MrSinatra;584157 Wrote:
> exactly. so if you have base units that NEED something else beyond
> webui, you create demand for your own iwhatever remote apps. thats
> EXACTLY my point, and thus one reason why they should have one.
>
To me there are three things that makes Squeezeboxes unique in
comparison to other products:
- A display which you can view from a distance
- Great audio quality
- Synchronized playback between multiple players
The mass market users don't care about "great audio quality" and
"synchronized playback" and you want them to remove the display from
the base units.
I completely agree that removing the display would make it possible to
make the units a lot cheaper, the main reason being that you don't have
to invest in display hardware and you don't have to invest in user
interface software.
However, the problem is that a unit like that isn't unique, it's very
similar to devices from competitors with small or no display. To make
the device unique and more interesting than the competitors the
customers also needs to get the display and as we both agree the
display is going to cost.
They won't be satisfied with the TV or computer as the display because
they want to be able to use the device without a TV and without a
computer.
With a device like this, that also does video, you clearly get into
competition with AppleTV which results in that you either need to get a
lot lower than $99 or you have to offer something else than AppleTV. The
main disadvantage with AppleTV as an audio device is that it doesn't
have its own display, this is fine for video but it's not for audio. As
a video device it's main limitation is Apple's decision to try to
restrict video formats which forces users to convert their videos to
Apple's preferred format and also the fact that it needs iTunes on a
computer to play locally stored videos.
MrSinatra;584157 Wrote:
>
> how can you say that when you just mentioned the sheevaplug?
>
> i think you could use todays low cost yet powerful parts to combine a
> full SBS server and a player like the SBRec and have it work well for
> $199. if not yet, surely soon enough.
>
Sorry, I was thinking about a unit with display again, without the
display you will be able to create IMHO uninteresting cheap device
models for player, server and combo.
MrSinatra;584157 Wrote:
>
> thats the best counterpoint i've heard yet. the problem to me though
> is that logitech then has a missed opportunity cost in the form of lost
> revenue by not leveraging their own IP that they already paid to
> develop, be it SP or SBS. but you make a good point nonetheless. i
> suppose its a question of aggressiveness, (businesswise).
>
Do the math, what do you think it would cost Logitech to port SP to iOS
?
What do you think they would be able to earn on it through software
sells ?
Is there really any revenue in this ?
The issue is that people are willing to pay for hardware, $100 for a
hardware unit is cheap but $100 for a software that needed the same
investment as the hardware unit is expensive to most users. With the
App Store prices at $5-$10 there is simply not much money in the
software unless you are selling a lot. Unfortunately there isn't enough
Squeezebox owners that owns a iOS device or is willing to get one to
reach this amount of sold apps. In the App Store anything related to
Squeezebox is and always will be a niche market.
MrSinatra;584157 Wrote:
>
> not really. thats why i said "i do think there is a hole for a product
> that does that well."
>
Yes there is a hole, it would be great if there was a product that
would work great both as a video device and an audio device. The
problem is that the requirements and use cases for audio and video is
so different so a device like this would get expensive for everyone
that mainly wanted to use it for audio or mainly wanted to use it for
video.
The devices you are suggesting would only have the potential to be
excellent on video, to be excellent on audio they would also need a
stationary (non TV) display add-on and a fancy remote add-on.
Also, the problem if you do video is that unless you have the backbone
to also offer people to buy/rent movies and series people are going to
want the device to also do TV recording/playback. Logitech doesn't have
the backbone, so with Revue they instead selected to do an integration
with cable/satellite boxes. Apple have(or is trying to get) the
backbone, so with AppleTV they selected to skip the cable/satellite
integration and instead focused on making people rent/buy movies and
series through the AppleTV. The big limitation on the video market is
the content owners/broadcasting companies which isn't really interested
in a new distribution model. I personally believe Revue will fail
because it's too complex and I believe AppleTV's biggest problem is
that content owners/broadcasting companies are afraid to change their
distribution model and Apple don't seem to like subscription based
services. The issue for the content owners/broadcasting companies is of
course that one of their main income today is commercials and Apple is
not really into showing intrusive commercials the same way as they are
use to do it on normal TV. AppleTV still attracts me a lot, not as a
cable/satellite replacement but as a DVD/Blueray player replacement.
My point is that a great "video" product needs to offer a lot more than
being able to run and display an AVI/MPEG file on a TV. In the same way
a great "audio" product needs to offer a lot more than making it
possible for the user to select a song and output its sound through the
speakers. They might have common basic features and common hardware but
when we start to look at the stuff that makes them an excellent audio
or video product the requirements are a lot different.
MrSinatra;584157 Wrote:
>
> why would anyone, (except those who dislike apple stuff), get a SB when
> they can get an apple TV that will work with their apple remote and
> itunes AND do movies!? apple TVs only drawbacks are that in some usage
> cases you need a computer on, and that it is an apple product. other
> than that, it smashes logitech.
>
> the hole is for a non-apple, standalone product, that can do what apple
> TV does and more. thats the combo product i am proposing.
>
As most other Apple products the new AppleTV will continue to be better
than everything else in its market segment. The only two things you can
compete with if you are in the same market as Apple is openness and
price. Someone might say that you can offer more features, and that is
a selling argument for advanced users but for normal users Apple offers
all they need.
So you need to make something that differentiates your product from
anything Apple make if you are in the same market segment. Making a
good stationary audio product with display would do this, making a
combined product that does both audio and video would get too close to
AppleTV to make it attractive. There might possibly still be room for
video products that makes it easy to play any video format since Apple
tires to make it hard to use anything but their preferred format.
However, you still have to figure out something that makes your product
unique in comparison to Roku, Popcorn Hour and other similar video
products. The issue I believe every video product have is to get the
video file to the device, you have to make it easy to buy/rent content
to have a long term success in this market.
With the Revue, Logitech is clearly aware of this and that's why they
didn't just do a video player they did a video player with
satellite/cable integration. The satellite/able integration is the
thing that have the potential to make it unique.
If we aren't talking about the Revue, what would make a Logitech device
without a display unique and better at audio or video than the
competition ?
What is it with the Revue that doesn't make it the perfect audio/video
combination product ?
--
erland
Erland Isaksson ('My homepage' (http://erland.isaksson.info))
(Developer of 'many plugins/applets'
(http://wiki.slimdevices.com/index.php/User:Erland). If my answer
helped you and you like to encourage future presence on this forum
and/or third party plugin/applet development, 'donations are always
appreciated' (http://erland.isaksson.info/donate))
------------------------------------------------------------------------
erland's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3124
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=82366
_______________________________________________
discuss mailing list
[email protected]
http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
