The pay walls, axis limits and markups on accessories are the reasons I avoided centroid.
The thing I love most about Linuxcnc is the flexibility, reliability and yes, classicladder - or at least ladder based plc in general, which makes it incredibly easy to figure out for someone with an industrial electronics background. I do miss some of the functionality of industrial controls inside of LinuxCNC that I think should be implemented, but all in all, it's an incredible tool. I do think that in order for it to gain traction, it needs some more "black box" usability, though. As an example, an input sniffer to assign hal pins to button presses on a game controller or hardware buttons on a Mesa card would be kinda cool to implement. Phil T. The Feral Engineer Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction: www.patreon.com/theferalengineer On Mon, Dec 27, 2021, 4:38 PM gene heskett <ghesk...@shentel.net> wrote: > On Sunday, December 26, 2021 1:30:42 PM EST John Dammeyer wrote: > > Hi Mark, > > I'll summarize your basic premise here that all machines are different. > > That's true! > > > > And MACH2/3/4 has a huge user base without ever needing a command line > > editor. So if it can be done for Windows then certainly it can be done > > for LCNC. > > > > Having said that I'm also not suggesting we do away with the underbelly > of > > what is LCNC. Please recall my original post in this subject. The > > ACORN based system cannot run an old iron system with existing servo > > drives. It's likely it can't even run a system with a STMBL drive that > > faults on low power supply voltage which mine does because I have a soft > > start delay on mine so ENABLE shows up before the Voltage is there. > > Doesn't look like it can even do step/dir for the spindle (which MACH3 > > can). So there is a place for the 'raw' LinuxCNC install and HAL/INI > > file model. > > > > But that user I mentioned wasn't interested in learning a new OS and the > > ACORN was a one stop shop for the Ethernet controlled step/dir/VFD/IO > > board and windows CNC software. He went with Clearpath Servos so he > > wasn't adverse to spending money. He could just as easily have installed > > LCNC 2.8.2 and the MESA board with terminal strips and used the config > > screens in AXIS and I suspect for less money. But the LinuxOS itself > > appeared to also scare him away so he likely would never be a user. > > > > I think everyone who likes using an editor for configuration and issuing > > multiple commands with a command line interface has already been brought > > over to the dark side so to speak. They aren't the market for expanding > > the LCNC user base. > > > > I've attached a screen shot of something I've been playing with. Took > > about an hour to write using a modern GUI based software development > > tool; in this case Lazarus Free Pascal. The TCanvas Property has all > > sorts of drawing tools so I thought I'd take a quick look at the Axis > > source code. To see how easy it would be to port over the Preview screen > > to Pascal. > > > > I was immediately reminded of something I written many years ago by > > Nicholas Wirth the author of Pascal. "Those who learn Fortran as their > > first language are brain damaged for life". Rather harsh actually and > > taken out of context appears elitist . OTOH, 4195 lines of essentially > > undocumented python code does look like a lot of the Fortran code the > > Electrical Engineers were writing in University while we in the Comp Sci. > > stream were writing in structured languages Algol-68. And those were not > > for GUI type interfaces which add to complexity. > > > > For example: > > if o.canon: > > x = (o.canon.min_extents[0] + o.canon.max_extents[0])/2 > > y = (o.canon.min_extents[1] + o.canon.max_extents[1])/2 > > z = (o.canon.min_extents[2] + o.canon.max_extents[2])/2 > > o.set_centerpoint(x, y, z) > > > > If you go searching for o.cannon you find: > > o.canon = canon = AxisCanon(o, widgets.text, i, progress, arcdivision) > > > > Search for AxisCAnon and we find the object definition: > > class AxisCanon(GLCanon, StatMixin): > > > > Now we're into the include side of things where the rs274 library is > > needed: from rs274.interpret import StatMixin > > from rs274.glcanon import GLCanon, GlCanonDraw > > > > which takes us to here: > > https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/blob/master/lib/python/rs274/ > glcanon. > > py which is another 1886 lines of undocumented code. > > > > The excuses that will be made for no documentation will be the same ones > > given for command line operation of Linux and LCNC. It's much better > > than windows or it's self documenting. You just have to learn a few > > commands and you can do so much more than with windows........ > > > > I believe we need to step outside the box and ask ourselves this > question. > > How can we attract more people who just want simple CNC (maybe without > > limit switches even), a VFD and encoder on the spindle and possibly > > coolant or a few other outputs. > > > > One really simple way is that the companies (or people) building the > > intelligent CNC controls like the MESA change their web sites to have at > > least one menu choice for "SimpleCNC". > > > > I went here: > > http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?LinuxCNC_Supported_Hardware > > > > Eventually with more Google searching I ended up here: > > http://store.mesanet.com/index.php?route=product/ > product&product_id=290&se > > arch=7i76e > > That is a very nice board, I use 2 of them myself, but not in the E > version. I use the much cheaper parport version. Why? I refuse to give up > my only ethernet port just to carve metal. The net access is much much > more > useful to me. > > > That link to the page I think would be best right at the top of the MESA > > site. And on that page should be a link to a page with a pictorial > > connection diagram like: > > https://www.centroidcnc.com/centroid_diy/acorn_cnc_controller.html > > For the basic, get you hooked, system that's not a bad price. But some of > the accessories clearly have a 10,000% markup. Why should a conductive > touch probe cost $800 when I can make one with 50 cents worth of wire, a > 1/2" square piece of PCB material worth a dime and 1/4" of solder? And its > repeatable to .0002" or better. Boggles my mind. > > > And a link to a version of LinuxCNC 2.8.2 (or latest) with a HAL/INI file > > specifically set up for that hardware. Literally install OS from .iso > > and there's a desktop ICON to run LCNC for that hardware. > > > > But going back up to the LCNC supported hardware link it turns out > there's > > almost nothing available for LCNC Ethernet control other than the MESA > > boards. So maybe that's also why MACH3/4 and the ACORN are so > > successful. > > > > Anyway, something to think about for the new year. > > John > > Cheers, Gene Heskett. > -- > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: > soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." > -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940) > If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable. > - Louis D. Brandeis > Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Emc-users mailing list > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users > _______________________________________________ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
