David, There must be a fair amount of cog sci/AI analysis of all this - of how the brain analyses and remembers tunes - and presumably leading theories (as for vision). Do you or anyone know more here?
Also, you have noted something of extreme importance, wh. is a lot more than "a step further". OTOH you've been analysing how we recognize the same, general tune in different, individual renditions. OTOH you've pointed out, we also recognize the INDIVIDUAL differences of/variatiions on the same genre/class - we appreciate the different ways Davis/Gillespie play as well as that they're playing the same tune. Now correct me but isn't the individual dimension of images of all kinds, almost entirely missing from AI? The capacity to recognize what makes individuals of a species individual, and not just that they belong to the same species. Isn't visual object recognition for example almost entirely focussed on recognizing general objects rather than individual objects - that that's an example of a general doll, rather than an individual particularly beaten up, or just slightly and disturbingly altered doll? No doubt AI can recognize individual fingerprints, but it's the capacity to recognize individuals as variations on the general - to recognize that he has a particularly sarcastic smile, or she has a particularly lyrical, fluid walk, or that that tune contrasts harmonious and discordant music (as per rap) in a distinctive way - that's missing, no? From: David Butler Sent: Monday, July 26, 2010 3:44 PM To: agi Subject: Re: [agi] How do we hear music When we listen to music there are many elements that come into play that create our memory of how the song goes. If you take a piece of instrumental music, you have the melody, a succession of tones in a certain order, duration of each note in the melody, timbre, or tonal quality, (guitar vs trombone), time, how fast the song is played. Phrasing, what part of the melody is emphasized using volume, change of tone quality etc... Is the melody played slurred with all the notes run together or staccato played with short notes. Too take it a step further how do we recognize a solo played by Miles Davis rather than Dizzy Gillespie playing the same song both on trumpet but sound completely different in style. How do we recognize when two different conductors direct the same music with the same orchestra but yet make it sound different? . On Thu, Jul 22, 2010 at 3:05 PM, Matt Mahoney <[email protected]> wrote: deepakjnath wrote: > Why do we listen to a song sung in different scale and yet identify it as the same song.? Does it have something to do with the fundamental way in which we store memory? For the same reason that gray looks green on a red background. You have more neurons that respond to differences in tones than to absolute frequencies. -- Matt Mahoney, [email protected] ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ From: deepakjnath <[email protected]> To: agi <[email protected]> Sent: Thu, July 22, 2010 3:59:57 PM Subject: [agi] How do we hear music Why do we listen to a song sung in different scale and yet identify it as the same song.? Does it have something to do with the fundamental way in which we store memory? cheers, Deepak agi | Archives | Modify Your Subscription agi | Archives | Modify Your Subscription agi | Archives | Modify Your Subscription ------------------------------------------- agi Archives: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/303/=now RSS Feed: https://www.listbox.com/member/archive/rss/303/ Modify Your Subscription: https://www.listbox.com/member/?member_id=8660244&id_secret=8660244-6e7fb59c Powered by Listbox: http://www.listbox.com
