In Europe, we only have 230V single phase and 3-phase (400V L-L). In
Britain, only very large houses have 3-phase but in other countries
3-phase is more common in homes. Most wall outlets are dual, and could
be fed from different phases, but this is very unlikely. There used to
be a minimum distance between outlets on different phases specified in
the IEE Wiring Regulations (now BS 7671) but that was dropped some years
ago.
Best wishes
John Woodgate OOO-Own Opinions Only
J M Woodgate and Associates www.woodjohn.uk
Rayleigh, Essex UK
On 2019-01-03 13:59, Kunde, Brian wrote:
Group,
This topic has resurrected a question I have always had about AC Mains
Power in Europe. I have always believed that 230Vac in Europe is
derived from 3-phase. I could see where a home or small business
might be powered only by a single phase, but wouldn’t a large company
or factory be powered by 3-phase and to which a single room or lab
would most likely have receptacles powered by different circuits on
different phases of the 380V?
Also, surge pulses can be cause by many sources that do not make the
surge common mode to an entire building, so it is most possible that a
“System” can see a surge on one power cord and not on all power cords.
Here is the States, our homes are generally powered by Split Phase AC
where the receptacles within the same room are on different circuits
and different phases. In Canada, it is common to have two phases of
208 powering 115V receptacles within the same dual receptacle.
Here at work within our lab (in the States), our 230V high powered
equipment is powered by its own dedicated 230V L-L circuit derived
from a 230V 3-phase transformer. Each 230V receptacle has its own
circuit and which could be on different L-L phases. Lower powered 230V
equipment is powered off a different transformer and all of our 115V
receptacles throughout the building is powered by one of 3-phases Line
to Neutral circuits derived from 208V 3-phase. It is common for
adjacent 115V receptacles to be on different phases. So a typical
system setup in our work area is almost guaranteed to powered by
different circuits, different phases, and different transformers
within our company’s multiple source power system. BTW, we also have
lighting powered by 277V derived from L-N on our 480V 3-phase power
which comes right off the pole. This 480V 3-phase powers the entire
building including all of our transformers.
Is this type of power distribution not common in larger facilities
within Europe?
*The Other Brian*
*From:*Larry K. Stillings [mailto:[email protected]]
*Sent:* Wednesday, January 02, 2019 5:16 PM
*To:* [email protected]
*Subject:* [PSES] IEC 61000-4-5 Surge Testing Single plug vs. multiple
plug system
All,
I received the following email from a customer today via their
customer addressing our application of surge testing. We are testing
laboratory equipment per IEC/EN 61326-1 and IEC/EN 61326-2-6 and
specifically are having failures with respect to surge on a system
that has multiple power cords. We are testing one power cord at a
time. Here are their comments
/we have never tested a system comprised of multiple instruments in
this way before. i.e. applying surge to one unit at a time – we have
always, with agreement from our customers, applied surge (and in fact
all tests) to all of the units plugged into e.g. a mains distribution
block all at the same time. Especially for surge, it seems unlikely
that in the real world any real surge on the mains supply would not
affect all things in a system as it is very likely they are all
plugged into the same mains circuit in e.g a particular room. To
further bolster this, we have made comment to customers in the past
that it could be noted in the manual to ensure this is the case./
/ By applying surge to all units at the same time, we maintain all of
their supply voltages at the same level. I can see how, by applying a
surge to a single part of the wider system, communications issues
could occur as suddenly the points of reference (i.e. reference
voltages) for different parts of the system could be pulled away from
each other by the surge./
/Testing a system by applying the tests to all at once, rather than a
single item at a time, isn’t necessarily an “easy way out“ either. For
other tests e.g. conducted emissions, where noise transmitted from the
unit under test back onto the mains supply is measured, passing is
made more difficult by measuring all units at once. Where in this case
one at a time would be much more favourable. Our test house has always
advised that we can choose, either all tests one at a time, or all
tests applied to all through a mains block, but we cannot mix and
match between different sections for the conducted EMC tests./
I know this brings up all sorts of questions, however I would like to
focus on the surge testing at the moment. I am pretty sure at least
one of the standards says conducted emissions shall be tested on each
port individually, but we don’t need to go there right now ;-)
Thoughts when you get responses like this?
Larry K. Stillings
Compliance Worldwide, Inc.
*/Test Locally, Sell Globally and Launch Your Products Around the World!/*
*/FCC - Wireless - Telecom - CE Marking - International Approvals -
Product Safety/*
357 Main Street
Sandown, NH 03873
(603) 887 3903 Fax 887-6445
www.complianceworldwide.com <http://www.complianceworldwide.com>
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