interesting. Especially since I, like the reviewer, was all set to say ah well, Crichton... he writes *bestsellers* (yes I can be a snob at times). Apparently she likes it though :) I will take a look around for it, thanks <g>
Dana On Wed, 28 May 2003 14:47:58 -0600, Andre Turrettini <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > here it is: http://historymedren.about.com/library/weekly/aa033000a.htm > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Dana Tierney [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 28, >> 2003 2:01 PM >> To: CF-Community >> Subject: Re: Operation Iraqi Eradication >> >> >> personally, I was just quibbling about the use of the word Catholic. In >> my view this should have been Christian. Of course, I wasn't aware of >> those last couple of crusades either. I will take a look at these links >> a little later; they look interesting and I am an amateur medievalist. I >> love Ellis Peters and this is no doubt why on hearing crusades I think >> eleventh century <g> >> >> Dana >> >> On Wed, 28 May 2003 12:40:15 -0700, William Bowen >> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >> > zoinks!! >> > >> > Guess I'm not going to get any work done today after all... >> > >> > It seems that you have taken my remarks as anti-Catholic. Okay, I can >> > see how that interpretation could be made. It was not how they were > >> intended. >> > >> > Now consider this if you will: The Latin Church >> > (http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/09022a.htm) (western Europe, the >> > Americas, >> > etc. -- and not to be confused or lumped in with the Eastern/Byzantine >> > churches) traces its lineage to the Second Council of Nicaea >> > (http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/11045a.htm) in 787, the Catholic >> Church > as >> > an entity pre-dates the first Crusade. >> > >> > Do I believe that the Church of today is responsible for the >> > Crusades?(http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/04543c.htm) No I do not, it >> > is >> > as >> > you have said, largely a different entity. Be that as it may, the >> Church > has >> > roots going back many hundreds of years, many dark times and quite a >> few >> > bright spots too. >> > >> > The original question that was asked was: >> > >> >> So, when do you think we'll be able to call this the 5th Crusade :) >> > >> > my answer was: >> > >> >> er... when GW lays down his fundamentalist protestant beliefs, has >> >> himself >> >> baptised Catholic and then elected Pope. >> > >> >> IIRC the Crusades were about Catholics taking on Islam. >> > >> > Which, given historical data, is true, no? Arguably I did leave out > >> the >> > 15th >> > and 16th century crusades and for that I apologize, but by and large >> the >> > popes over a period of several hundred years were responsible for >> them. >> > >> > "These Holy Wars were essentially a papal enterprise." >> > (http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/04543c.htm) >> > >> > will >> > >> > >> > ----- Original Message ----- >> > From: "Haggerty, Mike" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> > To: "CF-Community" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> > Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 11:08 AM >> > Subject: RE: Operation Iraqi Eradication >> > >> > >> >> William - >> >> >> >> BS read what you wrote. >> >> >> >> And if you are in the church, it's just to light the candles with all >> >> your >> >> flames. >> >> >> >> M >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >> From: William Bowen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >> Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 1:41 PM >> >> To: CF-Community >> >> Subject: Re: Operation Iraqi Eradication >> >> >> >> > The church of the middle ages in NO WAY represents the modern >> > >> church >> >> >> >> Didn't say that it did... >> >> >> >> > mass was conducted in latin and sometimes greek >> >> >> >> Mass was conducted in Latin (officially) in the Catholic church until >> > ~1965, >> >> the Second Vatican Council (aka Vatican II) under Pope John XXIII -- >> >> http://www.vatican.va/archive/hist_councils/ii_vatican_council/ >> >> officially >> >> put an end to that practice. >> >> >> >> <snip url >> >> http://www.hamptonroads.com/pilotonline/news/nw1222kne.html> >> >> The Second Vatican Council, held from from 1962 to 1965, aimed to >> create >> a >> >> spiritual renewal of the church. Liturgical reforms, such as ending >> the >> >> requirement that priests speak in Latin while leading worship, >> >> encouraged >> >> the participation of lay Catholics in church services. </snip> >> >> >> >> > Stop talking about something you know absolutely nothing about, >> >> > it's ignorant and offensive and doesn't reflect well on you. >> >> >> >> Really...I've been Catholic for 34 years (since about two weeks after >> >> I >> > was >> >> born), so thanks very much for the suggestion. Guess I'll take it >> >> under advisement... >> >> >> >> or not... >> >> :) >> >> >> >> will >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> >> From: "Haggerty, Mike" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> >> To: "CF-Community" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> >> Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 10:18 AM >> >> Subject: RE: Operation Iraqi Eradication >> >> >> >> >> >> > The church of the middle ages in NO WAY represents the modern >> > >> church. The mass was conducted in latin and sometimes greek, the >> > >> 'teachings' were not unifed between the Jesuits and other sects >> > >> within the church, the leaders >> >> of >> >> > the church occupied positions of political power more in keeping >> >> > with a >> >> head >> >> > of state than what the current Catholic church represents. Just as >> >> > times change, so does the role of the church in secular life. >> >> > >> >> > Stop talking about something you know absolutely nothing about, >> >> > it's ignorant and offensive and doesn't reflect well on you. >> >> > >> >> > M >> >> > >> >> > -----Original Message----- >> >> > From: William Bowen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >> > Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2003 12:02 PM >> >> > To: CF-Community >> >> > Subject: Re: Operation Iraqi Eradication >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > right. >> >> > >> >> > and though they might have been called "christians" at the time; >> >> > the teachings, worship services, etc. were what are today known as >> >> > "Catholic" >> >> > >> >> > will >> >> > >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| Archives: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?forumid=5 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/index.cfm?method=subscribe&forumid=5 This list and all House of Fusion resources hosted by CFHosting.com. 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