> On Jul 17, 2019, at 10:12 AM, Jim Jagielski <j...@jagunet.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>> On Jul 17, 2019, at 12:41 PM, Kenneth Knowles <k...@apache.org> wrote:
>>
>> On Wed, Jul 17, 2019 at 9:20 AM Joan Touzet <woh...@apache.org
>> <mailto:woh...@apache.org>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hey y'all,
>>>
>>> On 2019-07-17 7:53, Jim Jagielski wrote:
>>>>> On Jul 17, 2019, at 2:56 AM, Bertrand Delacretaz <
>>> bdelacre...@apache.org> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, Jul 17, 2019 at 1:11 AM Dave Fisher <wave4d...@comcast.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>>>> ...I’d like to see the Apache Way described like Euclidean Geometry....
>>>>>
>>>>> I have no clue what this would look like but I'd love to see a blog
>>>>> post of yours describing that vision.
>>>>>
>>>> +1
>>>
>>> This was where I was aiming with my original post on board@ (which many
>>> of you may not be able to see).
>>>
>>> I mentioned I often refer to Shane's summary because it's simple,
>>> concise, and includes the why as well as the what. But I'm aware that
>>> it's just one viewpoint - the website makes that perfectly clear, too.
>>>
>>> It's been said to me that a lot of The Apache Way can't be written down,
>>> and I would like to challenge that assertion. I'd also like the people
>>> who claim to know the Way best to work as hard as possible on that, too.
>>>
>>
>> We need all those voices of how people interpret The Apache Way. And as
>>> Dave hints, we can triangulate its essence with more and more
>>> descriptions. I think it'd be premature to try for that triangulation
>>> without interested parties working on capturing it for themselves first,
>>> revised for a 2019 perspective.
>>>
>>
>> Exactly. Sometimes when it is said it cannot be written down, it can mean
>> that it cannot be written down simply and declaratively. Or that it cannot
>> be expressed by being written just once or one way or by one or a few
>> people. The concepts in a novel, an ethnography, or a biography, or even
>> short parables, for example, cannot be simply extracted and written as
>> declarations. The practices of a culture cannot be described fully either,
>> nor transmitted by reading. It may be that the large corpus of writing and
>> slideshows and talking about The Apache Way is a great way to, in fact,
>> write it down. And IMO in such a situation it is important to keep writing
>> about it, and have new people keep writing their take, and to share stories
>> about it. Etc. And of course, it should be expected to constantly change.
>>
>> Kenn
>>
>
> That is why Sally and I have pushed for Apache Way training similar to what
> Sally does with her media training... open discussion, time for Q&A, that
> sort of thing. Sure, writing it down and having it documented is useful, but
> that isn't a complete solution, nor does it solve the problem completely.
A page at way.apache.org would be good. Here’s is what I had in mind when I
mentioned Euclidean Geometry. All of it follows from five postulates which are
statements.
Jim - since you are a Founder I am asking you:
What are the postulates to the Apache Way as simple statements with the
elegance of Euclid?
Regards,
Dave
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