Earl We are getting off subject. But here goes......
Interesting cite, but I don't think it is applicable. The new pricing Bill mentioned in his original post is not retroactive as far as I know. GS1 Canada is not related to X12/DISA, other then they are a member. So I don't think your experience with them is relevant to this discussion. I don't know if I agree with your 5 points. But you are entitled to your opinion. However, the standard does change over time, just look at the 214 in version 003070, 004010, and finally 005010 as an example. Similar in some respects, but clearly not identical. And backwards compatibility is never assured. You mean you charge for your software and or other services???? :-) It should be free. j/k of course Yes there is a lot of time and effort that goes into developing and maintaining the X12 Standards. I have been involved for over 25 years, over 20 as a chair of a subcommittee. Yes, I am a volunteer, well my company, Kleinschmidt, pays for my volunteer time. Getting back to the subject at hand. I too agree with Mike that this is not the way to price our standards. I have voiced that many times at the Steering Committee but it does not seem to be the opinion of the majority of members of the Steering Committee. >From a company perspective, we have been a good corporate citizen over the years. My time invested in the standard is paid for by Kleinschmidt. Before I joined Kleinschmidt 15 years ago, we had other folks involved. We have purchased the table data year after year, even when some versions are not being implemented. We do object to paying a renewal fee for something that we helped develop. Discussions here point to not purchasing 6050 at this time. I am hopeful that DISA will reconsider. Doug Doug Anderson Chair, Transportation Subcommittee Vice President Sales Support Kleinschmidt 847-405-7457 (office) 847-826-3531 (cell) http://www.kleinschmidt.com <http://www.kleinschmidt.com/> Socialize with Kleinschmidt <http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc6/179550_119888834821933_456161062 _n.jpg> <http://www.facebook.com/kleinschmidtinc> Like Us on Facebook <http://www.twitter.com/kleinschmidtedi> Follow Us on Twitter <http://www.linkedin.com/companies/kleinschmidt> <http://www.itunes.com/apps/kEDI> Click to Download kEDI -----Original Message----- From: Earl Wertheimer [mailto:ea...@spe-edi.com] Sent: Tuesday, July 02, 2013 12:06 PM To: EDI-L@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [EDI-L] Standards price change? Doug > We have had this discussion before, free vs. fee. I don't want us to head > down that rabbit hole again. You call it a rabbit hole. I would call it inevitable. > Bill's original post was concerning a change in pricing policy. Yes. I am reminded of the ill-fated decision to start sending invoices for UPC codes many years ago. http://www.barcodestalk.com/ucc-settlement <http://www.barcodestalk.com/ucc-settlement> My experiences with ECCC (Canadian branch of GS1) were not much better. A client had used a UPC prefix many years ago, but had 'forgotten' it. I had a record of it, but wanted confirmation. I contacted ECCC and asked them if they would tell the client what their UPC prefix was, so that they could start using it. THEY REFUSED. They said that the client would have to join ECCC and purchase a new code. I send a complaint to GS1. They ignored it. > However, you state that you have never purchased the X12 Standard. I am > curious, how do you write your EDI software without the base standard? In my small corner of EDI, all the specifications are published by the various Trading Partners. After doing a few dozen 210 or 810 documents, it doesn't require the published spec to figure out what's required and see what the common denominators are. Having the base standard is pretty useless because a) Most of it is not used b) If a Partner does something non-standard, what are you going to do? c) Partners publish their own requirements. d) the new version is almost identical to the previous version e) there are so many different interpretations and implementations of the base standard, that paying for it is a waste. Finally, I don't charge $60,000 for my software. I certainly appreciate the time and effort that goes into maintaining the standard, but your efforts are being abused. > -----Original Message----- > From: Earl Wertheimer [mailto: ea...@spe-edi.com <mailto:earlw%40spe-edi.com> ] > Sent: Tuesday, July 02, 2013 9:05 AM > To: EDI-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:EDI-L%40yahoogroups.com> ; Mike Rawlins > Subject: Re: [EDI-L] Standards price change? > > > > > Mike > > > I'm curious, if you don't mind: How many of you on this list routinely > > purchase the latest version of the X12 standard every year. > > Never bought it. > > The revenue goes to support inflated salaries and overpriced rents. > > In the few years that I saw DISAs financial records, the primary expense was > > salaries and benefits. > > Like any other bureaucratic entity, DISA exists to provide nice jobs for its > > employees. > > The X12 standard should be free. > > > On 6/28/2013 11:12 AM, Klaus-Dieter Naujok wrote: > > > > > > > > > On Jun 28, 2013, at 9:06 AM, Bill Lester wrote: > > > > > > > Klaus, so you think if I buy the CD and load the codes into my > > > business application, I am liable for the maintenance fee? Even if I > > > never use the CD again. > > > > > > That's my reading of the terms, since your business application is a > > > derivative of the product (the CD content). I don't agree with this > > > type of licensing and lucky for me, my products and services are > > > UN/EDIFACT based. > > > > > > Since we have a few X12'ers on this list, I am sure they can explain > > > in detail the implication of this new pricing scheme. > > > > > > Klaus > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > ... > > Please use the following Message Identifiers as your subject prefix: > <SALES>, <JOBS>, <LIST>, <TECH>, <MISC>, <EVENT>, <OFF-TOPIC> > > > > Job postings are welcome, but for job postings or requests for work: > <JOBS> IS REQUIRED in the subject line as a prefix.Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus > signature database 8514 (20130701) __________ > > > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > > > http://www.eset.com <http://www.eset.com> < http://www.eset.com <http://www.eset.com> > > > > > > > > > Earl Wertheimer > ea...@spe-edi.com <mailto:earlw%40spe-edi.com> <mailto:earlw%40spe-edi.com> > http://www.spe-edi.com <http://www.spe-edi.com> < http://www.spe-edi.com <http://www.spe-edi.com> > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ------------------------------------ > > ... > Please use the following Message Identifiers as your subject prefix: <SALES>, <JOBS>, <LIST>, <TECH>, <MISC>, <EVENT>, <OFF-TOPIC> > > Job postings are welcome, but for job postings or requests for work: <JOBS> IS REQUIRED in the subject line as a prefix.Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 8517 (20130702) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com <http://www.eset.com> > > > Earl Wertheimer ea...@spe-edi.com <mailto:earlw%40spe-edi.com> http://www.spe-edi.com <http://www.spe-edi.com> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------------------ ... Please use the following Message Identifiers as your subject prefix: <SALES>, <JOBS>, <LIST>, <TECH>, <MISC>, <EVENT>, <OFF-TOPIC> Job postings are welcome, but for job postings or requests for work: <JOBS> IS REQUIRED in the subject line as a prefix.Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EDI-L/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EDI-L/join (Yahoo! 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