Jeez, I go away for a couple of days, and when I come back everybody is
curled up in quivering foetal balls and chewing on their toenails.
For Ifni's sake take a deep breath, have a beer, smoke a joint,
whatever--but please relax for a moment.
A couple of notes:
First, it is extremely difficult to ban discussions of politics because in
one way or another, most things end up being political. The only group I
know of that has come anywhere near succeeding at this strategy is the
"Harry Potter for Grownups" list. This list has an extremely large number
of members, is high volume, and is *heavily* moderated. By, like, half a
dozen people. I doubt anybody wants Brin-L to be moderated, or would be
willing to trust any elected or imposed group of moderators to do the job.
I know I don't and wouldn't.
(That's a big fat "NAY" if it wasn't obvious. And personally I find such
a vote meaningless in the first place.)
On the other hand, HP4GU is also rigorously on-topic, with organized
discussions of the Potter books going on continuously. Personally, I
*hate* being expected to organize things in such a way--I prefer the
free-for-all approach--but others might benefit from it. Something to
discuss?
Second: Brin-L can be pretty high-volume at times, especially when
passions run high, and sometimes people just need to take a break from it
all. Charlie might be back or check in from time to time. So chill. If
he didn't write a scathing phillipic to Brin-L about his reasons for
leaving, then maybe we should trust his judgment and not pick fights on
his behalf. And, as has been noted, there's always ICQ.
Third: on the distinction between "pub-style" and "debate-style"
conversation. Pub-style, in this context, is clearly intended to be a
more relaxed mode of communication than "debate-style." In "debate-style"
one does not merely express one's own opinion but also does one's best to
demolish the other person's and knock the other person off-balance. In
favor of the debate-style, it tends to be more rigorous; on the down side,
it takes a really thick skin and a serious passion to keep it up for a
long period of time (after all, formal debates have time limits). Those
who favor the debate-style of argument need to be aware that not everybody
shares their zeal for the argument, and some people will eventually decide
that it's not worth the effort to keep up. (Bear in mind that exhausting
the other party may feel like winning, but it doesn't really prove
anything.)
Those who like pub-style conversation need to remember that a lot of
people feel an intense desire to prove and/or discover the truth and can
view debates as a kind of sport. You may pick up some bruises and bloody
rhetorical noses, but hey, everything's all right in the end. Without
such people lots of good discussions will die an early and inconclusive
or unsatisfying death.
Everyone: bear in mind that the odds of any one discussion turning out
exactly how you'd like it are pratcically nil, so again, maybe we should
all just relax. Please? Also remember that it's perfectly acceptable to
opt out of a conversation you don't enjoy rather than trying to force the
other participants to believe a certain thing just so you can have the
last word.
Fourth: I know that sometimes my argument style tends to go a little over
the top...I tend to combine pub-style, debate-style, and cheap-ass
stand-up comedian style in whatever way seems to my advantage. I probably
cheat, in other words, from time to time. I apologize for any past and
future offense given.
Fifth: I think it's a good idea to discuss openly how we'd like the list
to operate...but I think it's a bad idea to make such decisions based on
an ad-hoc poll prompted by the inflamed passions of the moment.
Marvin Long
Austin, Texas
