As I said before, Jo Ann. You do not read the posts, nor the order in which they are posted very carefully. Myra Savant
>From: Jo <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: The Cavalier King Charles Spaniel List ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [CKCS-L] genotype v phenotype >Date: Sat, 8 Dec 2001 19:01:02 -0500 > >Oh my again! >Myra, she clarified it for you. >You misunderstood her. >And I'm finished speaking with you. ;-) >Kindest regards. >JoAnn > > > "If it is a quote from Renee, it certainly isn't clear." > > > > Well, Renee was good enough to clarify it for you. Myra Savant > >> > > > >Even me? Oh my. > > >LOL > > >So you didn't write...* > > > > > will no longer want to have him siring puppies for them. Instead >of > > > > > focusing on the great dogs who you say have been maligned over the > > >years > > > > > based on hearsay and gossip, I would rather focus on the great >dogs > > >over > > > >the > > > > > years who have passed on their bad hearts, crummy hips and other > > > >genetically > > > > > transmitted diseases so that generations of their progeny can die > > >young, > > > > > live in pain and suffer. * > > >If it is a quote from Renee it certainly isn't clear. > > >Jo Ann > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Joann, you really don't read the posts very carefully. If you >re-read > > >the > > > > post, even you could tell that I am quoting Renee. So...if you have >a > > > > question about which great dogs??? Maybe you could direct your >question > > >to > > > > the person who originated the phrase?? Myra Savant > > > > > > > > > > > > > >What "great dogs' are you talking about? > > > > >Of course you won't say just make cowardly accusations. > > > > >Jo Ann Carvill > > > > >BJ Cavaliers > > > > >[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > >www.bjcavaliers.com > > > > >----- Original Message ----- > > > > >From: "Myra Savant" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > >Sent: Saturday, December 08, 2001 3:29 PM > > > > >Subject: Re: [CKCS-L] genotype v phenotype > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Renee, please don't consider this a flame because I am glad you > > >posted > > > > >and > > > > >I > > > > > > see the points you are trying to make. Please don't compare >people > > >with > > > > > > AIDS to dogs. We simply are not dealing with the same problems. >A > > >dog > > > > >with > > > > > > a bad heart doesn't lose his job, or the respect and caring of >his > > > > >family > > > > >or > > > > > > friends. He isn't even remotely contagious and so that piece of >the > > > > >whole > > > > > > thing never even comes up. There is no social stigma attached >to > > > > >acquiring > > > > > > a bad heart as there unfortunately is with AIDS. If a dog with >a > > >bad > > > > >heart > > > > > > is publicly known to have a bad heart all that happens to him is > > >that > > > > >people > > > > > > will no longer want to have him siring puppies for them. >Instead >of > > > > > > focusing on the great dogs who you say have been maligned over >the > > >years > > > > > > based on hearsay and gossip, I would rather focus on the great >dogs > > >over > > > > >the > > > > > > years who have passed on their bad hearts, crummy hips and other > > > > >genetically > > > > > > transmitted diseases so that generations of their progeny can >die > > >young, > > > > > > live in pain and suffer. If I have to choose between protecting >the > > > > > > reputation of a "great dog who has been maligned" or the >puppies > > >that > > >I > > > > >am > > > > > > responsible for, my puppies and their little tiny hearts win >every > > > > >single > > > > > > time. Myra Savant > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >From: Renee Bruns <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > > >Reply-To: The Cavalier King Charles Spaniel List > > > > > > ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > > >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > >Subject: Re: [CKCS-L] genotype v phenotype > > > > > > >Date: Sat, 8 Dec 2001 12:48:57 -0800 > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Myra wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > While I agree that people are more inclined to support a > > >registry > > > > >that > > > > > > > > publishes good news, I still wish that we had an open >registry > > >that > > > > > > >gives > > > > > > >us > > > > > > > > all the known information. By having access to that > > >information, > > >we > > > > > > >could > > > > > > > > start to piece together the puzzles about carrier status and > > > > >recessives. > > > > > > >We > > > > > > > > would be able to know more about the genetic baggage that >our > > >dogs > > > > >are > > > > > > > > carrying. I know that you are correct that if people were > > > > >mandatorily > > > > > > > > required to report all of the testing information in any > > >society, > > > > >they > > > > > > > > simply wouldn't test. I'm not sure why that is, but I >suppose > > >it > > > > >has > > > > > > > > something to do with the competitive nature of showing dogs >for > > > > >sport. > > > > > > >All > > > > > > > > we can do at this point is the best we can do. Myra Savant > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >I work with clients living with AIDS. If we were to force >testing > > >and > > > > >open > > > > > > >reporting, I'm afraid we would have many people refusing to be > > >tested > > > > >for > > > > > > >fear of being "outed" or worse! Just imagine the ramifications >of > > > > >that! > > > > > > >Now, please don't flame me. I am well aware of the differences > > >between > > > > > > >AIDS > > > > > > >and health testing, with open reporting, of our Cavaliers, but > > >please > > > > >just > > > > > > >think about all the great dogs who have been so maligned over >the > > >years > > > > > > >based on hearsay and gossip. > > > > > > > > > > > > > >IF (and in my mind it's a very big IF), an open registry really >was > > >to > > > > >be > > > > > > >used for the good of the breed, I'd support it wholeheartedly. > > > > >Instead, > > > > > > >what I (and many of the people I know in this breed) >unfortunately > > >have > > > > > > >been > > > > > > >witness--and sometimes recipients--of is more like a witch hunt > > >when > > > > > > >someone > > > > > > >has a problem in the breed. And, it seems that the more >successful > > > > >someone > > > > > > >is, the more maligned their dogs are. > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Again, please don't flame me. I certainly support health >testing > > >and > > > > >the > > > > > > >sharing of information for breeding purposes. All I'm saying >is >an > > > > >open > > > > > > >registry as has been suggested is just not realistic. > > > > > > > > > > > > > >I also wholeheartedly agree with Janice and the others who made >the > > > > >point > > > > > > >that just because all results are not in an open database does >not > > >mean > > > > >we > > > > > > >don't test. I'm guilty of not sending in heart, eye and knee > > >results > > > > >on > > > > >my > > > > > > >dogs, too. And, since most of my dogs are under 2 or have just > > >turned > > > > >2, > > > > > > >I'm just starting to do hips. > > > > > > > > > > > > > >I would love to see the day when health testing is just done by > > > > >everyone > > > > > > >and > > > > > > >not used as a marketing tool or as a means to imply that >someone > > >else > > > > >isn't > > > > > > >part of a "premiere" group of breeders. Maybe there's another > > >reason > > > > >test > > > > > > >results are not being supplied to someone expressing an >interest >in > > > > >using > > > > >a > > > > > > >dog. Maybe it's their way of saying the dog is not available? > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Renee Bruns > >========================================================= >"Magic Commands": >to stop receiving mail for awhile, click here and send the email: >mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20NOMAIL >to start it up gain click here: >mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20MAIL > > E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. >Search the Archives... http://apple.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ckcs-l.html > >All e-mail sent through CKCS-L is Copyright 1999 by its original author. _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ========================================================= "Magic Commands": to stop receiving mail for awhile, click here and send the email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20NOMAIL to start it up gain click here: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?body=SET%20CKCS-L%20MAIL E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. Search the Archives... http://apple.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ckcs-l.html All e-mail sent through CKCS-L is Copyright 1999 by its original author.
