Eric, I applaud your comments.
Although Matt Liotta is extremely smart and has a great deal of knowledge about ColdFusion (as well as the strict legal language of NDA's) the behavior you describe and that we all have witnessed on this list should prove that other than respecting his intellect he must not care what people think about him. Far too often he seems intent on brow beating people into submission just to prove how much smarter he is than everyone else. I for one find that somewhat disturbing. Brendan "Davis, Eric" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>@cfczone.org on 03/24/2003 04:31:37 PM Please respond to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: "'[EMAIL PROTECTED]'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> cc: Subject: RE: [CFCDev] MVCF at benorama.com Do you fail to see the following points: A- The data is new to many of us: you are not the only ColdFusion developer in the world. B- You are an extremely coarse individual, and your brash tone has caused me to consider dropping this list like a bag of rocks. I know you are allegedly a "Brilliant Mind" involved with CF, however, that doesn't mean you immediately garner my respect. You, like all others, must earn it. Treating EACH AND EVERY ONE OF US on this list as though we were bratty children is doing nothing toward either our willingness to continue on this list nor your standing in the eyes of lots of damned good developers. That's all I have to say. -- Eric C. Davis Programmer/Analyst Georgia Department of Transportation Office of I.T. Applications 404.463.2860.158 [EMAIL PROTECTED] -----Original Message----- From: Matt Liotta [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, March 24, 2003 4:22 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [CFCDev] MVCF at benorama.com First of all, I didn't state that CFCs don't scale. I stated that the use of CFCs as models as part of the MVC pattern doesn't scale. This is an important distinction. Second, I didn't make the statement out of the blue. This issue has been extensively discussed on this very list with evidence provided by many people including myself. I'm sorry if you missed those discussions, but I am not especially eager to restart them when it seems there is no new data to consume. Matt Liotta President & CEO Montara Software, Inc. http://www.montarasoftware.com/ 888-408-0900 x901 -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jeff Battershall Sent: Monday, March 24, 2003 4:12 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [CFCDev] MVCF at benorama.com Matt, Not to be combative, but it's not all that helpful to say that "CFCs don't scale" without providing evidence, and the context of the problems observed,�i.e., what platform, what code, what conditions.� This is an important issue from my perspective.�� I'm using CFCs extensively, and besides our friend the Page Context Bug, things have been going great.� I like the fact that I am able to effect a�cleaner separation of biz logic/presentation, and move toward a more elegant pattern of development. And that's not mentioning the ability to drive different clients with web services. So before we�label CFCs as "not ready for prime time" or some such, more data is needed. Jeff -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Monday, March 24, 2003 3:39 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [CFCDev] MVCF at benorama.com Well 30k page views per day breaks down to less than 1 per second, which even a badly written application should be able to handle on the hardware you mentioned. Matt Liotta President & CEO Montara Software, Inc. http://www.montarasoftware.com/ 888-408-0900 x901 -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Robert Bailey Sent: Monday, March 24, 2003 3:28 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [CFCDev] MVCF at benorama.com Yeah, maybe I have been blessed, lol. As I said, I have had different reactions with MX server on a regular basis, especially when sand box security is installed. Hardware: Dual 2.4ghz Xeon 15k RPM SCSI drives (no RAID) 1 gig registered ECC ram Load, if you are asking by page views, about 30k page views per day. This what you were asking? Thanks! Robert Bailey Famous for nothing -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Monday, March 24, 2003 3:21 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [CFCDev] MVCF at benorama.com It is wonderful that you didn't have any problems. However, that doesn't really speak to whether or not there is scalability issues with the use of CFCs for models in MVC. What kind of hardware are you using to obtain what kind of load? Matt Liotta President & CEO Montara Software, Inc. http://www.montarasoftware.com/ 888-408-0900 x901 -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Robert Bailey Sent: Monday, March 24, 2003 3:06 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [CFCDev] MVCF at benorama.com I have not had any problems on my latest application, using Windows 2000, CFMX with updater 3, and IIS 5 But then, I have developed applications on one MX server and when moved to a production MX server it behaved differently, even when the configuration was the same. Go figure. The only problem I came across this last project is how MX does not like to play with some objects nicely, so I had to give some of the work to ASP, but played together rather nicely. Thanks! Robert Bailey Famous for nothing -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Matt Liotta Sent: Monday, March 24, 2003 3:01 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [CFCDev] MVCF at benorama.com The testing I have conducted shows that the using CFCs as models in an MVC pattern will not scale without serious hacks. It is possible that a framework will emerge that provides these hacks, but I haven't seen any as of yet. Please look to the archives of this list for discussion of these scalability issues. Matt Liotta President & CEO Montara Software, Inc. http://www.montarasoftware.com/ 888-408-0900 x901 -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Davis, Eric Sent: Monday, March 24, 2003 1:55 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [CFCDev] MVCF at benorama.com Link: <http://www.benorama.com/coldfusion/> Word ver.: <http://www.benorama.com/coldfusion/patterns/MVCF.doc> Has anyone looked really hard at this one? What are everybody's thoughts on this? I'm looking for a replacement to Fusebox 3 for MX - FBMX is too slow coming, and probably won't make much sense anyway (I'm guessing it'll be quite obfuscatory and rather difficult to implement the first five to ten times). He's put together quite a presentation, and he about has me convinced, if only I can simplify the structure a bit. I'm trying to find the right methodology for my team here to use, and they're NONE of them big methodology-users. Anyway, just haven't seen any threads about this, and wondered if you folks had anything to say on the subject. Which of course you must; you always do. ;) Thanks, ecd. -- Eric C. Davis Programmer/Analyst I Georgia Department of Transportation Office of I.T. Applications 404.463.2860.158 [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---------------------------------------------------------- You are subscribed to cfcdev. 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