Consider, I just put in a 11.655kW system that covers ~59.9sq meters. I could
have easily doubled that sizeIt will generate ~50kWh/day (~18,000kWh/year
[using PVWatts v5 and System Advisory Monitor)That convenience store could have
a double/triple or larger PV array, some battery banks, say 28kWh or so and
generate a bit of business from both charging vehicles and as a node in a VPP
to be used for FCAS ancillary services (Frequency control n such.I see a nice
business model for extra cash as the DER grows (distributed energy resources)
On Friday, December 14, 2018, 11:59:17 AM EST, Peri Hartman via EV
<ev@lists.evdl.org> wrote:
Even for gas cars, that's an extreme range. Most, I think, have a range
from 300-400 miles. Apparently people are content with that.
I'm sure that some EVs will have the option for enormous range, such as
600 miles per charge. But will people buy them? My guess is most people
would rather pay less for the car and settle for, say, 300 mile range.
As many have stated here, that's adequate for just about anything
imaginable in a day. And for the one or two times a year you need to go
more than 300 miles in a day, well, you stop and charge once or twice.
Even outside this list, I think people will realize that.
So, I don't think we'll have a crisis of needing to support a high usage
of 150kWh in one hour. We will, however need to support a large number
of sessions at 50-75kWh in one hour or less. Even that could put a load
on some distribution systems, though I don't think it's that bad.
Consider, out in the "middle of nowhere". A convenience store uses about
50kW on average and there are likely several businesses each consuming
something in that range. And there might be 4 or 5 charge points.
Overall, the load on the distribution system might double or triple. And
if we're talking about adding EV service to a small town, the
distribution system will probably already handle the load.
But, yes, I agree with Peter that utilities will need to plan for better
distribution.
Peri
------ Original Message ------
From: "Peter Eckhoff via EV" <ev@lists.evdl.org>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.evdl.org>
Cc: "Peter Eckhoff" <evd...@gmail.com>
Sent: 14-Dec-18 8:35:24 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Toyota dealers say there is no sale$ demand.us
forEVs
>If current batteries have around 215 whr/kg and Amprius's new battery
>which
>maybe rated as much as 435 whr/kg (if in the same volume), a Model 3
>with a
>300 mile range could conceivably have a 600 mile range and a Bolt could
>have a 480 mile range. At 60 miles per hour, the max range occurs at
>about
>10 hours and 8 hours of driving, respectively. Basically, a full day
>of
>driving with no pit stops for a meal and/or personal weight adjustment.
>
>But if you want to press on for another 10 or 8 hours, I've timed a
>family
>pit stop at about 30 minutes and add to that the time it would take to
>do
>an ICE refuel at a semi-busy set of interstate pumps, you have a
>minimum of
>40 minutes that could be used to recharge an EV. Let's make it an
>hour.
>
>For an hour full recharge, a Model 3 and Bolt would need 150 and 120
>kwhrs. At 480 volts, that's 312 amp-hours; a bit much. But spread
>that
>over a good night's sleep, shower, breakfast, repacking, checkout, etc.
>for
>a total of 14 hours, that's 22 amp-hours which is not unreasonable or
>10
>hours at 32 amps.
>
>A trip from Omaha to Rapid City, SD is 524 miles and taking a side trip
>to
>Fossil Bed State Park is completely doable with no range anxiety; maybe
>a
>slight top off for a Bolt at Wall or one of the other small towns along
>the
>way.
>
>The biggest hurdle will be the generation, storage, and distribution of
>the
>energy to recharging points.
>
>Has anyone read what the utilities are planning on doing?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>On Fri, Dec 14, 2018 at 9:08 AM Collin Kidder via EV
><ev@lists.evdl.org>
>wrote:
>
>>On Thu, Dec 13, 2018 at 7:43 PM Lee Hart via EV <ev@lists.evdl.org>
>>wrote:
>> >
>> > If fast charging is so vital, how come the market isn't flooded with
>> > fast chargers for cellphones, laptops, power tools, and all our
>>other
>> > battery-operated toys?
>>
>>?!?!?!?! Umm.... IT IS. The market most certainly is packed full with
>>fast chargers for cellphones. They all advertise how their new 9v wall
>>wart and cable will charge your phone up like 80% in 45 minutes or
>>some such thing. Companies like Samsung have specifically built fast
>>charging into their premium phones. Likewise on power tools. As you
>>might expect, people doing construction burn through batteries on
>>portable tools. So, those chargers tend to be quite fast also - they
>>even have thermal management but only in the form of "we won't charge
>>this battery until it's not hot anymore." Laptops don't tend to have
>>super fast chargers because you can usually use them plugged in anyway
>>so the battery ends up being more like a built-in UPS.
>>
>>So, yeah, fast charging most certainly exists where there is a use
>>case for it. I can see the draw of fast charging for electric cars
>>too. It's true that 90% of the time you don't need it and can charge
>>slowly at home. But, as EVs become more prevalent there will be cases
>>where people have nothing else. In that case if you have to drive 700
>>miles somewhere then you need some fast chargers. I think the biggest
>>draw for fast chargers are that they fill the gap we currently have
>>where you can recharge quickly with gasoline (only maybe 4 minutes)
>>but you can't do that in an EV. So, people are used to filling up
>>quickly and want to retain that. This is mostly psychological but you
>>can't discount that. Psychological issues are very real and saying
>>"just charge at home" doesn't cut it. People aren't looking for your
>>alternatives, they're looking for ways to do what they want to do.
>>There are many people who won't get an EV until they feel like they
>>can charge it back up anywhere and quickly. Until then they've got
>>their gas guzzler that can do that.
>>_______________________________________________
>>UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
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>>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
>>
>>
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