Scott, et al,
I believe that someone else in this group could write a better
history of UL but I’ll provide a condensed version…
With the introduction of electricity in the latter part of the
1800’s in the US there were no ‘rules of engagement’ in application.
Scott is correct, after the electrification of the Chicago
World’s Fair and the ensuing fires the Insurance Underwriters panicked and
looked for someone who would inspect all electrical installation in buildings
(starting in Chicago, obviously) and give a good report before fire insurance
would be issued for the facility. Henry Merrill saw the opportunity and
accepted that job and began inspecting installations and, in the end, giving an
OK to the insurance companies when it was done ‘right’. He quickly saw that he
was looking at the same wire and components over and over again so approached
the manufacturers with the proposition that if they would work with him to
provide adequate components and wiring it would simplify the inspection work
on-site and make approval easier. insurance companies agreed with the concept
thus the Underwriter’s Laboratories were born. UL celebrated its 100th
anniversary before the turn of the 21st century so they have been around for a
while.
I’m sure that the situation was similar in many developed
countries at that time and similar organizations sprung up to meet the need to
provide adequate protection for users. The IEC had its initial meeting in St
Louis, MO, USA in 1904 and has been moving forward since.
(Hmmmmm… not too bad for an amateur)
Ok, history buffs, chime in too… (Maybe this should be a Friday
discussion)
:>) br, Pete
Peter E Perkins, PE
Principal Product Safety & Regulatory Affairs Consultant
PO Box 23427
Tigard, ORe 97281-3427
503/452-1201
<mailto:[email protected]> [email protected]
From: Scott [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Monday, July 25, 2016 1:40 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [PSES] Safety requirements in US
Hello all,
I believe labeling/ listing first came into place as a response from insurance
companies needing concise requirements defining fire hazards.
Underwriters Laboratory did not come from a group of VC's that thought it was a
cool name.
Scott, the other- other Scott
Sent from my iPhone
On Jul 25, 2016, at 4:32 PM, Ted Eckert
<[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]> > wrote:
OK, now I’m going completely off topic, but here is my opinion. This is only my
opinion and it does not necessarily reflect the opinion of my company or
anybody else.
I completely agree with Pete that consolidation is unlikely. Congressional
leaders reward members of their caucus by giving them committee positions, and
those committees become minor fiefdoms that congress members defend jealously.
Different organizations fall under the oversight of different congressional
committees. No one committee appears willing to give up the authority or budget
for their area to another committee.
Consolidation can happen, but only in extreme circumstances. Even then, it
doesn’t necessarily solve the problem. The Department of Homeland Security
(DHS) was created after the September 11, 2001 attacks. It consolidated a
number of organizations that fell under numerous oversight committees. The
result ended up having multiple committees reviewing DHS and approving the
budget. I welcome comments from anybody who feels that organizations
centralized under DHS have improved significantly due to the new structure.
(Intelligence sharing may be an example, but intelligence sharing was banned 40
years ago because of domestic spying abuses. Will it work better this time?
One common example of committees protecting their areas of interest is food
safety. Let’s say you want to buy lunch at Taco Bell. (I wouldn’t recommend it,
but it works for this example.) You order a beef burrito and it is covered
under the food safety regulations of the USDA. Your friend orders a bean
burrito and their lunch is covered by the FDA. It gets even stranger if
somebody orders fish. Which department covers fish depends on the species of
fish.
An electrical device could fall under CPSC, OSHA, MSHA, the FAA, the FDA, the
DoD or any one of a number of organizations for safety depending on its
intended use. As much as I hate to say it, my job exist partly due to
inefficiency in the regulatory environment.
O.K., I’ve vented enough for now. I’ll close my eyes, count to ten slowly and
then get back to work.
Ted Eckert
Microsoft Corporation
The opinions expressed are my own and do not necessarily reflect those of my
employer.
From: Pete Perkins [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Monday, July 25, 2016 1:03 PM
To: [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [PSES] Safety requirements in US
John, et al,
The WEB definition of NRTL is quite narrow. As we explained
earlier, Labeling/Listing by a NRTL approved lab is an NEC concept which is
administered by OSHA.
The placement of this responsibility came upon OSHA not by legislation but by
litigation when a test lab challenged the premise that, altho Labeling/Listing
was required, there was no way for additional test labs to get on the list.
The battle went all the way to the US Supreme Court and OSHA lost and,
subsequently, were forced to develop the NRTL acceptance program which they run
today.
Apparently the 2017 NEC will now require NRTL Labeling of products which will
continue to be honored by all 10k US Jurisdictions and enforced by the AHJs in
each.
I personally don’t see any effort to simplify or consolidate the US system any
time soon. Especially in the climate of Brexit and other forces presently at
work.
:>) br, Pete
Peter E Perkins, PE
Principal Product Safety & Regulatory Affairs Consultant
PO Box 23427
Tigard, ORe 97281-3427
503/452-1201
<mailto:[email protected]> [email protected]
From: John Woodgate [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Monday, July 25, 2016 11:53 AM
To: [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [PSES] Safety requirements in US
>From the WEB: NRTL Nationally Recognized Testing Laboratories, or NRTLs, are
>third party organizations recognized by the Occupational Safety and Health
>Administration (OSHA) under Federal code 29 CFR 1910.7 to provide product
>safety testing and certification services for products used in the US
>workplace.
With best wishes DESIGN IT IN! OOO – Own Opinions Only
<http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk/> www.jmwa.demon.co.uk J M Woodgate and
Associates Rayleigh England
Sylvae in aeternum manent.
From: Scott Xe [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Monday, July 25, 2016 5:42 PM
To: [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [PSES] Safety requirements in US
Hi John,
What is exact meaning of NRTL approved? Is it a sample for type examination
against applicable safety standard without production audits?
What are the differences between A2LA and NRTL?
From: "Tyra, John" <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >
Reply-To: "Tyra, John" <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >
Date: Monday, 25 July 2016 at 10:14 PM
To: <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >
Subject: Re: [PSES] Safety requirements in US
Some states have legal requirements for electrical products to be NRTL approved
From: Richard Nute [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2016 8:26 PM
To: [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [PSES] Safety requirements in US
Hi Scott:
For consumer and household products, compliance with CPSC requirements is
required.
No. Only products considered “substantial product hazards” such as hair dryers
need comply with CPSC requirements. However, any consumer product that injures
someone is subject to CPSC recall order.
What about OSHA?
Electrical products that are used by employees are required to be NRTL
certified.
Best regards,
Rich
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