The Baha'i Studies Listserv Hi, Thankyou. Yes i felt it was a bit harsh. I didnt mean to downgrade the mighty station of women in this dispensation God forbid!! God knows i love them all too much for that (;
On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 11:43 AM, Gilberto Simpson < [email protected]> wrote: > The Baha'i Studies Listserv > Naison, I wasn't criticizing your explanation or metaphor. I was being > critical of Susan's complaint that you were echoing what Muslims say. > > On Tue, Nov 2, 2010 at 11:37 PM, Naison Jones <[email protected]> > wrote: > > The Baha'i Studies Listserv > > > > Signs in nature of harmony coming through apparent inequality: > > the queen bee (female) and all the worker bees. A necessary inequality > for > > the hive to thrive and function. > > > > Ants. Woker and ants and ants of varying roles (soldier ants) etc and the > > queen ant. > > Through these inequality a hive thrives. > > > > Have I compared the Bahai administrative order to an ant hive? hehe I > hope > > this is not disrespectful. > > > > Now the spiritual station of the ants are the same (they are all ants), > but > > outwardly they have different roles. > > > > regards > > > > > > > > On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 11:18 AM, Gilberto Simpson > > <[email protected]> wrote: > >> > >> The Baha'i Studies Listserv > >> Wow, that's a really insulting ad hominem counter-argument which is > >> really irrelevant to what was said. The Bahai faith all by its > >> lonesome makes certain distinctions between men and women (e.g. > >> membership in the house of justice, prohibition from military service, > >> exemption from pilgrimage, different rules regarding menstruation and > >> prayer, wills, etc.) It is just a fact that men and women are not > >> talked about in the same terms in the Bahai writings. And it is only > >> natural that a thoughtful Bahai would want to try to articulate some > >> reasons those distinctions are made. > >> > >> On Tue, Nov 2, 2010 at 10:37 PM, Susan Maneck <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> > The Baha'i Studies Listserv > >> > That is precisely the argument Muslims make and if buy into it we have > >> > made no progress whatsoever over the past dispensation. > >> > > >> > On Tue, Nov 2, 2010 at 9:03 PM, Naison Jones <[email protected]> > >> > wrote: > >> >> The Baha'i Studies Listserv > >> >> > >> >> Hi, > >> >> I want to share some thoughts not from a so-called scholarly > >> >> perspective but > >> >> more a 'spiritual-inights' one. > >> >> > >> >> True equality can Never exist between man and women because they are > >> >> different. All is meant in Bahai is that women have the same > spiritual > >> >> rank > >> >> as men and that implies 'true equality' not the equality of tasks and > >> >> functions and responsibilities. > >> >> > >> >> If you look at equality in the outward sense in the world of creation > >> >> it > >> >> does not exist. No two human beings possess an equal lvl of > >> >> intelligence and > >> >> faculty of ability and appearance etc > >> >> This is one of the signs of the diversifying power of God, his > ability > >> >> to > >> >> create untold forms with his power and is probably a necessary > exigency > >> >> of > >> >> the contingetent world. So when we say men and woman are equalit > >> >> is naive to > >> >> say that means they are the same and will all be doing the same > thing. > >> >> > >> >> For those who struggle with this concept think about it like this. If > >> >> God > >> >> had intended equal responsibility between man and women he would have > >> >> given > >> >> them equal body parts, the man the ability to give birth and nurse a > >> >> child - > >> >> and vice verca. But these two inequalities of man and womans body > must > >> >> exist > >> >> for a union of creation (ie a new child is made). Think about these > >> >> signs of > >> >> God it is interesting. Through this inequality a new life is made. > This > >> >> can > >> >> be extended to many things. > >> >> > >> >> Therefore it is naive to say that the Bahai faith will have uniform, > >> >> and > >> >> perfect outward equality in all ways- as this does not exist. Perfect > >> >> equality is achieved through inequality much the same way as > >> >> Baha'u'llah > >> >> says 'they will see peace in war', 'justice in seeming injustice in > the > >> >> seven valleys (valley of knowledge). > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> regards > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> On Tue, Nov 2, 2010 at 11:44 AM, Susan Maneck <[email protected]> > >> >> wrote: > >> >>> > >> >>> The Baha'i Studies Listserv > >> >>> > http://www.planetbahai.org/cgi-bin/articles.pl?article=327 > >> >>> > > >> >>> > This article was retrieved from a wikipedia link. > >> >>> > > >> >>> > Using intrinsic differences as an argument? > >> >>> > >> >>> To me this is the great danger in speculating as to the reason why > >> >>> women do not serve on the House. It leads to these 'separate but > >> >>> equal' arguments which lead to anything *but* equality. > >> >>> > >> >>> __________________________________________________ > >> >>> You are subscribed to Baha'i Studies as: mailto: > [email protected] > >> >>> Unsubscribe: send a blank email to > >> >>> > >> >>> mailto: > leave-536881-2222932.41cdf54d4f0ecb51bfad2c42bd979...@list.jccc.edu > >> >>> Subscribe: send subscribe bahai-st in the message body to > >> >>> [email protected] > >> >>> Or subscribe: > >> >>> http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/all_forums/subscribe?name=bahai-st > >> >>> Baha'i Studies is available through the following: > >> >>> Mail - mailto:[email protected] > >> >>> Web - http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/?forum=bahai-st > >> >>> News (on-campus only) - news://list.jccc.edu/bahai-st > >> >>> Old Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] > >> >>> New Public - http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected] > >> >> > >> >> __________________________________________________ > >> >> You are subscribed to Baha'i Studies as: mailto:[email protected] > >> >> Unsubscribe: send a blank email to > >> >> > >> >> mailto: > leave-537124-738796.0f462312a2f7bdde70e0bbead78e3...@list.jccc.edu > >> >> Subscribe: send subscribe bahai-st in the message body to > >> >> [email protected] > >> >> Or subscribe: > >> >> http://list.jccc.edu:8080/read/all_forums/subscribe?name=bahai-st > >> >> Baha'i Studies is available through the following: > >> >> Mail - 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