I would re-ask the question to Mr. Norris (who knows more about SP than anyone else) limiting the question to SP flight tests.
What he quotes, I believe, applies to taking a private pilot test in a Coupe. Jerry E. -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of fnelson913 Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 4:32 PM To: [email protected] Subject: [ercoupe-tech] Re: endorsements and limitations Here are excerpts from previous postings on the topic of Ercoupe (without rudder pedals) restrictions on pilot certificates. ---------------------------------------------------------- This is what my local DPE has to say on this topic: Answer: The commentor is correct. There is no regulation that refers to two vs. three-axis controls. There is also no regulation that specifies that an applicant taking a practical test must do a "steep turn," and that the satisfactory parameters are "plus or minus 100 feet, 45 degree bank, plus or minus 10 knots," etc. However, even though no regulation specifies what the parameters are, the FAA says if you don't meet those parameters in the Practical Test Standards (PTS), you don't get your pilot certificate. Likewise, the PTS says that the applicant must do "slips to a landing." The Ercoupe can't do slips. Therefore, an applicant who takes a test in an Ercoupe cannot do all the specified maneuvers that are required by the PTS, and the FAA could say that NO test may be taken in the Ercoupe, period. In fact, this was the FAA's position for a short period of time. Then reason prevailed, and the FAA changed it's mind and said, "O.K., you may take your practical test in an Ercoupe, but since you can't do all the required PTS items, you are limited to flying only the Ercoupe after completing the test." ---------------------------------------------------------- This what I got from Joe Norris from the EAA: The issue with taking a practical test in an Ercoupe without rudder pedals is not directly addressed in the regulations themselves. To find the answer, one must look in the guidance that an FAA inspector or Designated Pilot Examiner (DPE) would use when performing practical tests and issuing pilot certifiates. This guidance is found in FAA Order 8710.3E, Change 1, titled "Designated Pilot and Flight Engineer Examiners' Handbook". In Chapter 5, Section 1, item number 7E, titled "Aircraft Limitations", the following verbiage appears: E. Aircraft Limitations. A limitation will be placed on an applicant's pilot certificate if the applicant provides an aircraft that has operating characteristics that preclude it from performing all the tasks required during the practical test (per 14 CFR ยง 61.45(b)(2)). However, this situation and the kind of aircraft to be used must be specifically identified and approved by the FAA, General Aviation and Commercial Division, AFS-800, at 800 Independence Avenue SW., Washington, DC 20591 (phone: (202) 267-8212) on a case-by-case basis. (1) For the record, AFS-800 generally disapproves the use of such aircraft, but it may grant approval on a case-by-case basis. (2) For example, in the past, AFS-800 has approved the Ercoupe 415 series airplanes for use in a practical test. Persons seeking to use an Ercoupe 415 series airplane for a practical test would receive the limitation LIMITED TO ERCOUPE 415 SERIES WITHOUT RUDDER PEDALS. As you can see from reading the above, the issue isn't specifically the fact that the aircraft doesn't have rudder pedals. The issue is that the aircraft cannot perform all the tasks required by the practical test. The lack of rudder pedals specifically effects the ability of the aircraft do perform forward slips, which is a required task on the practical test. The aircraft also cannot perform the required stalls. Thus, the pilot performs a practical test in the Ercoupe without rudder pedals will be restricted to flying only Ercoupes without rudder pedals until such time as he/she performs a practical test in an aircraft that is capable of performing all the required maneuvers. Let me know if you have any further questions. Joe Norris EAA Aviation Services 888-322-4636, extension 6806 www.eaa.org ---------------------------------------------------------- Frank Nelson
