Dan Minette wrote:
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Erik Reuter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Brin-L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Monday, December 03, 2001 7:48 PM
> Subject: Re: Secret Military Tribunals
>
>
>
>>On Mon, Dec 03, 2001 at 01:41:37PM -0600, Dan Minette wrote:
>>
>>
>>>So, I will not be upset if we hold less than a score of military
>>>trials for AQ members we capture in Afghanistan. I would be upset
>>>if the trials were secret, but I would not be upset if we used
>>>information that we did not make public.
>>>
>>What about people who have been living in the US who are arrested and
>>held without a just cause?
>>
>>
>
> I can be corrected on this, but I don't think that a foreigner can just be
> picked up off the streets and arrested. If the foreigner violates his/her
> visa, then they can be arrested for that. I know that the attorney general
> has stated no one who has not violated a law or the conditions of their
> visas have been picked up.
>
> People who are in the country illegally can be detained for a significant
> amount of time, with bail and without formal charges. That certainly is
> open to abuse. After a point, the government should either charge them with
> something else or deport them. However, in and of itself, living in a
> country illegally can be grounds for arrest. I know that those being held
> have access to lawyers and, if they believe that they are in the country
> legally, can sue to be released. IIRC, one person has already been
> successful in winning his/her release that way.
>
> BTW, I think that listening in to phone conversations between a person and
> their lawyer is a violation of legal rights. Its hard to have a right to
> counsel if you can't talk openly and honestly to that counsel. IIRC, JDG
> made this same point earlier.
>
>
Some relevant info from AI:
* News Release Issued by the International Secretariat of Amnesty
International *
4 December 2001
AMR 51/174/2001
214/01
As the US Senate Judiciary Committee holds hearings today on the
post-11 September detentions in the USA, to which the Attorney
General will testify, Amnesty International called once again on
the US authorities not to allow human rights to be sacrificed in
the name of security.
Reiterating its concern about the continuing secrecy
surrounding these detentions, the organization said, "It is vital
for the government to release more information, and to be
publicly accountable for who is being held and in what
circumstances.The authorities must also ensure that the basic
rights of all those detained are respected."
Amnesty International cited -- among others -- the case
of four South Asian men detained in Connecticut 10 days ago, who
have had no access to their families since their arrest. When
their attorney tried to visit them, officials would not confirm
they were detained and their names did not appear on Immigration
and Naturalization Service (INS) computerized lists; he gained
access only after obtaining their alien numbers through another
source.
Last week the US Attorney General released partial data
on those detained after 11 September, revealing that 104
individuals have been charged with various federal criminal
offences, around half of whom are still in custody. The names of
93 have been made public, while the others remain sealed under
court orders. 548 other -- as yet unidentified -- individuals
remain in custody on immigration charges.
"The information provided by the Attorney General leaves
many questions unanswered," Amnesty International said, stressing
that no details were given, for example, on where detainees are
held and how long they were held before being charged. The list
also left more than 400 individuals unaccounted for, based on
prior government figures of more than 1,180 arrested or detained.
"They may have all been released or deported, but no-one seems to
know except the government," the organization said.
Although INS guidelines state that INS detainees should
be told of organizations able to provide free legal advice, this
does not always happen in practice. "Unless the detainees have
access to telephones and know who to contact they could simply
disappear into the system," Amnesty International said.
Last week, Amnesty International presented a detailed
memorandum to the Attorney General, in which the organization
outlined a range of concerns relating to the post-11 September
investigations. These included reports of incommunicado
detention; harsh conditions and ill-treatment of Muslim detainees
in custody; concern at government powers under the recent
legislation to detain non-nationals indefinitely on the basis of
mere suspicion of involvement in "terrorism"; and the use of
secret evidence.
The memorandum also addressed speculation over the use
of torture or "pressurized" interrogation techniques; the
situation of suspects arrested abroad and trials by military
commissions. Amnesty International recently called for revocation
of the order to establish such commissions as they would set up
an intrinsically discriminatory parallel justice system which
does not comply with internationally recognised fair trial
standards.
Several recent cases further highlight Amnesty
International's continuing concerns. These include:
Mazen Al-Najjar, a Muslim cleric, was arrested last month on a
deportation order for overstaying his student visa. Despite
having no criminal record, he is locked down for 23 hours a day
in a small cell in solitary confinement in a maximum security
prison and is denied visits from his family. Dr Al-Najjar was
previously detained in a US jail for more than three years on the
basis of secret evidence, while appealing against the deportation
order, but a federal judge ordered his release last December,
after finding there were "no bona fide reasons to conclude that
[he] is a threat to national security". He his currently held in
far worse conditions than before - with no prospect of release
because, as a stateless Palestinian, he has no country to return
to.
A Yemeni student arrested on a visa violation after several
years in the USA, has reportedly agreed to be deported to Yemen
-- despite fearing he would be at risk there -- after spending 45
days in solitary confinement in a high security unit.
In recent weeks, Amnesty International has repeatedly
expressed its concern about different aspects of the USA's
response to the "terrorist threat". These include the use of
military tribunals to try foreign suspects and fears that -- in
the face of the refusal by many countries to extradite people to
the USA on the grounds that they may face the death penalty --
the US government may resort to tactics, which in the past have
included the use of abduction, to circumvent extradition
protections.
"For justice to be done -- and to be seen to be done --
the US government must abide scrupulously to the highest
standards of legality and transparency," Amnesty International
said.
For more information, or to receive a copy of Amnesty
International's memorandum to the Attorney General or of the
report "No return to execution. The US death penalty as a barrier
to extradition" (also available at www.
web.amnesty.org/ai.nsf/index/amr511712001) please call the
Amnesty International press office on +44 207 413 5562.
For the latest information on the 11 September Crisis visit:
http://web.amnesty.org/11september.htm
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--
Doug
email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.zo.com/~brighto
Irreverence is the champion of liberty.
Mark Twain - Notebook, 1888
