> I am worried that if nothing like that is allowed, there will never be a bundle of a JDK with "NetBeans" (as Apache cannot do it and others could not as well).
I think per Apache policy it's not possible. But the Apache folks are quite flexible, so perhaps Oracle (or Amazon or Azule or whatever) could reach some direct agreement with the ASF where such a bundle would be explicitly allowed? Not sure. --emi http://coolbeans.xyz/ - CoolBeans: An IDE for Java, JavaEE, PHP and more! On Tue, Jan 15, 2019 at 2:44 PM Jan Lahoda <[email protected]> wrote: > > Frankly, I wonder if there's a chance to allow some "good" uses, like "X > with Apache NetBeans N" or a "Bundle of X and Apache NetBeans N", provided > some basic conditions are met, like: > -the NetBeans is an officially released unmodified version > -it is clear which part is Apache NetBeans and which not. > > (And I admit the current Payara distribution probably does not fulfil these > conditions.) > > It is not quite clear to me if the policy prohibits this - i.e. this would > be distributing an official release of NetBeans, just packed together with > something else. Not any kind of a "modified" version. > > I am worried that if nothing like that is allowed, there will never be a > bundle of a JDK with "NetBeans" (as Apache cannot do it and others could > not as well). And "A bundle of a well-known programming platform and a > well-known IDE" does not look very appealing. > > Jan > > > On Tue, Jan 15, 2019 at 1:18 PM Emilian Bold <[email protected]> wrote: > > > I think it is dangerous from a legal standpoint for the (P)PMC to give > > further interpretation on what Apache wants. The Apache page is quite > > clear. > > > > We don't even need a page, but at most our own page should only be a > > single link to that page. We don't want to give conflicting > > information and then allow downstream users claim they were just > > following the NetBeans (P)PMC recommendation. We also have to keep in > > sync our page if / when the Apache page changes. > > > > PS: Also note that the Payara redistributed Apache NetBeans 10 bundle > > has a CDDL and GPL w/ CPE dual license (there's a NETBEANS_LICENSE > > file with the Apache License 2.0 content). Not sure what to make of > > this, which part is covered by what, etc. > > > > --emi > > > > http://coolbeans.xyz/ - CoolBeans: An IDE for Java, JavaEE, PHP and more! > > > > On Tue, Jan 15, 2019 at 2:04 PM Geertjan Wielenga > > <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > Yes. And didn’t know about this. Would be great if you’d take the lead > > and > > > put some basic content together on the Wiki as a starting point around > > > this, with the ultimate aim of having that on netbeans.apache.org. Or > > else > > > I will do so during this week — i.e., a summary of the discussions re > > > branding, bundling, references to apache.org and our own specificities. > > > > > > Gj > > > > > > On Tuesday, January 15, 2019, Emilian Bold <[email protected]> > > wrote: > > > > > > > And to give an example of NetBeans bundling: > > > > https://github.com/payara/ecosystem-netbeans-plugin/releases > > > > > > > > The Payara NetBeans IDE Plugins releases are plain plugins but also > > > > bundles of Paraya and NetBeans called > > > > 'PayaraPlugins.1.6.with.Apache.NetBeans.IDE' (there are bundles for > > > > Apache NetBeans 9 and Apache NetBeans 10). > > > > > > > > This seems to be against the provisions at > > > > https://www.apache.org/foundation/marks/faq/#products > > > > > > > > The resulting bundle is called 'Apache NetBeans 10', there is nothing > > > > to let users know this is a separate product. > > > > > > > > --emi > > > > > > > > http://coolbeans.xyz/ - CoolBeans: An IDE for Java, JavaEE, PHP and > > more! > > > > > > > > On Thu, Jan 3, 2019 at 5:40 PM Antonio <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > For the records, the License FAQ explicitly clarifies the "Powered > > by" > > > > > et al vs. TradeMarks: > > > > > > > > > > http://www.apache.org/foundation/license-faq.html#Name-changes > > > > > > > > > > Cheers, > > > > > Antonio > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > El 03/01/2019 a las 16:32, Antonio escribió: > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > > > > > "Powered by Spark" may be a good example for us: > > > > > > > > > > > > https://spark.apache.org/powered-by.html > > > > > > > > > > > > Quoting: > > > > > > > > > > > > ____ > > > > > > Names like “Spark BigCoProduct” are not OK, as are names including > > > > > > “Spark” in general. The above links, however, describe some > > exceptions, > > > > > > like for names such as “BigCoProduct, powered by Apache Spark” or > > > > > > “BigCoProduct for Apache Spark”. > > > > > > ____ > > > > > > > > > > > > Feliz Año, > > > > > > Antonio > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > El 03/01/2019 a las 14:09, Emilian Bold escribió: > > > > > >> Apache has a 'Powered by' program which seems a good fit for the > > > > NetBeans > > > > > >> Platform. > > > > > >> > > > > > >> --emi > > > > > >> > > > > > >> On Thu, 3 Jan 2019 at 14:52, Antonio <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > >> > > > > > >>> Hi all, > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> We should get Apache NetBeans added to the list of ASF > > Trademarks at > > > > > >>> https://www.apache.org/foundation/marks/list/ (NetBeans is > > already a > > > > > >>> tracermark of Apache, isn't it?). We should also mention that > > Apache > > > > > >>> NetBeans is a trademark of the ASF at the footer of all web > > pages in > > > > our > > > > > >>> site. > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> As we all there's a great ecosystem of apps built on top of the > > > > NetBeans > > > > > >>> Platform, and I think it could be good to acknowledge and promote > > > > this. > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> I don't think something like "Built on Top of the Apache NetBeans > > > > > >>> Platform" is contrary to the ASF tracemark policies. > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> Cheers, > > > > > >>> Antonio > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> El 03/01/2019 a las 12:04, Bertrand Delacretaz escribió: > > > > > >>>> Hi, > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>>> On Thu, Jan 3, 2019 at 11:22 AM Emilian Bold < > > > > [email protected]> > > > > > >>> wrote: > > > > > >>>>> > > > > > >>>>> Is it really wise to create a separate FAQ from the Apache > > > > trademarks > > > > > >>>>> pages?... > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>>> If you keep it minimal I think it's good - you probably just > > need > > > > 2-3 > > > > > >>>> good examples of naming for the types of things that people are > > > > doing > > > > > >>>> with NetBeans. > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>>> And of course point to the ASF trademarks pages and avoid > > > > duplicating > > > > > >>>> their information. > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>>> But that's a decision for this PPMC to make - whoever does the > > work > > > > > >>>> gets to decide, and that's not me ;-) > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>>> -Bertrand > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > --------- > > > > > >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > > > [email protected] > > > > > >>>> For additional commands, e-mail: > > > > [email protected] > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>>> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: > > > > > >>>> > > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> ------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > --------- > > > > > >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > > > [email protected] > > > > > >>> For additional commands, e-mail: > > > > [email protected] > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: > > > > > >>> > > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> > > > > > >>> -- > > > > > >> --emi > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > [email protected] > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: > > [email protected] > > > > > > > > > > For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: > > > > > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected] > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: > > [email protected] > > > > > > > > For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: > > > > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected] > > For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected] > > > > For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: > > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected] For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected] For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit: https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
