I think, as HAL said, everybody should "sit down calmly, take a stress pill and think things over."
PDF's are all fine and good and I use them all the time at home and at work. But the fact is that when you print one out, the resulting piece of paper is no longer a "protected" anything. It's something you created yourself on your own printer, not the DX station. It should not count. It's no different than making a QSL with no authority at all. It will be nice for your QSL collection but don't try to submit it for anything. Trusted third party electronic verification is another thing entirely and that's why LOTW works well (I'm not talking usability, just its function ;-) There will always be a few cheaters but their existence doesn't affect the value of an individual's hard earned award done honestly. 73, Chris, W2PA From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fri Aug 17 12:18:54 2007 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (KQ8M) Date: Fri Aug 17 12:30:07 2007 Subject: [Dxbase] Re: Dxbase PDF QSL's In-Reply-To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Message-ID: <!&[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Actually I wasn't flaming but talking in general. Tim, KQ8M -----Original Message----- From: jim [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, August 17, 2007 11:26 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'Kamar'; 'Peter Dougherty'; 'Garth Hamilton'; [email protected] Subject: Re: [Dxbase] Re: Dxbase PDF QSL's I am sorry to hear about your hard times -- You really must be tinkering in the wrong hobby.. Perhaps in the 13 years you were off the air you could have looked for another hobby --- something that you did not have to put ANY money into it - I am sure that there is a hobby out there like that - I am just having a little problem thinking of one right now... You keep harping about LOTW --- I am sorry to burst your balloon but it is not free for everyone all over the world.. 25 years ago you could go to a Hamfest - buy a used station for a couple hundred bux - come home and scrounge a bit of wire and you were on the air... Yes I have what I feel is a fairly nice station - main rig TS-950SD - I should mention that it is 16 years old.. I worked hard and long to get new equipment and for the most part I have enjoyed the hobby and still do enjoy chasing DX - I have a ton of QSL Cards that will probably be thrown out or disposed of in one manner or the other BUT not while I am still alive... There is nothing stopping you from doing the LOTW bit - all the more power to you - but for you to say that we have to completely re- write the hobby because of advancements in technology is ridiculous.. What other hobby has changed so drastically because of people bitching about this or that - I defy you to name one...Sounds like your computer is more up to date that your Amateur station - maybe thats the way you should have gone after your 13 years away from THE hobby - after all you can do everything on a computer that you can do on Amateur Radio and then some.. Please do not try to " Flame me" when you admit that you have been away from the hobby and have lost 13 years of what has really been going on.. Do not ask for another reply to your messages - I have said my piece - Period... Jim VE3CM - [EMAIL PROTECTED] ----- Original Message ----- From: "KQ8M" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "'jim'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "'Kamar'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "'Peter Dougherty'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "'Garth Hamilton'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[email protected]> Sent: Friday, August 17, 2007 10:50 AM Subject: RE: [Dxbase] Re: Dxbase PDF QSL's > Jim's attitude is the reason we are where we are. Someone suggests > something > new and there are always some that say: "Let's just forget it!". > > Well, that is not the answer. The answer is progress. I have been off the > air for the past 13 years and just got back on this past March. In those > 13 > years the world has moved on and technology has taken over. Many amateur > organizations and companies are still in the stone age. Go to any ham > radio > companies website and tell me how easy it is to browse their wares and > place > an online order. OOOpppsss it's in PDF format with no price list. > > Although this LOTW is a step forward it is a long way off from being in > the > 21st century. Why not have the ability to upload and download cards > through > LOTW? OOpppssss They can't even keep the site up for too long at a time. > > My wife, who was not around in my ham days, thinks it is so stupid to have > to send for cards for everyone when there is the internet, when technology > has advanced so much. $2.00 per card for return postage + 90c for postage > and just getting DXCC is going to cost you $290 dollars. Ridiculous! The > part about being skilled to get your cards is the wrong way to think. > There > is no SKILL in getting cards. You send em, you get em. Ham radio has > turned > into one big contest and he who has the most money, wins! > > Many of you earn 6 figures but many of us do not! How many have a 1000MP > rig? I can't even think of one of those. Way out of my league. I use a > TS930, an AL1200 bought in 1993. All my antennas are pre 1995. I just > can't > afford stuff these days. I have to hope my rotor doesn't go bad because I > will not be able to replace it. It was bought in the late 70's. > > Off my soap box for now, > > 73's > Tim, KQ8M > > -----Original Message----- > From: jim [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Friday, August 17, 2007 9:30 AM > To: Kamar; 'Peter Dougherty'; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'Garth Hamilton'; > [email protected] > Subject: Re: [Dxbase] Re: Dxbase PDF QSL's > > Well Folks there is an easy way to end all this senseless stupid > debate... Drop ALL the awards programs.. No one and I mean no one would > have to bitch about not getting a card back from this station or that > station - no certificates to worry about ... > > We have done practically everything else to kill the hobby,,, > > Slowed the code down - to get more people into the hobby - didn't > work.. > Dropped the code - to get more people into the hobby - didn't work > Eased up on the theory to get more people into the hobby - didn't work > Some countries made the theory practically none existent - to get more > people into the hobby - didn't work.. > Canada is working on dropping the theory altogether to get more people > into the hobby - won't work. > > 23 channel CB's just might make a come back.. > > I get a lot of enjoyment from working DX and I take pride in being able > to get the cards back from as many of those contacts as I possibly can.. > Its > > part of the game and the people that are skilled at playing the game will > get a large percentage of their cards answered.. Everything that we do in > life is a challenge why should our hobby not have those hurdles to deal > with.. > > Yes - kill the Awards programs and that will solve the problem -- we > can > > always tell everyone " Oh Yes I Worked That One ".. The old been there - > done that - got the T-Shirt -- who is going to know any different.. > > Sorry guys -- just got sick and tired of reading about what everyone > wants to do - end result - driving another nail into the coffin of a once > worthwhile hobby.. > > > > > > Jim VE3CM - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Kamar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: "'Peter Dougherty'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "'Garth > Hamilton'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[email protected]> > Sent: Friday, August 17, 2007 8:54 AM > Subject: RE: [Dxbase] Re: Dxbase PDF QSL's > > >> >> The DXCC 'officials' need to get with the times. Log of the world is >> good >> step toward Electronic QSL confirmation (and that's all it is) However, I >> still don't have a nice card or a similar facsimile of the DX station's >> QSL. >> >> In my opinion, an electronic transmitted QSL confirmation via a >> 'protected' >> Adobe PDF or similar type of document, which is then printed, should be >> qualified as confirmation as would be with a 'paper' card transmitted via >> the mail. In the end we have a valid confirmation. >> >> Those folks worried about hams cheating, those that do, will continue to >> happen requardless of the transmission media. >> >> I'm personally tired of spending money, many times over, to obtain a >> 'new' >> confirmation with the results of only feeding money with out any results. >> I've been a Ham since 1963, and I've readily adapted to legal electronic >> transmissions. Every email that I send at work becomes a legal document. >> All of my documents at work are now formatted in Adobe PDF (protected) or >> XML formats (they become legal documents). >> >> Time the League broaden their DXCC horizons to included other electronic >> verification means. >> >> >> Ron NU1U >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >> On Behalf Of Peter Dougherty >> Sent: August 16, 2007 23:21 >> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'Garth Hamilton'; [email protected] >> Subject: RE: [Dxbase] Re: Dxbase PDF QSL's >> >> -------------Content Removed------------------ >> >> ______________________________________________________________ >> Dxbase mailing list >> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/dxbase >> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm >> Post: mailto:[email protected] >> >> >> -- >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. >> Version: 7.5.484 / Virus Database: 269.12.0/957 - Release Date: 8/16/2007 >> 1:46 PM >> >> > > > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.484 / Virus Database: 269.12.0/957 - Release Date: 8/16/2007 > 1:46 PM >
