Bill, MLR's are set by the EPA. That's how they determine PHI's.
Mark Angermayer Tubby Fruits On 5/2/14, Fleming, William <[email protected]> wrote: > Am I missing something here? Always thought it was the FDA not the EPA that > regulated residues on food. > > Bill Fleming > Montana State University > Western Ag Research Center > 580 Quast Lane > Corvallis, MT 59828 > > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Weinzierl, > Richard A > Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2014 7:22 PM > To: Apple-crop discussion list > Subject: Re: [apple-crop] apples and chemicals > > Amazing. > > First, I admit that I usually support new restrictions imposed by the US EPA > in response to new tox data or standards because in general one can at least > attribute the decisions to people who understand how to weigh scientific > evidence ... and I do not expect that they will always agree with me, to one > direction or the other. I probably do not agree with industry opposition to > the EPA as often as many on this list-serve might think I should, but that's > why we all should communicate. > > But ... wow ... Apparently TYT (the young Turks) feel free to offer > compelling opinions without any need to understand the issue in any > substantive way. One has to (NOT) love the web. What a bunch of arrogant > talking heads. Perhaps they should launch a vendetta on nitrosamines from > BBQs as David R. brought up. Or maybe even quit wearing any SYNTHETIC > fabrics or burning any hydrocarbon fuels. As others have posted ... those > who eat lots of fresh fruits and vegetables, produced conventionally or > organically, are the healthiest of all in our societies. > > I'll probably regret posting this ... but I do not understand how their > opinions warrant anyone's attention. Not Faux News, but just as faux. > > Ugh. Let's hope academic freedom is a real thing, or I'll become a retired > old new fruit grower a year or two before I planned to be. > > Rick Weinzierl > > Richard Weinzierl > Professor and Extension Entomologist > IL SARE PDP Coordinator > Department of Crop Sciences, University of Illinois > S-334 Turner Hall, 1102 S. Goodwin Avenue > Urbana, IL 61801 > 217-244-2126 > > From: > [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Stephen Jansky > Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2014 6:59 PM > To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [apple-crop] apples and chemicals > > The YOUTUBE reaction to American Apples containing DHP.... Not good press > for the U.S. Industry.... > > http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=oEh1IbOKRBo > > Steve > ________________________________ > From: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> > To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> > Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2014 10:11:27 +0000 > Subject: Re: [apple-crop] apples and chemicals > Hello Mike and all, > > The backdrop to the Irish opinion was, I believe, that a number of EU > countries were more reliant on DPA than some others, and that Ireland, > having a small apple industry (but nonetheless one in which about 30% of the > fruit could have been DPA treated), was naturally inclined to be positively > disposed to its continued use (under considerable lobbying pressure from our > own apple growers association, and from some other countries). > > I do know that strong efforts were made by the task force to fill the > supposed data gaps, but in the end they did not win out. So in the end, as > you say the MRL was dropped not based on a definitive assessment of risk, > but because, as I mentioned, there is a general policy thrust to remove > nitrosamines from diet. > > Dave is correct to point out that there are uncontrollable sources of > nitrosamines in diet, but thank goodness they have not begun regulating how > people cook their foods at home yet. It would be interesting to compare the > amount of nitrosamine in a typical diet due to BBQ's, compared with that > which might come from DPA treated apples. > > 1-MCP is not a replacement for DPA, and a few years ago I had done some > small-scale trials on using about 10% rates of DPA both without and in > combination with 1-MCP, and found scald control to be very good in both > cases, indicating that recommended DPA rates were probably too high to begin > with. I think such combinations would have been the ideal solution, had DPA > not been removed from the market, as CO2 injury is a serious risk with 1-MCP > use, which is why we now must use higher-tech storage systems. Regarding the > treatments with DPA at 10% of the recommended rate, residues were still > detectable at about 0.1 to 0.05 ppm after 6 months of storage (unwashed > apples). Even if we could guarantee the lower figure, because DPA has now > been withdrawn, any residue found in a random test would be an issue, as use > of an unapproved chemical is illegal (even if it leaves no residue). > > We have not got as far as Mosbah's idea of calling pesticides plant > medicines, though the industry does use the phrase plant protectant > products, even though the public still call them pesticides. It will take > quite some time to change that, but the opportunity arises each time someone > asks the question. > > Finally, regarding Jean-Marc's observation of reduced aroma, we have been > able to offset this in some varieties (for example Elstar & clones, Pinova > and Wellant) by a delayed harvest, which is in itself facilitated by the > excellent ability of 1-MCP to stop these particular varieties ripening > further. In this case we end up with firmer fresher-tasting apples which > also have great aroma characteristics. For other varieties (e.g. Jonagold > and clones), once ripening is under way the effect of 1-MCP is not so > marked, so later harvest is not the solution. > > I would add that the advent of 1-MCP has changed my planting strategy from > Jonagold type apples to Elstar type apples. > > Con > > From: > [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Mike Willett > Sent: 30 April 2014 06:36 > To: Apple-crop discussion list > Subject: Re: [apple-crop] apples and chemicals > > As you can imagine, we have been following this issue very closely for a > number of years. According to the U.S. EPA's Registration Eligibility > Decision for DPA, diphenyl nitrosamine is a trace contaminant in technical > DPA. In the most recent risk assessment (2012) done in the EU for DPA, by > Ireland's Pesticide Registration & Control Division as the rapporteur member > state (RMS), it came to this conclusion: > > "N-nitrosodiphenylamine is found at trace levels, below the LOQ in processed > apple samples. When you consider the toxicological profile of this > nitrosamine and the amounts at which it is likely to be consumed, the RMS > calculations show that there are no safety concerns. One must also consider > that diphenylamine is not applied to apples destined for the processing > market, it is only applied to freshly consumed table apples, as appearance > of these apples is very important. > > Therefore, the RMS remains supportive of the approval of diphenylamine." > > In the study that generated the opinion above which was done to address home > processing of apples that were originally sold for fresh consumption, no > nitrosamines were found in raw apples, nor in apple juice; only in blended > and chopped apples ("processed" apples). > > The decision announced in March of this year indicates that the reason the > MRL for DPA was reduced to 0.1 ppm was because of data gaps in the > registration package that had been submitted. The EU DPA Task Force has > vigorously protested the allegation of data gaps but, at any rate, the > reduction in the MRL in the EU was not based on a definitive assessment of > risk. > > While I am not an expert in this area, given the discussion regarding 1-MCP, > while it is very effective at preventing scald, work done by Jim Mattheis at > USDA/ARS-Wenatchee and Chris Watkins at Cornell, notes that in certain > situations use of 1-MCP can increase certain fruit disorders, some related > to CO2 injury. Many packers in the U.S. Pacific Northwest, now use lower > rates of DPA in combination with 1-MCP to maximize its benefits. > > Mike Willett > Northwest Horticultural Council > www.nwhort.org<http://www.nwhort.org> > [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> > 509.969.0245 mobile > > This message is from a remote location, sometimes truly remote. > ________________________________ > From: > [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> > [[email protected]] on behalf of David A. Rosenberger > [[email protected]] > Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2014 10:46 AM > To: Apple-crop discussion list > Subject: Re: [apple-crop] apples and chemicals > Hello, Con - > Since grilling meat on a barbecue almost always creates some nitrosamines, > I'm assuming that outdoor barbecues have also been banned in Europe? :) > > **************************************************************** > Dave Rosenberger, Professor Emeritus > Dept. of Plant Pathology and Plant-Microbe Biology > Cornell's Hudson Valley Lab, P.O. Box 727, Highland, NY 12528 > Office: 845-691-7231 Cell: 845-594-3060 > http://blogs.cornell.edu/plantpathhvl/ > **************************************************************** > > On Apr 29, 2014, at 12:00 PM, Con.Traas > <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > Hello Mosbah, > The cost of smartfresh treatment here is about 10 euros (12 dollars?) per > 330kg bin (700lbs approx.). It feels expensive, especially compared with > DPA, which is very cheap. It does a lot more though. > By the way, I think the issue with DPA from a European perspective is that > when it degrades it forms one or more nitrosamines, which are a group of > chemicals many of which are carcinogenic, though some much more-so than > others. So the EU is seeking to eliminate all sources of nitrosamines from > diets, and therefore DPA is gone. > I do remember when DPA was "cleaned-up", but its breakdown products will be > nitrosamines, regardless of how cleanly it is produced. > > Con > > ________________________________ > From: > [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> > [[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>] > on behalf of Kushad, Mosbah M > [[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>] > Sent: 28 April 2014 15:53 > To: Apple-crop discussion list > Subject: Re: [apple-crop] apples and chemicals > If you are asking about diphenylamine (DPA), then it is an antioxidants that > blocks the oxidation of alpha farnesene into conjugated trienes in the peel. > Conjugated trienes are what causes the apple/pear peel to turn brown from > regular or superficial scald. It doesn't help soft scald or sunscald. In > the old days they used to wrap fruits in paper soaked in mineral oil that > absorbs the conjugated triene gas. I have only scene this recently being > practiced in one place. To minimize superficial scald development, harvest > fruits when they are horticulturally mature. Ethoxyquin was removed from > the market around the 80's because it was suspected to cause cancer. > However, DPA went through a rigorous cleaning process to remove any > impurities that cause cancer. If you are asking about 1-methylecyclopropene > (1-MCP), also known as SmartFresh, it is an ethylene action inhibitor. > Treated fruits produce ethylene but it does not work, because the sites > where ethylene normally attaches itself, to initiate fruit ripening, are > occupied by 1-MCP. There is no evidence that 1-MCP causes any harm to > human. Some consider 1-MCP as the best thing since CA storage was > introduced in the 30's -40's. hope this helps, Mosbah Kushad, university > of Illinois. > > Question to Con. What is the cost of using SmartFresh per bushel in your > operation? > > From: > [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Ginda Fisher > Sent: Monday, April 28, 2014 7:08 AM > To: Apple-crop discussion list; Con.Traas; 'Evan B. Milburn'; 'Apple-crop > discussion list' > Subject: Re: [apple-crop] apples and chemicals > > Can anyone summarize what this chemical is, why and how it is used, and what > the risks might be to farmers and consumers from its use? I feel like I > walked into the middle of a conversation. > > Thanks, > -- > Typed with Swype. Who knows what I meant to say? > On April 28, 2014 4:03:51 AM EDT, "Con.Traas" > <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > Hello Evan and everybody, > > Coming from my perspective, where we are now having to cope without DPA for > storing Bramley (culinary) apples, I must say that is it proving tricky, but > we are managing, through use of 1-MCP combined with more complex (and > expensive and risky) storage regimes. So I would say it is technically > possible to keep apples without DPA or ethoxyquin, which we also can't use, > but ironically it mitigates against the smaller grower, and in favour of the > larger ones (big ag?) who can afford the higher tech gear. > > It is ironic that scaring people about pesticide residues on fresh foods > (especially fruits) actually causes people to eat more processed foods (as > though their ingredients do not also get pesticide treatments), as the > studies linking better health with fruit consumption are studies conducted > with conventionally grown fruits with their pesticide residues (if they are > not residue free). In other words, the benefits of eating fruits and > vegetables are there in black and white, even if those fruits and vegetables > have residues. It is far less healthy to switch to a candy bar from an > apple, even if that apple has some residue (so long as that is below > permitted levels). However, this is not a message we can send out, so we are > left grappling when emails like this from EWG are circulated. > > The joke of what EWG seems to be doing is producing a dirty dozen or clean > fifteen list is that those lists say nothing at all about the risk of a > pesticide residue on the particular apple in your fruit-bowl. You could be > eating a residue-free fruit from among the "dirty dozen", or one covered in > pesticide from among the "clean fifteen". > > Despite the differences in regulations between Europe and the US (and I > favour in general the less permissive, more cautious European standards, > despite having to work within their restrictions), our agriculture here is > constantly increasing in scale, and resembles more and more what would be > our stereotyped image of US industrial agriculture. That is because the > regulations have more in common than what separates them, and farming is > becoming more and more like a business, and less like a passion. > > I am personally not a fan of industrial agriculture, although I employ > mostly similar methods. However, motivation is a key factor, and for me, the > motivation is not profit maximisation. For the industrial model is about > profit before all else, and that is not a suitable way for the World to > produce its food. > > However, as long as Joe public takes the attitude that 7% of their > disposable income is what they will spend on food (that is the Irish %), > then agriculture will continue to become more industrial, as for me that is > not a percentage that can support the production of produce and foods that > consumers might feel more comfortable buying, and might be able to have more > confidence in. > > So, instead of sending 45 bucks to Ken Cook, I would suggest that Joe public > either sends it to a principled (and hopefully small-scale) farmer someplace > near them, or better still, buys a few fruit trees or invests in a few > packets of seeds, and grows their own pesticide-free produce. > > Con Traas > European (Irish) Apple Grower > T: @theapplefarmer > > From: > [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Evan B. Milburn > Sent: 28 April 2014 02:32 > To: Apple-Crop > Subject: Re: [apple-crop] apples and chemicals > > This was sent to me from a friend of mine by the name of George. It was > send to him from one of his co-workers. > Evan Milburn > > www.milburnorchards.com<http://www.milburnorchards.com/> > > > Hey Evan what's this all about? > > > > > _______________________________________________ > apple-crop mailing list > [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop > > > _______________________________________________ apple-crop mailing list > [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> > http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop > _______________________________________________ apple-crop mailing list [email protected] http://virtualorchard.net/mailman/listinfo/apple-crop
