----[Please read http://ercoupers.com/disclaimer.htm before following any
advice in this forum.]----
This was great, thank you both! Just a couple of final questions:
1. I assume the lexan referred to by Hartmut is the same a
polycabonate referred to by Ed. Is this correct?
2. Ed said "I used a shoe string to hold the windows 3-4 inches
apart to keep them from sliding down rather than using the window
tighteners which sometimes crack the Plexiglas." I'm not sure I'm
following this. Hold what windows apart? Where is the window
tightener?
3. Hartmut, does the 19-3/4" x 31-1/4" allow the windows to touch, so
my 6" (or so) center piece (sun shade?) can be eliminated?
4. I was anticipating the following process:
a. Remove interior covers that prevent leaning into
windows.
b. Check if structure is scratching old windows and
modify, if so.
c. Take windows out by unscrewing the cover plate that is either on
top of the front or rear channel. Pull one window side through
that opening all the way and that clears the other side too (as
Hartmut describes).
d. Remove the old window and measured for the width and reuse the
end hardware. (Being careful about the orientation, per Ed.)
e. Remove welting by removing sheet metal screws or rivets;
f. Add new channel material making sure I understand the way they
go in. The window slides on the woven material, NOT on the
leather like welt. (per Hartmut);
g. Install new windows, constantly checking for clearance in the
side fuselage structure.
Is this about right?
5. How much did the windows and welt cost? Is Univar the source for
the welting? I would assume any plastics shop can supply, cut and
drill the Lexan.
Thanks!
Kim Blackseth
N2332H
On Nov 4, 2006, at 5:37 PM, Hartmut Beil wrote:
Hi all.
Coincidence. I replaced my side windows today because one window
cracked
badly when I leaned into the plane while the window was not all the
way
down. So I am at my third set now.
I measured mine, this is what I have as dimensions: 19 3/4 x 31
1/4 inches.
I got my plane with the sun shade as well and I did not like it
because it
blocks the entry and the view due to the overlapping hardware.
If I really wanted a sun shade, I'd make it half the size and would
just
move it to the side where the sun is coming from. For the midday
sun, I use
my trusty baseball cap.
After I took the sun shade out, I realized that the side windows
were not
long enough to close fully and I could not find the original
dimensions
online, so I ended up feeding the Univair guys. They then sent me
Lexan
sheets in the above dimensions in a nice box. They box stuff up
nice at
Univair. The box I still have - the sheets were scratched up right
when I
put them in. The same story as Eds. I did not know that the windows
are
fitted very tight between the seat structure. The side covers that
protect
the windows, so you don't lean against them when you snug into the
plane,
these side covers don't go all the way down as the windows do.
There is a lug on each side that is supposed to be attached to the
seat
structure and these lugs were shot on mine. So I got the window in,
but not
as easy up again and when I finally had it out , the lower part of the
window was ruined. This is the part you look through when flying.
Darn. Make sure that the windows clear easily before putting them
in. (see
attached picture)
Changing the window felts requires removing these mentioned covers.
They
were attached by the factory with some tiny sheet metal screws, on
mine they
are riveted in place. That makes a hard removal. But after you have
them
out, the window channels are easily to work at.
When you buy new channel material make sure you understand the way
they go
in. The window slides on the woven material, NOT on the leather
like welt. I
learned that the hard way.
Last but not least , Lexan or Plexi - an open question. For the
beginner is
Lexan the best. When I worked with Plexiglas, I was amazed how
easily it
breaks away. You need special drills there I would agree. Not so
Lexan.
Lexan flexes better. But it scratches easier and yellows faster. I
am taking
pictures out of the side windows. The yellowed, scratched up Lexan
is no
help here.
Then again it seems like I keep replacing these windows every few
years, so
why bother? If only the plexi would not crack that easily..
Oh and you get the windows out by unscrewing the cover plate that
is either
on top of the front or rear channel. Pull one window side through that
opening all the way, that clears the other side too.
Hartmut
N3330H
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Burkhead" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'Kim Blackseth'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "Ctech"
<[email protected]>
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 12:59 AM
Subject: [COUPERS-TECH] Ercoupe side windows
----[Please read http://ercoupers.com/disclaimer.htm before
following any
advice in this forum.]----
Kim asked:
The side windows in my ship are pretty scratched up. A previous
owner replaced the front and rear glass, but not the side plastic.
I'm going to try some plastic cleaner tomorrow, but I expect to have
to replace them. My questions are:
1. Is there any trick to replacing the welting and side windows? I
do not need an A&P, do I?
2. Can I eliminate the center shade piece? It just gets in my way
getting in the plane. Do the side windows go up a touch if the shade
is gone?
Kim,
This is a good mechanical question that'd best be posted on the
TECH list
rather than asking me, directly. I'm not any kind of mechanic.
This is,
however, a question that most new Coupe owners need to ask sooner or
later.
I can't give you the length of the side windows when the center
panel is
not
used.
Nor can I tell you useful information about doing the window
welt. My
non-Coupe-knowledgeable A&P/AI managed it on his first try, as I
recall.
But I've heard reports of problems from others.
Plexiglas is a bit more brittle, but it resists scratching a bit
better.
If
at all possible, go through the structure around the window's down
position
and try to ensure that it doesn't ever rub against the window.
Then you
get
few, if any, new scratches.
When I replaced my windows the last time, I had a good set of
scratches
within days - because I had not fixed the structure causing the
scratches.
Some people recommend polycarbonate. Polycarbonate is much less
brittle
but
it is softer and scratches more easily. When I tried a polycarbonate
panel,
I got visual ripples, even with no sun glasses. I've heard from
casual
sources that polycarbonate is not an authorized material and this is
probably why, if so.
Also, I like to fly with polarized sun glasses to eliminate or
minimize
reflections from inside the plane. That's OK with Plexiglas but I
got
funny
color patterns when using the polarized sun glasses through
polycarbonate.
After a couple weeks, I had the mechanic make that window again with
Plexiglas.
Lots of owners make their own windows. The old window can be
measured for
the width but it'd be better if someone posted the exact, optimal
width.
You'd normally reuse the end hardware. (Be careful about the
orientation.)
I've heard there are special drill bits for drilling Plexiglas. I
think
I've heard that an alternative is to use a somewhat dull bit but
I'd urge
you to Google drilling Plexiglas and you should get good info.
I personally don't like the sun shade at all. I was always quite
happy
having my sun shade attached to my head on the front of my
baseball cap.
That way it would move out of my line of sight and could be
accurately
positioned to block the sun while I looked for aircraft around it.
Leaving the two windows a few inches apart increased the airflow
through
the
cabin vent sufficiently that I was comfortable in bright sun. Of
course,
if
it's REALLY hot, you can open the cabin windows WAY far. I used a
shoe
string to hold the windows 3-4 inches apart to keep them from
sliding down
rather than using the window tighteners which sometimes crack the
Plexiglas.
Be sure that you close the windows for the actual take off and
initial
climb
on hot days - you're already having too much performance loss to
give away
even the small amount lost from windows open operation. It's
generally
thought that you lose about 5 mph at cruise speed from having the
windows
full open. You lose a bit of fuselage lift, too. We're only talking
about
a minute or three for the takeoff roll and initial climb out so
you won't
melt, even on the hottest desert day.
I'll echo this response to the TECH list so you can get more info and
correct any of my mistakes.
Best wishes,
======================================================================
======
==
To leave this forum go to: http://ercoupers.com/lists.htm
<window-problem.jpg>
==============================================================================
To leave this forum go to: http://ercoupers.com/lists.htm
