wow - that was a walk down memory lane.. JohnK, JonE and Peter all posted in those threads...
On Mon, Dec 27, 2021 at 7:16 PM Sam Sokolik <samco...@gmail.com> wrote: > Hmm - I mean - if you want to do a ton of reading - you can watch the > journey... This was a big project because it originally was 2.5 axis > hydraulic servos. > > > https://www.cnczone.com/forums/linuxcnc-formerly-emc2-/25929-large-brushed-servo-setup-cheap-wip.html > then > > https://www.cnczone.com/forums/vertical-mill-lathe-project-log/111124-large-kearney-amp-trecker-hmc-conversion.html > > On Mon, Dec 27, 2021 at 6:34 PM John Dammeyer <jo...@autoartisans.com> > wrote: > >> Web Link? >> >> > From: Sam Sokolik [mailto:samco...@gmail.com] >> > >> > Lol.. let me do that again... >> > >> > The Kearney and Trecker has at least 96 i\o and 5+ analog axis. >> Everything >> > (and I mean everything) is controlled within LinuxCNC using classic >> ladder, >> > Hal and one poorly written realtime component to do the spindle >> shifting. >> > Been 100% stable for years. >> > >> > Sam >> > >> > On Mon, Dec 27, 2021, 5:35 PM Sam Sokolik <samco...@gmail.com> wrote: >> > >> > > The Kearney and trecker >> > > >> > > On Mon, Dec 27, 2021, 5:33 PM Feral Engineer < >> theferalengin...@gmail.com> >> > > wrote: >> > > >> > >> The pay walls, axis limits and markups on accessories are the >> reasons I >> > >> avoided centroid. >> > >> >> > >> The thing I love most about Linuxcnc is the flexibility, reliability >> and >> > >> yes, classicladder - or at least ladder based plc in general, which >> makes >> > >> it incredibly easy to figure out for someone with an industrial >> > >> electronics >> > >> background. I do miss some of the functionality of industrial >> controls >> > >> inside of LinuxCNC that I think should be implemented, but all in >> all, >> > >> it's >> > >> an incredible tool. >> > >> >> > >> I do think that in order for it to gain traction, it needs some more >> > >> "black >> > >> box" usability, though. As an example, an input sniffer to assign >> hal pins >> > >> to button presses on a game controller or hardware buttons on a Mesa >> card >> > >> would be kinda cool to implement. >> > >> >> > >> Phil T. >> > >> The Feral Engineer >> > >> >> > >> Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at >> > >> www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer >> > >> >> > >> Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction: >> > >> www.patreon.com/theferalengineer >> > >> >> > >> On Mon, Dec 27, 2021, 4:38 PM gene heskett <ghesk...@shentel.net> >> wrote: >> > >> >> > >> > On Sunday, December 26, 2021 1:30:42 PM EST John Dammeyer wrote: >> > >> > > Hi Mark, >> > >> > > I'll summarize your basic premise here that all machines are >> > >> different. >> > >> > > That's true! >> > >> > > >> > >> > > And MACH2/3/4 has a huge user base without ever needing a >> command line >> > >> > > editor. So if it can be done for Windows then certainly it can >> be >> > >> done >> > >> > > for LCNC. >> > >> > > >> > >> > > Having said that I'm also not suggesting we do away with the >> > >> underbelly >> > >> > of >> > >> > > what is LCNC. Please recall my original post in this subject. >> The >> > >> > > ACORN based system cannot run an old iron system with existing >> servo >> > >> > > drives. It's likely it can't even run a system with a STMBL >> drive >> > >> that >> > >> > > faults on low power supply voltage which mine does because I >> have a >> > >> soft >> > >> > > start delay on mine so ENABLE shows up before the Voltage is >> there. >> > >> > > Doesn't look like it can even do step/dir for the spindle (which >> MACH3 >> > >> > > can). So there is a place for the 'raw' LinuxCNC install and >> HAL/INI >> > >> > > file model. >> > >> > > >> > >> > > But that user I mentioned wasn't interested in learning a new OS >> and >> > >> the >> > >> > > ACORN was a one stop shop for the Ethernet controlled >> step/dir/VFD/IO >> > >> > > board and windows CNC software. He went with Clearpath Servos >> so he >> > >> > > wasn't adverse to spending money. He could just as easily have >> > >> installed >> > >> > > LCNC 2.8.2 and the MESA board with terminal strips and used the >> config >> > >> > > screens in AXIS and I suspect for less money. But the LinuxOS >> itself >> > >> > > appeared to also scare him away so he likely would never be a >> user. >> > >> > > >> > >> > > I think everyone who likes using an editor for configuration and >> > >> issuing >> > >> > > multiple commands with a command line interface has already been >> > >> brought >> > >> > > over to the dark side so to speak. They aren't the market for >> > >> expanding >> > >> > > the LCNC user base. >> > >> > > >> > >> > > I've attached a screen shot of something I've been playing >> with. Took >> > >> > > about an hour to write using a modern GUI based software >> development >> > >> > > tool; in this case Lazarus Free Pascal. The TCanvas Property >> has all >> > >> > > sorts of drawing tools so I thought I'd take a quick look at the >> Axis >> > >> > > source code. To see how easy it would be to port over the >> Preview >> > >> screen >> > >> > > to Pascal. >> > >> > > >> > >> > > I was immediately reminded of something I written many years ago >> by >> > >> > > Nicholas Wirth the author of Pascal. "Those who learn Fortran as >> > >> their >> > >> > > first language are brain damaged for life". Rather harsh >> actually and >> > >> > > taken out of context appears elitist . OTOH, 4195 lines of >> > >> essentially >> > >> > > undocumented python code does look like a lot of the Fortran >> code the >> > >> > > Electrical Engineers were writing in University while we in the >> Comp >> > >> Sci. >> > >> > > stream were writing in structured languages Algol-68. And those >> were >> > >> not >> > >> > > for GUI type interfaces which add to complexity. >> > >> > > >> > >> > > For example: >> > >> > > if o.canon: >> > >> > > x = (o.canon.min_extents[0] + o.canon.max_extents[0])/2 >> > >> > > y = (o.canon.min_extents[1] + o.canon.max_extents[1])/2 >> > >> > > z = (o.canon.min_extents[2] + o.canon.max_extents[2])/2 >> > >> > > o.set_centerpoint(x, y, z) >> > >> > > >> > >> > > If you go searching for o.cannon you find: >> > >> > > o.canon = canon = AxisCanon(o, widgets.text, i, progress, >> > >> arcdivision) >> > >> > > >> > >> > > Search for AxisCAnon and we find the object definition: >> > >> > > class AxisCanon(GLCanon, StatMixin): >> > >> > > >> > >> > > Now we're into the include side of things where the rs274 >> library is >> > >> > > needed: from rs274.interpret import StatMixin >> > >> > > from rs274.glcanon import GLCanon, GlCanonDraw >> > >> > > >> > >> > > which takes us to here: >> > >> > > >> https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/blob/master/lib/python/rs274/ >> > >> > glcanon. >> > >> > > py which is another 1886 lines of undocumented code. >> > >> > > >> > >> > > The excuses that will be made for no documentation will be the >> same >> > >> ones >> > >> > > given for command line operation of Linux and LCNC. It's much >> better >> > >> > > than windows or it's self documenting. You just have to learn a >> few >> > >> > > commands and you can do so much more than with windows........ >> > >> > > >> > >> > > I believe we need to step outside the box and ask ourselves this >> > >> > question. >> > >> > > How can we attract more people who just want simple CNC (maybe >> > >> without >> > >> > > limit switches even), a VFD and encoder on the spindle and >> possibly >> > >> > > coolant or a few other outputs. >> > >> > > >> > >> > > One really simple way is that the companies (or people) building >> the >> > >> > > intelligent CNC controls like the MESA change their web sites to >> have >> > >> at >> > >> > > least one menu choice for "SimpleCNC". >> > >> > > >> > >> > > I went here: >> > >> > > >> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?LinuxCNC_Supported_Hardware >> > >> > > >> > >> > > Eventually with more Google searching I ended up here: >> > >> > > http://store.mesanet.com/index.php?route=product/ >> > >> > product&product_id=290&se >> > >> > > arch=7i76e >> > >> > >> > >> > That is a very nice board, I use 2 of them myself, but not in the E >> > >> > version. I use the much cheaper parport version. Why? I refuse to >> give >> > >> up >> > >> > my only ethernet port just to carve metal. The net access is much >> much >> > >> > more >> > >> > useful to me. >> > >> > >> > >> > > That link to the page I think would be best right at the top of >> the >> > >> MESA >> > >> > > site. And on that page should be a link to a page with a >> pictorial >> > >> > > connection diagram like: >> > >> > > >> https://www.centroidcnc.com/centroid_diy/acorn_cnc_controller.html >> > >> > >> > >> > For the basic, get you hooked, system that's not a bad price. But >> some >> > >> of >> > >> > the accessories clearly have a 10,000% markup. Why should a >> conductive >> > >> > touch probe cost $800 when I can make one with 50 cents worth of >> wire, a >> > >> > 1/2" square piece of PCB material worth a dime and 1/4" of solder? >> And >> > >> its >> > >> > repeatable to .0002" or better. Boggles my mind. >> > >> > >> > >> > > And a link to a version of LinuxCNC 2.8.2 (or latest) with a >> HAL/INI >> > >> file >> > >> > > specifically set up for that hardware. Literally install OS >> from .iso >> > >> > > and there's a desktop ICON to run LCNC for that hardware. >> > >> > > >> > >> > > But going back up to the LCNC supported hardware link it turns >> out >> > >> > there's >> > >> > > almost nothing available for LCNC Ethernet control other than >> the MESA >> > >> > > boards. So maybe that's also why MACH3/4 and the ACORN are so >> > >> > > successful. >> > >> > > >> > >> > > Anyway, something to think about for the new year. >> > >> > > John >> > >> > >> > >> > Cheers, Gene Heskett. >> > >> > -- >> > >> > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: >> > >> > soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." >> > >> > -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940) >> > >> > If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law >> > >> respectable. >> > >> > - Louis D. Brandeis >> > >> > Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene> >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > >> > Emc-users mailing list >> > >> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net >> > >> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users >> > >> > >> > >> >> > >> _______________________________________________ >> > >> Emc-users mailing list >> > >> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net >> > >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users >> > >> >> > > >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Emc-users mailing list >> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net >> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Emc-users mailing list >> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users >> > _______________________________________________ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
