A bit of advice to those who are interested in our community. If you profess an interest in Internet Governance you need to look to the interests of the regional as a whole, above and beyond your own local countries interests - or personal bias.
This has to be said plainly. Those with nationalistic interests will never be taken seriously by the wider community. When you care about the region or globe as a whole, a put the needs of the many above the needs of the few, others will respect you and what you say will be heard a lot louder than if you are constantly saying 'me me me'. ...Skeeve *Skeeve Stevens - *eintellego Networks Pty Ltd [email protected] ; www.eintellegonetworks.com Phone: 1300 239 038; Cell +61 (0)414 753 383 ; skype://skeeve facebook.com/eintellegonetworks ; <http://twitter.com/networkceoau> linkedin.com/in/skeeve experts360: https://expert360.com/profile/d54a9 twitter.com/theispguy ; blog: www.theispguy.com The Experts Who The Experts Call Juniper - Cisco - Cloud - Consulting - IPv4 Brokering On Mon, Apr 28, 2014 at 11:41 PM, <[email protected]> wrote: > Dear Rajesh, > > Thanks for steping in for me. I think we both very well understand the > divide and rule principle that destroyed the relationship between our > nations and us. > > Also, really thankful for your encouragment to discuss our issues. > > Regards > Hanif H Mohd > Senior Network Consultant > PKSP, Pakistan > > > On Sunday, 27 April 2014 at 3:35 PM, "Rajesh Chharia" <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > >Dear Skeeve, > > > >Its not fair to take debates to insult any Country. Every country > >including yours has its own problem, without loosing a cricket > >match ;-). > > > >Hanif's view point is that we should review the location of APNIC, > >which is currently limited to Australia. In no way that is > >anything against Australia or can instigate someone to feel so > >offended. > > > >Globally, same discussion has been going for ICANN. Do you think > >friends of ICANN are turning this debate to insult the > >sovereignties ? > > > >Why can’t APNIC has an regional office in Islamabad or Dakha ? I > >think Hanif has taken up this discussion and to refer Aftab > >Siddiqui here is to sow difference between fellow countrymen and > >anyone can see through it. > > > >I feel instead of diverting this debate to such low level is not > >expected from you atleast. I have been seeing this concern for > >very long now and every time you have been responding which looks > >alike that APNIC has some problem here, I dont think that is the > >actual case. Its a strong body and need to have outreach program. > > > >Dear Hanif, advantage of such outreach program is for LEA as well > >as for the members also as its our LEA is well informed, it would > >be less botheration for we ISP's. Similarly, you are also right > >that training program are required in emerging economies. > > > >I am sure Paul and Akinori are competent to explain you the same. > >I sincerely apologise for any inadvertent nasty remark to your > >post. > > > >Please raise all concern at APNIC talk and be assured that APNIC > >as well as members would be responding positively. > > > >Best Regards, > >Rajesh Chharia > >+91 98110 38188 > > > > > > > >On 27-Apr-2014, at 18:43 pm, Skeeve Stevens > ><[email protected]> wrote: > > > >> Hanif, > >> > >> I think you need to talk to some of your fellow countrymen who > >have attended the APNIC meetings and seem to more clearly > >understand the value of APNIC, its operations and why it does what > >it does - better than you do. > >> > >> Pakistan is a dangerous place... you cannot deny that. My > >senior engineers here in Australia are from Pakistan and even they > >advise me that I should not travel to Pakistan as the chance of a > >negative incident against a white westerner is high... simply > >because we are white and they may assume we are American. I have > >not been there, but I do trust the dozen people I know from > >Pakistan who say that it isn't wise to go to many of the areas in > >that country. > >> > >> APNIC used to be based in Japan, now Australia, maybe in the > >future somewhere else... who knows. But I think your assumption > >that the EC are biased is in your own mind as those with > >backgrounds from Australia, Nepal, China, Japan, Korea, Hong Kong, > >Taiwan are represented - with Australia, apart from the DG only > >have one (1) position. If anything, China (and related countries) > >are more represented than others. So please don't say that > >Oceania is over represented. Every single member of the EC has > >earned their position by being a valued member of Internet > >community. > >> > >> Even the staff of APNIC itself is significantly represented by > >those other than white Australia background. > >> > >> Pakistan also too has some great representatives in Internet > >Governance such as Aftab Siddiqui. As someone who is very much > >involved in the community and comes to the meetings, perhaps you > >should raise your concerns with him. > >> > >> The EC represent the ENTIRE region... including yours. They > >have 56 (54 active I think) economies across a large geographic > >area. It is funny those who have an issue only ever seem to have > >one about their own country not getting looked after enough. > >> > >> I suggest your criticism that the EC/APNIC is Oceania or > >Australian biased is not based in any reality, and if you have an > >issue, I'd suggest to actually come to a meeting and talk to > >people. You seem quite anti-Australia... maybe this is just a > >Cricket thing... are you still upset about the 5-0 loss in 2010? ;- > >) > >> > >> > >> ...Skeeve > >> > >> Skeeve Stevens - eintellego Networks Pty Ltd > >> [email protected] ; www.eintellegonetworks.com > >> Phone: 1300 239 038; Cell +61 (0)414 753 383 ; skype://skeeve > >> facebook.com/eintellegonetworks ; linkedin.com/in/skeeve > >> experts360: https://expert360.com/profile/d54a9 > >> twitter.com/theispguy ; blog: www.theispguy.com > >> > >> The Experts Who The Experts Call > >> Juniper - Cisco - Cloud - Consulting - IPv4 Brokering > >> > >> > >> On Sun, Apr 27, 2014 at 5:08 PM, <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Skeeve, > >> > >> > >> On Saturday, 26 April 2014 at 4:19 PM, "Skeeve Stevens" > ><[email protected]> wrote: > >> > > >> >Hanif, > >> > > >> >I rely on APNIC and its EC to consider the entire > >> >community/regions needs > >> >as opposed to a vocal minority... even if that minority was just > >> >me yelling > >> >about something. We choose an EC whose roles transcend their > >home > >> >country > >> >and become for the good of everyone they represent. > >> > >> I am yet to understand who the EC is representing. For sure the > >EC is not representing Members by allowing APNIC staff travel in > >business class. > >> > >> I am also yet to understand if APNIC is for Asia and Oceania or > >just for Oceania. I think this RIR is for Oceania not Asia. > >> > >> Reasons: > >> > >> 1. Located in Australia (Oceania) > >> 2. Headed by an Australian and 90% of its senior managemnt or > >the decision makers are from Oceania. > >> 3. Follows Australian travel adversaries. No trainings or > >workshops here in Pakistan for last two years. > >> 4. Contributes to the Australian work force > >> > >> So, I think it is an 'Australia' Pacifc Network Information > >Centre (APNIC) not Asia Pacific RIR. > >> > >> > > >> >I think rather than accusations of mis-management, I'd spend > >some > >> >time > >> >talking to members of the EC about why certain decisions are > >made. > >> > Most of > >> >them are more than willing to talk to you and give you their > >> >perspective - > >> >which btw, does not always agree across all EC members... but > >> >most of the > >> >time they come to a consensus for the benefit of all members... > >> > >> We're talking now and hope the EC pay close attention to this > >discussion. > >> > >> Regards > >> Hanif H Mohd > >> Senior Network Consultant > >> PKSP, Pakistan > >> > >> > > >> > > >> >...Skeeve > >> > > >> >*Skeeve Stevens - *eintellego Networks Pty Ltd > >> >[email protected] ; www.eintellegonetworks.com > >> > > >> >Phone: 1300 239 038; Cell +61 (0)414 753 383 ; skype://skeeve > >> > > >> >facebook.com/eintellegonetworks ; > >> ><http://twitter.com/networkceoau> > >> >linkedin.com/in/skeeve > >> > > >> >experts360: https://expert360.com/profile/d54a9 > >> > > >> >twitter.com/theispguy ; blog: www.theispguy.com > >> > > >> > > >> >The Experts Who The Experts Call > >> >Juniper - Cisco - Cloud - Consulting - IPv4 Brokering > >> > > >> > > >> >On Sat, Apr 26, 2014 at 11:26 PM, <[email protected]> > >wrote: > >> > > >> >> Hi Dave, > >> >> > >> >> Very good point but its a taboo at APNIC to discuss about > >> >Members fee and > >> >> APNIC (mis) management of funds. APNIC maintains a white list > >> >and a black > >> >> list of public contacts. You're now in their black list for > >> >raising this. > >> >> Like many others, this discussion will end up in the no > >through > >> >road. The > >> >> Executive council we selected are like the famous three wise > >> >monkeys."see > >> >> no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil". For our representatives > >> >business is > >> >> as usual. > >> >> > >> >> APNIC recently started providing training for law enforcement > >> >agencies > >> >> using Members funds....we did not blessed either. Its a good > >> >initiative and > >> >> I personally commend APNIC for this. However, these LEAs are > >> >government > >> >> agencies and have big budgets. If LEAs request training APNIC > >> >must use LEAs > >> >> budget to provide such trainings not Members funds. Its just > >not > >> >right! > >> >> > >> >> Regards > >> >> Hanif H Mohd > >> >> Senior Network Consultant > >> >> PKSP, Pakistan > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> On Saturday, 26 April 2014 at 5:44 PM, "Dave Mead" > >> ><[email protected]> > >> >> wrote: Paul, > >> >> > >> >> Your speech at Asia Pacific Internet Leadership Program > >meeting > >> >is > >> >> utterly disappointing to APNIC Members. > >> >> > >> >> http://www.apnic.net/publications/news/2014/icann-49-event- > >wrapup > >> >> > >> >> You said, "...Members pay fees to APNIC to support the > >> >organisation and > >> >> the services and they don't give APNIC a blessing to spend > >that > >> >money in > >> >> unlimited fashion on Internet development..." > >> >> > >> >> http://audio.icann.org/meetings/singapore2014/apilp-22mar14- > >> >en.mp3 > >> >> > >> >> Members DID NOT BLESS APNIC to spend the fees on business > >class > >> >travel > >> >> which costs 3 times more than an economy class ticket. The > >> >entire senior > >> >> management, including your Executve Assistant and those who > >work > >> >for APNIC > >> >> as consultants travel in business class contributing to the > >> >success of the > >> >> airlines but clearly not Internet development in this region. > >> >> > >> >> http://www.apnic.net/about-APNIC/team > >> >> > >> >> Paul, you're leading a not-for-profit organisation not a > >> >comerncial > >> >> entity that you and your senior management can erode member > >> >funds for your > >> >> comfortable travels across the world. This is just outrageous > >and > >> >> mismanagement of Member funds. > >> >> > >> >> Members like to see the Executive Council takes note of this > >> >and truely > >> >> represent the Members to better manage their funds to > >contribute > >> >for the > >> >> Internet development in this region. A lot of development work > >> >can be done > >> >> if the funds are managed effectively not use for personal > >> >benefits. > >> >> > >> >> Best > >> >> -Dave Mead > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> _______________________________________________ > >> >> apnic-talk mailing list > >> >> [email protected] > >> >> http://mailman.apnic.net/mailman/listinfo/apnic-talk > >> >> > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> apnic-talk mailing list > >> [email protected] > >> http://mailman.apnic.net/mailman/listinfo/apnic-talk > >
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