--- Ronn!Blankenship <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> At 01:08 PM 6/15/03 -0700, Jan Coffey wrote:
>
> >You still don't get that form jeroen (and other's) perspecitve what was
> done
> >to him did appear to be abusive.
>
>
> Did you read the copies of his messages I sent you off-list? Do I need to
> send you copies of the rest of the messages he sent to the list in which he
>
> made threats against Nick, Julia, John, and others?
Yes in fact I referenced this in my message. Obviously this list ment quite a
bit to him. His actions at that point were intolerable, but I do not believe
that what I read necisarily constitutes a direct threat of the sort one would
need to be physicaly conserned about. They were clearly the words of someone
who had been deeply hurt and was lashing out in response. While I do not
condone this, and while I find these particular actions in and of themsleves
compleatly dispicable, I also wonder what kind of response you were
expecting. There are allways more than one way to deal with a situation, and
the response in question was compleatly forseable. Therefore if you choose to
take the action and you know what the response will be, how can you then
speak of that response as if it were proof that the action you took was
corect.
While I think that what JvB did was absolutly wrong, while I think that his
"wall of Shame" is dispicable, while I disagree with his actions that put
this conflict in place, I also disagree with the actions which exaserbated
the conflict, the intolerance that prolongs it.
While every person must be responsible for their own actions, and while it is
sometimes necisary to simply allow others who are more skilled at phrasology
and spin to manipulate a situation, while it may be better to simply let
another win an argumant than start an incident, it certainly is also
dispicable for someone who is fully skilled at such manipulations to push
someone who isn't's buttons when they know full well what they will get as a
response.
It doesn't make the response anyones elses fualt but the one who took that
response, but I for one still find it just as much a disruption.
>
> If the guy is not mentally ill, he acts like he is.
I think many people would if they felt they were pushed into a corner. I
don't believe he is mentaly ill, but he might be. Does it really make any
diffence?
> He needs to
> _immediately_ quit monitoring this list,
Why?
> take down his "Wall of Shame",
That would help.
> quit sending unsolicited messages off-list,
I believe he would if he was never spoken of again on list.
>and get some professional
> help.
You know, you don't know that he isn't. Besides there is no reason to try and
be abusive. If you really think or feel that way, why must you say it?
Otherwise it's just an attack.
>And that is the most truly friendly request I or anyone here can
> make of him.
>
> I supported him as long as I could, hoping he would truly change his ways
> and would not have to be banned from the list. As I said in my off-list
> message, those were among the flood of messages he sent when it was made
> clear that he was indeed going to be banned, which was only after nearly a
> full year of an ever-worsening situation. His actions in the past eight
> weeks do not suggest that he has changed one bit.
>
> End of discussion as far as I am concerned.
Fine, you had your say.
How far down does one have to go, before you let them starT to climb back up?
Can we all just agree to his proposal and end this thing?
=====
_________________________________________________
Jan William Coffey
_________________________________________________
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