Mark,
Do we even have CASA approved flight manuals nowadays? Seems there
was some change a few years ago which was very confusing.
Maybe the Pawnee window restriction should be placarded in front of the pilot?
Mike
At 10:53 PM 14/07/2008, you wrote:
LOL,
CASA,
Thats funny.
----------
Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 18:10:24 +0800
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Fwd: Pawnee window open during towing
isnot agood idea!!
Howdy all,
As Far as i know if the pawnee flight manual for that exact aircraft
rego ( in section 8 of the flight manual ) has a STC in the flight
manual as a CASA ammended and approved page, that states "Door off
flying permitted" with the new placarded airspeeds and
limitations, whip the pins out chuck the door in the hanger and
have the wind and all the carbon monoxide in your face you like .....
If the aircraft flight manual DOES NOT have a STC for door off
operations, then ya just shit out of luck and have to keep the doors
closed and locked.
Pretty simple maybee some one should have a chat to CASA and see
what there take is on this situation is, and get a offical answer on
paper. i think i know what there response will be..
If any one wants a copy of a flight manual suppliment for door off
operations i have a copy out of a cherokee i flew, that i can email out.
In short if its not in the flight manual you can't do it.
I stand to be corrected 8-)
Ben
----------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of Mark Rowe
Sent: Mon 7/14/2008 8:05 AM
To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.
Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Fwd: Pawnee window open during towing
isnot agood idea!!
Sorry, i neglected to say before, regulation says that "if fitted"
all "hatches must be fixed before flight".
If flying with open door just remove it, lets face it there are only
2 pins to remove.
Last season NGC had quite a lot of damage done to our pawnee with
this type of incident, the pilot was very lucky that time. Door came
off and cleaned up the left tailplane and flogged against the
fuselage, club was not happy having damage to our new tug i can tell you.
How about we look deeper into the cause and affect with regard to
some of the ways we operate, a silly or lazy action can have
disastrous effects, if the PIC wants the wind in his hair then don't
just do it by halves. Think about the ongoing risks and consequence
hey.. Cowboys ride horses not fly aircraft.
Cheers
Mark
----------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 09:11:15 +1000
Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Fwd: Pawnee window open during towing is
not a good idea!!
I have watched the discussion about flying Pawnee aircraft with the
door down with interest. I have seen folks at Fayence in France
flying with the left door down so the practice is not confined to
Australia or New Zealand. As for banging your head on the window
during decent, this can be largely avoided by keeping the pilots
harness nice and tight and the inertia reel on the shoulder straps
in the locked position
Tom van Blaricum
----------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Pam Kurstjens
Sent: Saturday, 12 July 2008 2:23 AM
To: 'Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.'
Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Fwd: Pawnee window open during towing is
not agood idea!!
It is SPECIFICALLY PROHIBITED to fly a Pawnee with the window open,
according to the flight manual.
That should make it quite clear.
Bashing your head on the window/door during a descent through lively
thermals is another matter altogether!
Pam Kurstjens
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mark Rowe
Sent: Thursday, 10 July 2008 5:37 PM
To: Discussion of issues relating to Soaring in Australia.
Subject: Re: [Aus-soaring] Fwd: Pawnee window open during towing is
not a good idea!!
BCF is not illegal as far as CASA is concerned but the environmental
guys may have issues with it being used.
Funny that this topic came up just today. i may have an update soon.
Cheers
Mark
----------
Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2008 20:22:57 +1000
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [email protected]
Subject: [Aus-soaring] Fwd: Pawnee window open during towing is not
a good idea!!
I got this direct from a guy in NZ re the fatal accident involving
the window - The writer is clear that the message should be passed
on to all. The extra drag (and costs more) and the strain on fabric
are minor really.
While on tugs I was surprised to hear Keepit Callair had no fire
extinguisher (when the ASH25 had a fire recently) and I was
surprised to hear CASA rules may have changed in that it is no
longer a requirement to carry one. I realise BCF can only be used
in a life threatening situation so it looks as if the day I ran out
and put out the fire in Adelaide Soaring Club's Pawnee with the
Keepit Pawnee BCF, it is now illegal to do so!!! The local rescue
chopper uses a red halogen type I notice. I guess somebody out
there is up to date on the topic.
Ian McPhee
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Gary O'Neill <<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 2008/7/8
Subject: [Aus-soaring] Pawnee window open during towing is not a good idea!!
To: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
I was at the airfield the day Jim was killed and I helped remove the wreckage
There was an airstream blown trail of blood along the fuselage .
The geometry of the hinge arrangement means the door will hit the tug pilot in
the head with a lot of wind driven force.
Pass this message on and absolutely refuse to launch unless the tug pilot
complies with the flight manual. I do not want to lose any more fellow pilots
by me not passing on what I saw that day.
Gary O'Neill
New Zealand
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