---------- Original Message ----------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 11:46:36 -0700
>Let me clarify something here.
>
>IMHO, IF MS ever took over MM, CFMX would be dead. There's no way MS would
>subordinate their ASP.NET efforts for what they consider to be a less sophisticated
>platform.
>
>Having said that, CFMX is actually quite nice and is a reasonable competitor to
>ASP.NET/JSP/PHP/whatever. But it's not the best. And it's quickly losing ground in
>terms of "ease and time of development" and certainly loses in terms of building a
>reusable architecture (to Java).
But isn't that the point: that this is all your opinion?
You say "far superior", "less sophisticated", "Not the best" but this also your
opinion. The very article that began this discussion declares CF "as regarded
superior" - but that's only their opinion.
CF has, for 7 years now done three things very well:
1) Abstracted complex tasks into simple tools.
2) Followed the 80/20 rule (in that only 20% of functionality will be used 80% of the
time).
3) Given you extensive options to extend the language to make up for it's
omissions/weaknesses.
In this sense CF is far superior to its competators. The tools that most people need
are easier to use and those add complexity (for most people) are removed. Yes strong
typing has it's place, but would detract from CF. Yes full OO has it's place but
again, would detract from CF.
You can build the vast, vast majority of web applications faster, cheaper and (in MY
opinion) better in CF. For many apps (or, much more likely, small pieces of apps) you
will need more traditional "hard programming" skills (since we might agree that CF is
somewhat "soft programming") and CF gives you all the possible avenues to do that.
Does CF offer direct TCP Socket manipulation? Nope. Do the vast majority of web
applications need it? Nope. Can you do such a thing with CF if you absolutely need
to? Yup.
CF allows you to code in CFML (and CFScript and Java and, to an extent server-side
action script) directly. You can also code modules in Java, C++, Delphi, Visual Basic
(or any COM compliant language).
The argument that any language at this level is "better" at tiered applications is, I
think, silly - with certain minimum capabilities ANY language can be used to build as
componentized a system as you like. After a language reaches a certain point the
point is wholly one of architecture, not the details of implementation.
We also have a game of leap-frog being played. Are there features in ASP.NET that I,
as a CF developer, envy? Sure! Which is why there'll be a CF 7 (or MX2 or whatever
they'll call it). Are there features in CF that ASP developers envy? Sure! Which is
why we'll get .Net 2 (or whatever).
The industry is constantly bettering itself. Many of the features in ASP.NET that
were not in ASP are very clearly borrowed from CF. Just as many of the features in
JSP were borrowed from ASP and CF and all around.
It's my firm belief that using ANY of the big three tools you can build a successful
application. Each has their strengths and weaknesses, each has annoyances and
brillances.
Just like the Mac/PC religious wars this one can't be won because there is no winner -
no contender stands out so far above the crowd as to be clearly, unambiguously
superior.
For me personally nothing has been better than CF. Nothing has even come close. That
detracts nothing from JSP or ASP.NET however.
Lastly, as an aside, if MS bought Macromedia there's no reason to assume that CF Would
be completey out the window. It wouldn't, of course, exist in it's current state for
long, but (as you've so pointedly mentioned) ASP.NET is language agnostic: there's no
reason that CFML can't exist as a language layer in ASP.NET just as it does in J2EE.
IBM (a prime candidate to top any MS offer for MM by the way) is already pushing CFMX
heavily as a solution adjudct to WebSphere. MS could, if they choose, do the same
thing (and maintain CFs fanatically loyal developer base).
Jim Davis
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