A paper which may be of interest to the pure linguists, or anyone
looking for information about cross modal referencing.
http://www.sv.uit.no/seksjon/psyk/pdf/laeng/Laeng&Teodorescu.pdf
It might be possible in theory to construct an intelligence comprised
only of linguistic concepts, but such an intelligence would be
unlikely to be very human-like.
2008/4/24 Mark Waser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
>
> >> Do you really think a purely verbal processor can stay with all that?
>
> Yes, Mike. A number of us believe exactly that. The fact that you don't
> have the knowledge or experience to see how it might be possible is not
> equivalent to an argument that it is not possible.
>
> Further, you keep bringing up your guesses and uninformed *opinions* like
> "And I think that actually IS how language and the brain works. It's
> basically a movie editor. " and insisting on treating them as if they are
> scientific fact despite ample scientific evidence to the contrary.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: Mike Tintner
> To: agi@v2.listbox.com
>
> Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2008 12:01 AM
> Subject: Re: [agi] Why Symbolic Representation P.S.
>
>
>
>
>
> Stephen,
>
> Fighting comeback :). But then how do you get from "hell" etc to people
> patting him etc to his walking achingly to a dressing-room to discarding
> bits of "apparatus" to "a tie-up" to "clamping down on a water bottle" to "
> A camera zooming in.." to him looking like a movie character (& why, if
> you've seen the movie, will you & I probably remember the same shot, that
> we've never heard talked about), to understanding what "a replay showing on
> his face etc.." means?
>
> It is an awesomely difficult passage if you're trying to process it. And the
> reason I'm dwelling on it, is because it's so fascinating - it actually
> barely illustrates my particular, earlier point re movement trajectories
> (though that is still valid).
>
> If you really want to understand how language works - that's a movie scene,
> with changing shots and POV's, being put together from, in some cases,
> purely visual, movie sequences in memory (including The Long Good Friday
> final scene). And I think that actually IS how language and the brain works.
> It's basically a movie editor. (Even when you think you're doing nothing
> else but looking at a symbolic equation, "2 + 2 =4" it's still being
> projected on the movie screen of your consciousness, as Damasio insists).
>
> The syntax of those sentences is the same syntax that binds this sequence
> together:
>
> http://faculty.cua.edu/johnsong/hitchcock/pages/stills-NxNW/UN3.html
>
> And it's the same syntax that will probably allow your brain to understand a
> set of non-sentences like:
>
> "Morning. Frozen breath. Train. Boring Mondays. Crowds surging. Doors
> clattering. Sitting down. Newspapers rustling."
>
> Do you really think a purely verbal processor can stay with all that?
>
>
>
> Hi Mike,
>
>
> "John Arne Riise stood doubled over in his tiny corner of football hell."
>
> These sentences are great demonstrations of why I favor a construction
> grammar. It's not necessary to process the imagery from first principles.
> These sentences are full of idioms that can be simply treated as
> constructions (i.e. form <--> meaning pairs).
>
>
> doubled over -- from WordNet: bent over or curled up, usually with laughter
> or pain
> corner of X hell -- a very uncomfortable situation involving X
> tiny corner of X hell -- very uncomfortable situation involving X in which
> the agent (i.e. John Arne Riise) does not share the situation with anyone
> else...and so forth for the rest of the passage. The downside of
> construction grammar is lots of constructions. But human children learn
> them, by being taught and by observation / induction , so I think a dialog
> system can too.
>
> This sort of text by the way, long ago put an end to the Cyc Project's then
> ambition to read and comprehend an article in a newspaper. Texai may fail
> also, but certainly not in the same way Cyc did.
>
>
> -Steve
>
> Stephen L. Reed
>
>
> Artificial Intelligence Researcher
> http://texai.org/blog
> http://texai.org
> 3008 Oak Crest Ave.
> Austin, Texas, USA 78704
> 512.791.7860
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Mike Tintner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: agi@v2.listbox.com
> Sent: Wednesday, April 23, 2008 8:07:13 PM
> Subject: Re: [agi] Why Symbolic Representation P.S.
>
> Abram,
>
> Just to illustrate further, here's the opening lines of today's Times sports
> report on a football match.[Liverpool v Chelsea] How on earth could this be
> understood without massive imaginative simulation? [Stephen?] And without
> mainly imaginative memories of football matches?
>
> "John Arne Riise stood doubled over in his tiny corner of football hell.
> Agony engulfed him. One by one, teammates offered a pat on the back, a
> handshake, or just a touch, some form of human contact to show they cared.
> None of it did much good. He walked, step by aching step, to the sanctuary
> of the dressing-room, discarding bits of the apparatus of the professional
> footballer as he went. A tie-up here, a shin pad there.
>
> He clamped down on his water bottle and held it between his teeth, like a
> bit to stop him gnawing through his bottom lip. A camera zoomed in to show
> muscles around his eyes and mouth tensing as his mind worked overtime. He
> looked like Harold Shand being driven to his execution in the final scenes
> of The Long Good Friday. A replay of every mistake he had made to get there
> was showing on his face."
>
>
> -------------------------------------------
> agi
> Archives: http://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now
> RSS Feed: http://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/
> Modify Your Subscription: http://www.listbox.com/member/?&;
> Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com
>
>
> ________________________________
> Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it
> now.
> ________________________________
>
> agi | Archives | Modify Your Subscription
>
> ________________________________
>
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG.
> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.23.3/1393 - Release Date: 4/23/2008
> 8:12 AM
>
> ________________________________
>
> agi | Archives | Modify Your Subscription
>
> ________________________________
>
> agi | Archives | Modify Your Subscription
-------------------------------------------
agi
Archives: http://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now
RSS Feed: http://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/
Modify Your Subscription:
http://www.listbox.com/member/?member_id=8660244&id_secret=101455710-f059c4
Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com
