ok, as promised, I've read it, and I'm asking now.. although I really need to go to bed :(
On Wed, May 30, 2007 at 05:30:09PM +0200, Karel Demeyer wrote: > Hi all, > > (first paragraph is to youness:) > Long mails are very discouraging (is this english ?), especially if > they start with "I fully disagree with Karel.". Further on, after > reading your mail (I read it!), I found out you don't "disagree" for > 100% with what I said... so I was asking myself if you did read my > whole mail and secondly, if you really thought a bit of it before > responding. > (not meant harsh in any way) > already answered :p > > Probably I'm gonna leave this debate alone as I don't see myself > arguing a month or two to see (afterwards) it didn't have much effect. nah, don't worry, you know we grealty appreciate your insight on these things, especially since you're "the HIG guy" ;) But I agree, no point in going in circles, we'll try to solve this fast. > Some points though: > > * I also proposed FT's to be listed in the chatwindow of the > corresponding chat, without being in the chat history (so they don't > scroll). Seems logical, right ? You seem to do the same with your > bar. I even thought about that bar too. But then I opened a chat > window, made some drawings and saw we, most of the time, have a lot of > "screen real estate" free (kind of wasted)underneath the contact's DP, > on the right of the chat history. That's why I proposed to have this > information over there. It's debatable if this is the right place or > not as it seems easier to fit all this info in horizontal lines. two > lines per file traffic didn't seem too much anyway. > yeah ,logical, and a good idea. My original idea was to have a 'dock/undock' option, but when you said put it in the DP area, I thought about a ft bar area, so the idea is partially coming from you. The reason why I reject your solution and prefer mine is because it would fit best in one line then in a vertical bar. Also, the DP frame is for DPs.. it could get confusing... if we didn't have the dual dp thing, maybe, but now, it would be an eyesore to have DP - FT - DP... > * You say I'm crazy about the CL and want everything inside of it ? > The main purpose of amsn's main window might be listing contacts, but > it's also from there on you change your > status/nickname/preferences/plugin settings. There's an event log > (if chosen) underneath the CL (CL not being the window but the > widget). I proposed to have the file transfer "manager" show up > underneath it in one of my designs. This is not in the CL thus. If > you want to remove clutter by not having a new window. In what window > would you list "fts of multiple users". In a window where only in 1 > setting all active chats are going on or the window that lists all > contacts, so all of those who are sending ? > yes, you are crazy about it :p hehe, no, it's just a point of view, the way you see the CL is not the way I see it, and most probably the way most people see it. the CL lists contacts yes, the main window gives access to your account and contact data, so the change nick/status and all that is normal because it's changing your account setting (you are a contact yourself). the events window is placed there because it gives a status on the changes that occured on the CL, so it's related. We wouldn't put the eventlog combobox in a chat window right ? that's how I see it, file transfers are relative to chats, so they should be considered as a 'chat window item', not a 'cl item', putting the FTs in the CL is like puttin the eventlog box in a chat window statusbar... > * Is a "ft manager" needed after all ? (because of this question I > proposed the FT in the chatwindow but not in the chat history). How > many FT's do you think an ordinary aMSN user does at the same time ? > Do we need an overview of all the FT's going on ? or is the user able > to know which FT's he/she has going on (because they are not so many) > and only needs to know about that FT's status when in an active chat > with the contact he's sending to or receiving from ? -> next point > Good point. I don't think it's really needed that much. But, if we don't have one, then the 'FT info line' in a chat window will have very basic information, that's not good, or it will be very huge to contain all the info, or we'll need to right click to access the 'open file' or 'open directory' commands and you know better than anyone that right clicks are bad.. if we add convenience buttons, then it becomes a mini ft manager window.. right ? No, I don't think people will need it, but WE need it because otherwise it would become hard to manage the windows.. in the same way, you don't usually download 100s of files in firefox, but it still has a download manager, it's not a bittorent client, but hey, it's still useful. Gaim/pidgin also has it. the 'ft infobar' is what people will use while being in a transfer.. bt maybe an hour later, you would want to see what file you were sent and open it.. most of the times, when I receive files, it's when someone sends me 10 or 20 images, I get one at a time maybe, open a few ones, but after a few hours, we talk and 'you know the one I sent you with ______ ' and I go up the chat history (in WLM) to find the file and open it again, and it's annoying... so maybe it is useful for users, but not everyone and not always. > * I think (you not I guess) an ordinary (a)MSN user watches the status > of an FT while in a chat with that specific user. To see how much > longer it will take before he can end the conversation for example. > That's why I think it should at all time be possible to have a > conversation open with a user on screen and the file transfer with > that user at the same time. This is not possible if you put the ft in > another tab of the chatwindow. > I agree, which is the purpose of the infobar.. > Anyway; I'm not sure if this is worth it at the end but it might make > you think a bit more about it (not meant harsh, like "you didn't think > about it" (but, did you ? :p)) > > Have a great day, > > Karel. > hehe, I guess I've read you wrong.. I don't see anything much in which I disagree.. apart from the manager in CL thing of course.. but to answer you, no, I did think about it.. maybe just not too much.. don't know.. Thanks for taking the time! 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