Steve, Dorian,
DORIAN> . In addition, the first prototype does not need to be entirely analog. I entirely agree, actually we have no other choice. I feel fully obliged to respond in extent, but my time is limited. For now, here is what I propose. The goal of demonstrating the capabilites of analogs is highly desirable but will have to wait a little. A more modest goal needs to be set, and this would be to simulate an analog on a PC and use it to demonstrate how self-organization would work on an analog. A paper can be published comparing the PC with an equivalent analog. My own immediate plans include doing just that, perhaps with a simple problem of OO analysis or image recognition. I have already the algorithm, fresh from the owen, and will write software for it soon. If you want, you can do the same thing on your PC, I can help (you must be a good programmer), the advantage for you being that you will end up having your own platform. Ben, I am not sure if you are aware that algorithms that halt are causets. The relations between variables in any algorithm satisfies the same conditions postulated in the definition of causets. What this tells me, is that causets are a better way of describing the world than algorithms. Because everything in the world will halt. So causets turn the halting problem on its head. Do we really need algorithms at all, and paying the price of introducing the halting problem? Comments? Sergio From: Dorian Aur [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2012 4:38 PM To: AGI Subject: Re: [agi] Analog Computation In addition, the first prototype does not need to be entirely analog. Steve's terms of "weak AGI" and "strong AGI" make sense in this context, he is making history . Indeed, the "weak AGI" framework does not seem to move far from current AI, it is limited by: (i) the Turing framework; (ii) fairly good math components added on a distorted interpretation of experimental data - many biological misconceptions - digital spike, the connectionist paradigm - everything is between neurons -- completely untrue! Dorian On Tue, Jul 10, 2012 at 1:49 PM, Sergio Pissanetzky <[email protected]> wrote: Steve, you are not alone. How big can one go with an FPGA that is currently available? 1K? 10K? 10K would already be nearing some practical applications with EI, but 100K would be better. I am thinking EI because I am sure that, if EI can be demonstrated for example in image recognition, then it would attract attention immediately, including the chip makers. "General computation" is too vague. Or, better, I propose to start "general computation" with EI, then one could expand. Also, personally I believe this would be "hyper-Turing" but I would be very careful with that term because there is too mych hype about it. Ben has strong reasons why it is better not to use the term for now. I am very happy that such things can be calculated, and there is plenty of time to find out if they are hyper or not. Do you do these things? Do you build analogs from components? I don't have any money, but just saying. Sergio From: Steve Richfield [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2012 2:48 PM To: AGI Subject: Re: [agi] Analog Computation Sergio, On Tue, Jul 10, 2012 at 12:30 PM, Sergio Pissanetzky <[email protected]> wrote: how do you do millions with analogs? The technology is well known and would be fairly easy to build, but the chips aren't (yet) available because there is no market (yet) for them!!! This is obviously a chicken-or-egg problem. Basically, you would build it just like an FPGA, where the interconnections are made with programmed transmission gates. However, instead of switching logic gates, you would be switching integrators and other analog building blocks. Note that people have already done this, but switched "artificial neuron synapses" instead of more general purpose analog building blocks. Such a device attached to a PC as an outboard processor could enable really general purpose hyper-Turing computation at pretty much full unhindered speeds. I see the promise here, but so far I seem to stand alone in this. 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