I apologize as well. Sorry for the misunderstanding. Wouldn't you know
it...my
first response ever to this listing and I goof it all up!
-Tracey
----------
From: ecofem
Subject: Re: Re[2]: Forwarded message
Date: Wednesday, April 12, 1995 8:56PM
Multiple apologies for my igorance, and everyone else's!! didn't know
that ".au" means australia, realize that we Americans can be overbearing,
and so I GET IT already! No one else needs to tell me I, and others,
blew it, Okay?
So, maybe all of us should avoid unclear abbreviations, Aussies included,
huh? ;-)
Faith
>From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu Apr 13 09:42:05 MDT 1995
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 1995 11:36:47 -0400 (EDT)
From: Michelle_Covi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Overpopulation
To: Adelaide Chichorro Ferreira <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
> So the only thing I find really hard isnt really having to compete
> with other people at work, but rather having to compete in society with the
> increasing number of those that dont have kids, work too much, have lots of
> money to spend and developed this dangerous
>
> *who-cares-Ill-not-be-here-anyway-when-the-whole-thing-blows up* mentality.
>
> Now that *is* hard, I tell you!
>
> Adelaide
I wish we lived in a more cooperative, rather than competitive society.
I hope you are not suggesting that only people with children can and do
care about the earth. My experience is quite different from yours and
Jaynes. I don't believe that you do not need to have children of your own to
care for and help with the rearing of the next generation. In fact,
denial of your own "selfish genes" through adoption and caring for
relatives and neighbors may provide for a more diverse and deeply
connected community. I think the popular age of the "nuclear family" is
over (if it ever existed in the first place). I think most feminists agree
that the "nuclear family", isolated and confined to gender-oriented
division of labor doesn't generally work in women's or communities' favor.
I wish we had a world in which children didn't rely strickly on siblings
for playmates, but were friendly with children of many different ethnic
and cultural backgrounds. Sometimes children can even bring adults
together. Wouldn't it be wonderful if instead of parents feeling that
they were alone in caring about their children, we considered children to
belong to their community as a whole and cared for by all the adults?
Not only would parents feel more connected to other adults, but people
who are childless (either by choice, medical infertility, or because of
sexual orientation) could share in the learning experience of being a
parent.
Also- if increasing number of people are not having kids, then perhaps
your kids will not have to compete as hard as you.
Regards,
Michelle
>From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu Apr 13 10:12:27 MDT 1995
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 1995 09:13:51 -0700 (PDT)
From: Faith Freewoman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: More about .au & WA
I woke up this morning thinking about the annoyed message I posted last
night, and I want to say a bit more about it. I remember asking to have
it brought to my attention when I make assumptions on the list, and that
has been accomplished.
However, I'd like to invite the women who felt so annoyed about the error
to try another way of seeing what happened. In my case, I become so
involved in my favorite discussion groups that I feel a very close
kinship with the people on it, especially ones with whom I've shared side
posts. For all that she and I disagree now and again, I feel that
kinship with Kylie, and I think that "neighborhood" feeling is what led
to the assumption in my case.
I've also noted frustration with Americans in general being expressed on
the list more and more frequently. I'd like to add my request to that of
other American women on the list: If you feel that the list's viewpoint
is dominated by Americans, then please, join in! Say your piece!!! And
say it again!!! I think I can safely say that we found our way to the
ecofem list, all of us "Amurrican wimmin", because we're committed to
global environmental justice, and if we can't hear your voices, then we
remain ignorant of what is probably priceless knowledge and valuable
viewpoints. I think it's unlikely that those of us who like to talk will
cease doing so ... so join us, OK? Jump in, the water's fine!
Faith
>From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu Apr 13 10:19:44 MDT 1995
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 1995 09:21:08 -0700 (PDT)
From: Faith Freewoman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Catherine Lavender--H-AMSTDY Comoderator <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: The Environmental Historian's Problem (longish, X-ASEH-L)
In-Reply-To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
I was fascinated to read the collected environmental historians' posts,
and I would be VERY interested in what Catherine and others would propose
should be added to the initial set of questions. I'm especially
interested to see how the addition of gender issues might affect the
flavor, tone and probable effectiveness of the discussion and its
eventual actions.
Faith
>From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu Apr 13 12:18:08 MDT 1995
Date: Thu, 13 Apr 1995 14:18:35 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jayne S Docherty <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Michelle_Covi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Overpopulation
In-Reply-To: <Pine.3.89.9504131137.A22564-0100000@grits>
Michelle -- I agree with you very much on your observations about the
nuclear family and the creation of an expanded community. Actually, the
parents whose children I cared for when I did day care at home have formed
a "created extended family". When I closed the day care to return to
school, one of the other women also quit work to return to school and do
something she had wanted to do for years. All of the families worked
together to make cooperative arrangements for picking children up and
getting them to soccer practice, etc. I take two of the children every
morning, give them breakfast and get them all off to school along with my
own son. In exchange their parents take my son one evening per week each
-- feed him dinner, etc -- so I can go to my evening classes. Although
all of our children are either only children or single children of second
marriages where their half-siblings are much older -- they have many of
the same experiences that children from larger families have. We have
seen one child through a life-threatening illness, we have celebrated
birthdays together, etc., etc. In short -- in Washington DC where few
people have extended families around, we have made our own extended family.
In Adelaide's description of her relationship with her child care
provider I sensed the same bonding and sharing of life experiences and
resources.
I certainly would *not* argue that only those who have children are
somehow connected to the earth -- or are better connected than those who
do not. If anything I said implied that, please ignore it! I only
wanted to point out that having children is not *only* a drain on the
earth's resources and a distraction from environmental awareness -- as
some seemed to imply on the list.
Perhaps the issue is not whether or
not we have children of "our own", but rather how much responsibility we
take for *all* children and for their natural heritage.
Jayne
