On 05/12/2007, at 8:06 AM, Nick Arnett wrote: > On Dec 4, 2007 12:47 PM, Charlie Bell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> >> If it's true scepticism, and not denialism. The US is a leader of >> science in spite of it's religiosity, not because of it. > > > It seems far more likely to me that the same freedoms that allow wacky > religious ideas (which is what we're really talking about, not > religion) to > grow are the same soil in which scientific growth thrives. Maybe > you can't > get one without the other.
Maybe you can't. But other countries with similarly advanced scientific research (the UK, Australia, Japan and so on) seem to get by with similar freedoms but with a lot less overtly religious nuttiness. > > > This is not to say that I'm in favor of any of the ways in which > some of the > religious wackos try to suppress science or replace it with > unscientific > ideas. However, I think we would be wise to fear that any sort of > repression of wacky religious ideas might also stifle the growth and > development of less wacky ideas. Legislating what people are > allowed to > think, in any form, opens a very dangerous door, in my opinion. People can think what they like. But non-science should not be allowed to be taught as science. And non-medicine should not be sold as medicine. > > > Fascism intended to suppress wacky religious ideas is no better than > any > other sort of fascism. I said nothing about suppression. I think the way to squeeze back the exploiters and loons is education. But in the US, the education system is being usurped. > > > Still, I'm entirely comfortable with aggressive criticism of wacky > religious > ideas, so long as the criticism is logical. Making illogical > arguments > against the illogic of the wacky ideas is worse than self-defeating, I > think. Sure. But if one thinks that all religious ideas are whacky, then it's hard to appear logical, because even engaging with nutty ideas can drag one to the same level. Charlie _______________________________________________ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
