On Sat, 22 Jun 2002, William T Goodall wrote:
>
> on 22/6/02 2:18 am, Robert Seeberger at
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Chad Cooper" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Sent: Friday, June 21, 2002 11:35 AM
> > Subject: RE: humour etc
> >
> >
> >>> OK....here we go........this is where I tell
> things one
> >>> normally doesnt talk
> >>> about in a public forum.
> >>>
> >>> I was raised in the Catholic church and went to
> a Catholic school for
> >>> several years...
<major snippage>
> >> Nerd going to Hell (now you know why)
> >>
> > I doubt it. Hell is for *bad* people.
>
> Someone who believes the pernicious nonsense of
> religion is capable of *any*
> evil act.
>
> This follows from basic logic. If you insert a false
> axiom into a system
> ("There is a God" for example) you can then prove
> *anything at all* to be
> true, and thereby justify any act.
>
> --
I have not commented on this for some time because
I've seen that on-line debates of sensitive subjects
tend to quickly degenerate into what you call "flame
wars;" without body language and tone-of-voice, it's
_really_ hard to tell whether someone's serious, angry
or merely sardonic. You may have already ground this
topic into the dust - if so, feel free to tell me so.
My background: bred-and-born Lutheran (not Missouri or
Wisconsin Synod!), formerly active in the church but
haven't belonged to a congregation for about 10 years.
Currently: best described as a Lutheran heretic Deist
(really! <grin>).
My position on child molesters: castrate or kill
<quite serious>.
To call all religion "pernicious nonsense" is
unjustifiable overkill; there is without question a
great deal of foolishness and outright absurdity in
any religion, but what nonsense is it to ask that 'one
love one's neighbor as oneself?' Or to have compassion
for the weak, sick or poor, and to respond to the
needs of those less fortunate than oneself? Most of
the major religions teach this - although admittedly
far too few 'adherents' actually follow those
precepts.
Because of the excesses of the past (particularly in
Christianity, since I grew up in that faith) -
pogroms, the Inquisition, witch hunts, (etc.)Nth - I
call myself 'spiritual' rather than 'religious,' but
there are many good people, who have worked to combat
poverty, educate the ignorant and heal the ill (just
to name a few), who _do_ identify themselves as
'religious.' It doesn't mean that they've turned off
their brains or slavishly follow all the dictates of
their church or are "capable of *any* evil act." And
yes _of course_ there are too many who have, and
do...but one only has to look to the former USSR's
history to know that atrocity is _not_ limited to
people who believe in a deity for justification of
their actions.
As for "justifying any act," why then would there be
laws/commandments supposedly sent by a god and whose
breaking would lead to severe punishment ('hell' or
'Gehenna' or reincarnation as a cockroach)?
Fundamentalists of all ilk certainly try to justify
their hate-mongering by proclaiming it to be the "will
of God," but they have to ignore (at least part of)
their messiah's message. {For the record, I would
_not_ claim that executing child molesters was God's
will -- but it damn well would be MINE.}
And (now I'm nit-picking) how can you _disprove_ an
unprovable premise eg "There is a God?" (All those
catechism lessons, and I only remember that Martin
Luther said, "Faith alone!" - OK, and nailed the 95
Theses to the door at the Diet of Worms (Wurms?) and
started the Reformation...or something like that
<sheepish grin>.)
Debbi
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