No need for apologies as this discussion is perhaps one of the best we've had for a while though its probably going off topic a little bit as good discussions can some times to. A good Android Media player with accessibility or that could be made accessible is highly desireable but as yet no one has put their finger on where we may find one so - as I've said - the whole idea would just seem a waste of time which is unfortunate.
-----Original Message----- From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Aman Singer Sent: Monday, 11 June 2018 4:46 AM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [all-audio] Portable media players with android. Hi Dane and all, I apologise if I came across as taking sides in the annoying war between Android and iOS. I have no loyalty to any technology or company, I use both systems and dislike both. I would respectfully say that Apple's accessibility has not so much taken steps backwards but, and I particularly refer to braille, jumped backwards over the edge of a cliff. I also agree with you, Google has come a long way in terms of access. However, they had a very long way to go to bring their accessibility to a usable state. The old example, of a student who scored ten percent and then scored sixty percent three months later is relevant. Yes, he has come a long way, but he's still not a good student. Google is very much in that position. You're quite right to say that many of the issues are usability ones and have workarounds, but I have reached the point where I wonder why blind users are supposed to suffer through using workarounds if other people don't. I may also say that for those of us with hearing impairments a good many of Google's workarounds simply don't work. To get back to media players, I understand the perfectly reasonable desire for decent sound for those who can benefit from it. I share the desire for physical controls. I would be tempted, though, to focus on sound production and physical controls on their own. Keep in mind that, with tasker and autoinput, you can even use a wired keypad to provide physical controls to a device with USB OTG. You need not use Bluetooth. As I said, it may also be possible to use a USB device with a DAC to produce better sound than whatever manufacturers of phones/tablets start with. Finally, if your desire is for physical controls and better sound reproduction, it may be worth looking at the single board machines we discussed here earlier. These can often run Linux and support for physical controls and DACs is more developed on that platform than on Android. Basically, I'm suggesting that, besides the many detriments you list below, Dane, there are no, or at least not many, benefits to using a specialized Android media player. In most cases, any benefits can be obtained more easily in a different way. Aman To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [all-audio] Portable media players with android. Es you may say so <smile> >From the start of this thread I’ve been emphasising that accessibility for >Android Media Players just isn’t on the radar for several reasons. Firstly Android is absolutely open to developers thus they can use whatever version of Android they like and customise Android to what suits their product thus its more than likely that portable Media Players will be running say Android 3 or earlier. Android 3 was pretty awful when it came to accessibility and nothing much really happened with accessibility until Android 5 when things improved out of sight - just my opinion through experience -. Secondly with Media Players who knows what sort of interface you’re going to get, a touch screen? A wheel that just keeps spinning? A control strip? This obviously complicates accessibility even further. And third who knows with a Media Player if you’re able to install extra Apps which you may need to do to make the player accessible. Some Media Players lend themselves to further customisation whereas others are closed. Some have processors that just aren’t powerful enough to handle too many extra Apps or have a limited amount of RAM. So here we are back at point A again, looking for that accessible portable music player with Android could be a huge waste of time unless you know of some specific machine that’s running preferably the latest version of Android, that has quite a bit of RAM - 1GB at the very minimum I’d reckon - and has or will allow you to go to the Google Play store or give you access to the system to install Google Talkback. Does this sound like a Mobile Phone or tablet? As far as Google and accessibility? Well nothing is perfect and I’m not defending Google over anyone else. Some may argue that Apple with accessibility may have gone backwards with IOS but that’s another discussion for another list perhaps. I believe that Google have come a long way with Android to the point where its certainly good enough for use with the general public. Yes like everything else there are a few issues but they’re usability more than accessibility and there are workarounds. > On 10 Jun 2018, at 6:36 am, Aman Singer <[email protected]> wrote: > > Hi Dane and all, > > There is, if I may say so, a deep problem with Android accessibility, > in my view. First, Google is obviously running this as a boxchecking > exercise, and that lack of interest spreads throughout all Android products. > There are, of course, devices which are better than others in accessibility, > but even the best aren't as accessible as they could be, and there are some > which are absolutely hopeless. I suspect, as I think you do, that some of the > media players will be the hopeless ones. One of the saddest accessibility > stories in the past thirty years, for the blind and deafblind at least, has > been Android. There was a huge amount of potential and it has been wasted. > The reasons for the waste are debatable, the fact of the waste is, I think, > not debatable at all. Things could have been done much better, they weren't. > Aman > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of > Dane Trethowan > Sent: Friday, June 08, 2018 7:19 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [all-audio] Portable media players with android. > > Yep a fair suggestion. > Of course all this depends on how accessible the portable Android media > player is or can be made to be which is the 40 million dollar question but to > me to be perfectly honest its all a lot of mucking around and for what? > I mentioned I have a Sony xPeria X-Performance, they're old hack as far as > phones go now so why not pick yourself up one of these for a bargain price if > you still can and.. well.. work from there. > Yep, add the Bluetooth control you're talking about, have full accessibility > with your choice of music player, stream to other devices in your house along > with Bluetooth speakers, enjoy high quality sound through your headphones, > amazing battery life etc. > From what I've seen thus far of portable Android music players accessibility > is just a pure waste of time in the main. > Always happy to be proved wrong of course. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Aman > Singer > Sent: Friday, 8 June 2018 9:12 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [all-audio] Portable media players with android. > > Hi, > > I realize this is perilously close to heresy, but I detest touch > screens and sympathise with any desire for physical buttons. If I may ask, > though, why not use a Bluetooth remote which has such buttons? See, just for > example https://satechi.net/products/satechi-bluetooth-multi-media-remote > You can get the best, more or less, of both worlds, physical buttons > and a generally available, non-premium-priced, Android media player. As for > the audio quality, I'm not the person to talk about that but it does seem to > be possible to plug a USB DAC into some Android devices. > HTH, > Aman > > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of > Anders Holmberg > Sent: Wednesday, June 06, 2018 5:29 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: [all-audio] Portable media players with android. > > Hi! > Yes that’s a truth for sure. > I was just thinking of if there were other functions that the phone didn’t > have. > For example physical buttons for play and stop and such, even though its not > hard to stop and play from the touch screen. > Also i am a bit dissapointed about the audio from the nokia 8 i have. > Its good via bluetooth but the 3.5 mm jack could have been better on such a > device. > THe Iphone SE i have is far better there in my opinion. > /A > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Groups.io Links: You receive all messages sent to this group. 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