> There is another thing also: the sentiment of belonging. This is a really good point Bruno.
My point is that it's much simpler for contributors to join Apache. We just use another mailing list, use another repository URL for commits, etc. But, we have 1.5 million users. And the website, the forums, the mailing lists, the wikis are for them too. And we have to do this transition really well. --emi On Fri, Oct 7, 2016 at 3:27 PM, Bruno Souza <[email protected]> wrote: > Two things: > > +1 to migration of the lists happening non-automatically and devs first. > +1 to starting with default Apache lists > > I agree with Bertrand: the Apache brand is important for the Foundation, > and we should have the mindset to move towards everything .apache.org. > > There is another thing also: the sentiment of belonging. We are a separated > community, and the more we insist in do what we always did (we start with > domains and mailing lists, but pretty soon we will be wanting to keep our > processes and more...) the harder will be for us to accept belonging to > Apache and be accepted also. > > Yes, the netbeans.org domain will be owned by Apache, that can then set up > the correct redirections, and the search engines can deal with that easily. > > But I do favor that we become netbeans.apache.org. The faster we do it, > the > less impact we will have. > > Cheers! > Bruno. > > Bruno. > ______________________________________________________________________ > Bruno Peres Ferreira de Souza Brazil's JavaMan > http://www.javaman.com.br bruno at javaman.com.br > if I fail, if I succeed, at least I live as I believe > > > On Fri, Oct 7, 2016 at 6:24 AM, Emilian Bold <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > > Provided netbeans.org gets donated to the ASF > > > > ASF will get the domain, it's part of the proposal: > > > > Oracle owns trademark registrations for the NetBeans mark in the U.S. and > > > EU, and would donate those, including the name "NetBeans" and the " > > > netbeans.org" domain, to the Apache Foundation, along with other > > > artifacts, including the U.S. copyright registrations related to > > NetBeans. > > > The trademark and copyright transfers would be detailed in separate > > > documents. > > > > > > > > > > --emi > > > > On Fri, Oct 7, 2016 at 12:22 PM, Daniel Gruno <[email protected]> > > wrote: > > > > > On 10/07/2016 11:20 AM, Emilian Bold wrote: > > > >> > > > >>> > > > >>> Then, once out of incubation, we will migrate again from @ > > > >>> netbeans.incubator.apache.org to @netbeans.apache.org? > > > >>> > > > >> > > > >> Yes but that's seamless, redirects are automatic. > > > >> > > > > > > > > But I wonder, will all the Gmail and email client filters still work > > > > automatically? > > > > > > > > Even with automatic redirects people will suddenly find themselves > with > > > all > > > > the mailing list emails in the inbox because the filters won't match > > > > netbeans.incubator.apache.org anymore. > > > > > > > > > > > >>> And perhaps in a few years go back to the proper @netbeans.org > > mailing > > > >>> lists? > > > >> > > > >> I don't see why. > > > >> > > > > > > > > Why not? netbeans.org is a very visited site, easy to remember and > > it's > > > > what we used until now. > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > >>> Now that I think about it, is there a particular reason we cannot > > have > > > >> the > > > >>> Apache infra serve the existing @netbeans.org mailing lists? > > > >>> > > > >> > > > >> If NetBeans becomes an Apache project it lives at apache.org. The > ASF > > > >> is not just a hosting organization, it's a community of communities > > > >> who lives out of sponsorshing money and as such branding is > important. > > > >> > > > > > > > > So no Apache project has a distinct website and branding? > > > > > > Provided netbeans.org gets donated to the ASF, it would likely serve > as > > > the user-facing web site, whereas netbeans.apache.org would be the > > > _project_ web site (iow the developer-facing site). > > > > > > See cloudstack.org, openoffice.org etc - we do support and use other > > > domains, just not for mailing lists. > > > > > > > > > > > When Microsoft did Xbox they used xbox.com, not xbox.microsoft.com. > > > > > > > > Being too hard on this migration will diminish a lot of the NetBeans > > > brand > > > > value not to mention search engine ranking. > > > > > > > >> > > > >>> Also, could we try a staged approach for this migration? We sort > the > > > >> lists > > > >>> by number or users / activity and start migrating the smallest ones > > > first > > > >>> and leave the largest last?... > > > >> > > > >> I suggest migrating developers first and users later, once the dust > > > >> settles. > > > > > > > > > > > > I agree. > > > > > > > > > > > > >
