Behalf Of *Andreas Wiatowski
>>> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 15, 2020 8:05 AM
>>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com>
>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Licensed radios
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I find the Aviat radios easier to configure…but the Cambium/Ceragon is
>>> more of a mature platform. Aviat however does 4096QAM.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> <image001.jpg>
>>>
>>> *Internet.**​*
>>> *​*
>>> *Phone.**​**TV.*
>>>
>>> *Andreas Wiatowski*
>>>
>>> CEO/Founder
>>>
>>> Silo
>>>
>>> *1-866-727-4138, ext 600* <1-866-727-4138,%20ext%20600>
>>>
>>>  |
>>>
>>> *andr...@silo.ca* <andr...@silo.ca>
>>>
>>> *silo.ca* <http://www.silo.ca/>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> <image002.png>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> <image003.png>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> <image004.png>
>>>
>>> *From: *AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> on behalf of Gino Villarini <
>>> g...@aeronetpr.com>
>>> *Reply-To: *AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com>
>>> *Date: *Wednesday, January 15, 2020 at 4:31 AM
>>> *To: *AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com>
>>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Licensed radios
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> [EXTERNAL]
>>>
>>> Right… yeah mind f*** the 820c is a dual core radio… the Bridgewave and
>>> Aviat radios that do this are single core… so less $$$
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From: *AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> on behalf of Erich Kaiser <
>>> er...@northcentraltower.com>
>>> *Reply-To: *AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com>
>>> *Date: *Wednesday, January 15, 2020 at 5:16 AM
>>> *To: *AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com>
>>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Licensed radios
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> No you can do ACCP on one unit, you just need a combiner that they sell
>>> that goes between the dish and radio.  Non-Adjacent channels could be an
>>> option with two radios but probably would do it with two PTP820S and a
>>> combiner.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Erich Kaiser
>>>
>>> North Central Tower
>>>
>>> er...@northcentraltower.com
>>>
>>> Office: 815-570-3101
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Jan 15, 2020 at 2:39 AM Gino A. Villarini <g...@aeronetpr.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Don’t you need an extra radio for this on the 820C?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *Gino** Villarini *
>>> Founder/President
>>> @gvillarini
>>> t: 787.273.4143 Ext. 204
>>> m:
>>>
>>>   <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>>   <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>>   <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>>   <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>>   <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>> www.aeronetpr.com | Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, PR 00968
>>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From: AF <af-boun...@af.afmug.com> on behalf of Erich Kaiser
>>> <er...@northcentraltower.com>Reply-To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>>> <af@af.afmug.com>Date: Wednesday, January 15, 2020 at 2:49 AMTo: AnimalFarm
>>> Microwave Users Group <af@af.afmug.com>Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Licensed radios
>>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>*
>>>
>>>   <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>> PTP820C does this its called ACCP. <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>>   <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>>
>>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>> Erich Kaiser <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>> North Central Tower <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>> er...@northcentraltower.com <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>> Office: 815-570-3101 <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>>   <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>>   <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>>   <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>>   <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jan 14, 2020 at 4:17 PM SmarterBroadband <li...@sbb.net> wrote:
>>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>> Hi <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>>   <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>> The BridgeWave Navigator states it can have more than 2x80 channels on
>>> one dual core radio, however the extra channels have to be adjacent.
>>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>>   <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>> Do any other vendors do this in 11 and 18GHz Today (no vaporware).
>>> And do any have non-adjacent channels? <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>>   <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>> Thanks <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>>   <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>> Adam <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
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>>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>>
>>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>>   <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>> -- <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>> Adair Winter
>>> VP, Network Operations / Co-Owner
>>> Amarillo Wireless | 806.316.5071
>>> C: 806.231.7180
>>> http://www.amarillowireless.net
>>> <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
>>>   <http://www.aeronetpr.com/>
>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Adair Winter
>>> VP, Network Operations / Co-Owner
>>> Amarillo Wireless | 806.316.5071
>>> C: 806.231.7180
>>> http://www.amarillowireless.net
>>> <http://www.amarillowireless.net>
>>>
>>>
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